Zimmerman: Self defense or murder? - Page 51

Zimmerman: Self defense or murder?

This is a discussion on Zimmerman: Self defense or murder? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by reyno626 Some people are stating that Zimmerman was attacked from behind. The girl who was on the phone with Martin stated that ...

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  1. #751
    Member Array stancehold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by reyno626 View Post
    Some people are stating that Zimmerman was attacked from behind. The girl who was on the phone with Martin stated that the two guys actually exchanged dialog. I suppose it's a word-versus-word situation, but I'm not sure the "attacked from behind" argument can be regarded as fact at this time.
    It cannot be proven or disproved. That is the problem!


  2. #752
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    Quote Originally Posted by reyno626 View Post
    Some people are stating that Zimmerman was attacked from behind. The girl who was on the phone with Martin stated that the two guys actually exchanged dialog. I suppose it's a word-versus-word situation, but I'm not sure the "attacked from behind" argument can be regarded as fact at this time.
    Who is saying that? Where? In print? Which news outlet? Internet chat? Blog? Some people are always saying something, which sometimes by accident turns out to be true.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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  3. #753
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    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Spuk View Post
    ...
    The above is strictly my own opinion. I learned this stuff from watching every episode of LAW & ORDER... twice.
    You had to, you consulted on the show...
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  4. #754
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    Folks, I jumped in and did a bunch of edits and a few deletes due to what I considered inappropriate comments with certain overtones that we cannot and do not tolerate at DC. Keep those out of here or I'll send in the Marines.

  5. #755
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    I'd like to know if there are any airial photo's of the scene. I'm curious of how far the neighborhood watch guy's truck was from the scene of the shooting. And how far away is the home where the Kid was visiting from the shooting scene. I've mentioned proximity being a big part of a shooting investigation in other threads, this is an example.

  6. #756
    Member Array stancehold's Avatar
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    Secret Spuk,

    Did you see that the police stated several times in their information releases on Feb. 29th and March 12th that the investigation was ongoing? How did you figure that the investigation was completed in less than a couple of days or a week?

  7. #757
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock and Glock View Post
    Folks, I jumped in and did a bunch of edits and a few deletes due to what I considered inappropriate comments with certain overtones that we cannot and do not tolerate at DC. Keep those out of here or I'll send in the Marines.
    Seriously... THANK YOU!!!

  8. #758
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    Whew, what a lot postings since the last time I logged on! A hot issue and on national news now.

    One thing I've learned from having a CCW since I was 21 (now been over 30 years since) is that you really have to be careful about how having a gun can influence what you decide to do. Have to be smart about it. When I was younger, I think I might have had more of a stand your ground mentality rather than thinking about any other available options to avoid lethal use of force. It's almost like you have to first think/make decisions as if you did not have a gun until absolutely no choice. For instance, why go into a high crime area at night if you can avoid it? Or should I use pepper spray instead of a gun? (by the way, also carrying pepper spray gives you options depending on the threat level)

    I think Zimmerman's thinking was influenced by his ability to legally carry a firearm. If Zimmerman did not have a gun on his person and was conducting the neighborhood watch from his vehicle, I think he would have simply called in a report to 911 and driven away if he had to retreat (a car can be used as a weapon too). I kind of doubt if he would have pursued a confrontation if he was unarmed. Also, did Zimmerman actively participate in the neighborhood watch because he had a CCW and was armed? If so, I'd think it was an improper application of the right and privilege of having a CCW. It's really for personal safety and not intended for public safety, which is LE's role. The gated community association could be liable in a lawsuit if it was aware that he was armed while conducting the neighborhood watch and permitted it.

    Not trying to judge this incident but just trying to take a lesson from it.
    WyoShooter and AAA like this.

  9. #759
    Member Array stancehold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Spuk View Post
    I'd like to know if there are any airial photo's of the scene. I'm curious of how far the neighborhood watch guy's truck was from the scene of the shooting. And how far away is the home where the Kid was visiting from the shooting scene. I've mentioned proximity being a big part of a shooting investigation in other threads, this is an example.
    I've heard 2 news reports ... 1 stating that the shooting occurred 70 yds away from M's dad's fiance's home, the other 100 yards. Heard these on the news. Can look for links to verify if needed.

    Edited to add that I'm totally unsure if these reports are correct. I'm doubtful of accuracy of nearly all news reports at this point.

  10. #760
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    Those of you bringing the promise of future race riots into this... is it going to be Blacks vs Hispanics? Zimmerman is Hispanic. Is it going to be black on white, because the press is callin' Z a white hispanic?

    What's it going to be? Do I put on the garlic necklace, or put mirrors all around or what... silver bullets?
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  11. #761
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    Those of you bringing the promise of future race riots into this... is it going to be Blacks vs Hispanics? Zimmerman is Hispanic. Is it going to be black on white, because the press is callin' Z a white hispanic?

    What's it going to be? Do I put on the garlic necklace, or put mirrors all around or what... silver bullets?
    Generally rioters are just looking for a reason to tear stuff up. I suspect it will be idiots on inanimate objects for the most part.
    It's the Land of Opportunity, not the Land of Entitlements - Vote America!!!

    "When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny." Thomas Jefferson

    You are only paranoid until you are right - then you are a visionary.

  12. #762
    VIP Member Array Secret Spuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stancehold View Post
    Secret Spuk,

    Did you see that the police stated several times in their information releases on Feb. 29th and March 12th that the investigation was ongoing? How did you figure that the investigation was completed in less than a couple of days or a week?
    I may be wrong... but I believe the police called is justified, as self defense, and there was no evidence to contradict neighborhood watch guys story. IMO they had made up their minds, and the case was only open as a matter of course. The case couldnt be completely closed until a grand jury finding or a states attorney's refusal to prosicute.

    IMO The police were presenting a justified homicide for consideration. I am angry about this case. Neighborhood watch guy is IMO a moron... in reality he is who he is... But there is absoloutly no excuse for the police to not do a complete investigation. Even if to just cover themselves. I'm hard on the cops... because for the greater part of my life I was the cops.

  13. #763
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    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Spuk View Post
    I may be wrong... but I believe the police called is justified, as self defense, and there was no evidence to contradict neighborhood watch guys story. IMO they had made up their minds, and the case was only open as a matter of course. The case couldnt be completely closed until a grand jury finding or a states attorney's refusal to prosicute.
    No, just that there was no evidence that it wasn't self defense and that investigation was ongoing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Secret Spuk View Post
    IMO The police were presenting a justified homicide for consideration. I am angry about this case. Neighborhood watch guy is IMO a moron... in reality he is who he is... But there is absoloutly no excuse for the police to not do a complete investigation. Even if to just cover themselves. I'm hard on the cops... because for the greater part of my life I was the cops.
    I understand, but how do they produce evidence they cannot find? The 911 caller recording reporting the beating agreed with that portion of Z's report (on bottom being beaten by M and screaming for help). Injuries agreed with report. They wouldn't have a coroner's report for several days, at least. Incident happened in the rain ... possible evidence washed away? How would you charge with a crime without some type of evidence of a crime at that point? He was treated by EMS at the scene, taken to the station, interviewed and probably recorded and photographed. They had nothing to charge at that time. What should they have done with the facts and evidence they found? We don't know every detail of evidence, but I would think that a death would warrant checking the details before releasing anyone.

  14. #764
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    More hate press, with links to more hate press in it...

    This is what we have to fear...

    Huffpost article/blog
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  15. #765
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    CNN is doing a big report right now.
    "Confidence is food for the wise man but liquor for the fool"

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