Printing question???

This is a discussion on Printing question??? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Ram Rod No matter how lenient the laws are in your location pertaining to concealed or open carry, I say at least ...

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  1. #16
    Member Array Adameeski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ram Rod View Post
    No matter how lenient the laws are in your location pertaining to concealed or open carry, I say at least do your best when it comes to concealing. After all, if you can't conceal well, you may as well open carry. Printing is like doing a lousy job at work. The hap-hazard attitude is part of what's wrong with this country and our kids today. If I was a law enforcement officer and saw someone printing while (attempting) to carry concealed....I'd go out of my way to hassle them. Pull them aside, ask for ID, CC permit, etc....... Might also give them a sobriety test just to get another ten minutes or so out of their busy day. That's just me, and it's only my opinion. None of you should take it personal. But you just might give it some thought.
    Not sure what we're up to, but I think it is Quadruple WOW or Quintuple WOW!! That sounds like a serious 14th Amendment violation.
    ...Adam

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  3. #17
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    Dang, Ram Rod . . . I hope you washed that foot before you shoved it into your mouth. That's a pretty cynical statement.

    OP, check your state laws in regard to concealed carry and the manner of. FL laws only requires the firearm to be "concealed from ordinary view." No reference is made anywhere as to printing. A big gun under a skintight tee mat not be the bightest move, but there's no FL law specificly stating it's illegal carry.
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  4. #18
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
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    Haven't really got a straight-forward answer to this yet :/

    OC is legal in Wisconsin, CC is legal with a permit, so why would it be a deal to print while concealing?

    I have a full size M&P so it really isn't the easiest to conceal.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  5. #19
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Dang, Ram Rod . . . I hope you washed that foot before you shoved it into your mouth. That's a pretty cynical statement.

    OP, check your state laws in regard to concealed carry and the manner of. FL laws only requires the firearm to be "concealed from ordinary view." No reference is made anywhere as to printing. A big gun under a skintight tee mat not be the bightest move, but there's no FL law specificly stating it's illegal carry.
    Thanks, I'll try to look it up.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  6. #20
    Distinguished Member Array ericb327's Avatar
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    I know that OC is not legal in your car in Wisconsin.
    For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill. (Sun Tzu) The Art of War

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  7. #21
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ericb327 View Post
    I know that OC is not legal in your car in Wisconsin.
    It is legal, you just cannot have it on you and it cannot be within the reach of any driver or passenger I believe, however putting it on the dash/back seat is somehow OK according to a deputy. But yes, you can not openly carry it (on your person) in a car, it has to be covered if you CC.

    EDIT: It also cannot be loaded if it's open carry from what I know.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  8. #22
    Distinguished Member Array ericb327's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burns View Post
    It is legal, you just cannot have it on you and it cannot be within the reach of any driver or passenger I believe, however putting it on the dash/back seat is somehow OK according to a deputy. But yes, you can not openly carry it (on your person) in a car, it has to be covered if you CC.

    EDIT: It also cannot be loaded if it's open carry from what I know.
    No offense to any LEOs on this board but I would not take their advice when it comes to carry laws. I think, almost positive you received bad info. Here is a good link.
    OpenCarry.org - State Information For Wisconsin
    For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill. (Sun Tzu) The Art of War

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  9. #23
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Well, maybe I can try to put this another way. Is there a difference between concealed carry and open carry? If you're printing then are you actually carrying concealed? Do you need to worry about printing as far as the laws are concerned in your area? Maybe, maybe not. Remember, legalities are challenged frequently in the courts. Surely you can find your jurisdiction's laws pertaining to concealed and the definition thereof. Laws and ordinances can change among town and cities just like I researched about in Kansas when I open carried there even though my Arkansas permit allowed me to carry concealed in the state and Missouri as well. So......the OP's question does raise some concern with me. If you get in the habit of not being concerned with printing, you won't be concealing well. If you want to go to a reciprocal state where concealed carry is only allowed with your permit, then you won't be able to do it since you cannot conceal. Should you "worry" about printing? In your area maybe the law doesn't clearly define this or maybe nobody really cares. In this case, use your own judgement. If I can see you printing then you're not concealing. My state's laws only allow concealed carry at this time. Kansas does not require a permit for open carry in most of the state, but does for concealed carry as far as I know right now and some places in Kansas didn't allow open carry when I was there. Legalities put aside in your case........I'm giving you my best advice since you're family here. Whether or not you "need" to worry about printing when carrying concealed in your location is one thing. I am simply conveying the message to you that any time you carry concealed you SHOULD worry about it. Clear as mud? I tend to over explain things sometimes. Reasons why I do this is not to bore you, it's to cover all the bases and leave fewer questions down the road. Can I ask a silly question here? Should you "worry about" who becomes our next president?
    Oh....and the 14th amendment? You do know all of your rights can be taken away by executive order at any time right? Besides......you'll have to prove your rights have been violated and intentionally.
    Arguments about open carry got into this thread as well. I can address this as well while we're here. You need to cover your pistol when open carrying or you need a holster that's better at retention than you are. Simply play it smart. If you're not worried about printing when carrying concealed, then how worried would you be about the condition of your pistol when carrying openly?
    Over the years I've given my opinions, good advice, quoted the laws word for word, supported others' choices, sent my own holsters to others for testing, obtained hard to find parts for other members' firearms, gained some forum support from vendors, product testing, research in finding what others could not, sending out free products to members through vendors or from my own stock. I've also offended some, I've been admonished by the administration here and rightfully so at times, and I occasionally receive personal messages from other members about their disapproval. But I'm always going to tell you my personal best opinion, the best information I have at the time, the best information available, and I'm usually going to be serious about it because this is a great place to learn as well as discuss everyone's opinions and task other members' knowledge from their experiences in the real world.
    Carrying a weapon for self defense will change your whole life and it should. Matter of fact....any time you carry (the more the better)....it should dictate every aspect of your life. After all.........you carry to make sure your life ends naturally and not at the hands of someone else who has no values or respect for your life.
    Should you "worry about" hitting your target?
    I'm not here to yank anyone's chain.
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  10. #24
    Ex Member Array Yankeejib's Avatar
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    Time after time, I'm absolutely shocked at how many people on this site will post they support the second amendment, and then lay their criteria for limiting second amendment rights. Holy Cow! Better get your house in order before someone does it for you.

    Concealed means concealed. Maybe your cell phone in your pocket looks like a J-frame. Maybe that bulge on your hip is an insulin pump. Who knows? "They" don't. FWIW, everyone has printing concerns when they first start carrying. After a while,it becomes a complete non-issue.

  11. #25
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    Printing is pretty much a non-issue here, other than giving up the element of surprise or someone noticing and asking you to leave.


    As far as open carrying in the car...
    http://www.doj.state.wi.us/dles/cib/...q-20111020.pdf
    Are there any locations where it is illegal to openly carry a firearm or any weapon?
    Yes. It is unlawful for anyone (except for law enforcement), including persons with a CCW license, to knowingly carry an unconcealed weapon (firearm, electric weapon, a knife or a billy club) in the following locations:
     Any portion of a building that is a police station, sheriff‘s office, state patrol station, or the office of a Division of Criminal Investigation special agent of DOJ.
     Any portion of a building that is a prison, jail, house of correction, or secured correctional facility.
     The Sand Ridge Secure Treatment Center, the Wisconsin Resource Center, or any secured unit or secured portion of a mental health institution, including a facility designated as the Maximum Security Facility at the Mendota Mental Health Institute.
     Any portion of a building that is a county, state, or federal courthouse.
     Any portion of a building that is a municipal courtroom if court is in session.
     A place beyond a security checkpoint in an airport.
    Wis. Stat. § 175.60(16)(a).
    If I do not have a CCW license how do I transport weapons in a vehicle?
    A. Handguns
    The law now allows a person to do the following without a CCW permit:
     place, possess, or transport a handgun in a vehicle without being unloaded or encased. Wis. Stats. § 167.31(2)(b).
     load a handgun in a vehicle. Wis. Stats. § 167.31(2)(c).
     operate an all-terrain vehicle (ATV) with a handgun in the operator‘s possession. Wis. Stat. § 23.33(3)(a).
     place, possess, or transport a handgun in or on a motorboat with the motor running without being unloaded or encased. Wis. Stats. § 167.31(2)(a), (b), (c).
     place, possess, or transport a handgun in or on a noncommercial aircraft.
    IMPORTANT NOTE: Persons who do not have a CCW license may still not carry weapons concealed. In a vehicle this means that the firearm cannot be hidden or concealed and within reach

  12. #26
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
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    Thanks for the replies. I got a better IWB holster yesterday, and even with the M&P it can barely be seen printing at all. Of the 3 friends I have talked to, none of them realized I had it on me.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  13. #27
    VIP Member Array smolck's Avatar
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    Back to the original question of the OP, "do I worry about printing?" Yes. I do everything I can to conceal my gun. I carry a 4" 1911 with a full frame, it isn't small but it is thin. The only time you would see it print is when I bend in an extreme angle as the butt will stick out some. But I have never been stopped or noticed anyone noticing me at all. With todays belts, holsters, and guns, you should be able to find a system that doesn't print. Let me help you, a good belt is the FIRST thing you should buy.

  14. #28
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    Florida has no open carry, but the legal description of concealed makes printing a pretty inconsequential event. If you really want to minimize your potential for printing get a quality IWB holster.

    "There is a secret pride in every human heart that revolts at tyranny. You may order and drive an individual, but you cannot make him respect you." William Hazlitt (1778 - 1830)

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  15. #29
    Distinguished Member Array Burns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smolck View Post
    Back to the original question of the OP, "do I worry about printing?" Yes. I do everything I can to conceal my gun. I carry a 4" 1911 with a full frame, it isn't small but it is thin. The only time you would see it print is when I bend in an extreme angle as the butt will stick out some. But I have never been stopped or noticed anyone noticing me at all. With todays belts, holsters, and guns, you should be able to find a system that doesn't print. Let me help you, a good belt is the FIRST thing you should buy.
    Yeah I realized that my first day carrying, needless to say, my gun was moving all over the place. I have a good belt now, and a cheap but good holster. I think the only time you could possibly notice it is when I'm sitting down as a restaurant, and unless you're a permit holder, not many people pay attention to it.
    Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable- JFK

  16. #30
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    I am from Kansas and there if you print you can lose your permit, get fined or both. No matter what state you reside in you should make every effort to keep your weapon concealed. Nobody should know you are carrying. If you can't conceal your weapon you might as well wear a sign saying I have a gun.

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