Unarmed security guard sees CCW, and it's illegal

This is a discussion on Unarmed security guard sees CCW, and it's illegal within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I work as an unarmed security guard in a museum at a major university. My job is mainly as a "visual deterant". So I do ...

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Thread: Unarmed security guard sees CCW, and it's illegal

  1. #1
    Member Array Maverick7340's Avatar
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    Unarmed security guard sees CCW, and it's illegal

    I work as an unarmed security guard in a museum at a major university. My job is mainly as a "visual deterant". So I do a lot of people watching on my job.
    It is against the law to carry at the university. I see alot of people wearing hawiian shirts, vests and fanny packs. I always keep an eye on these people but I have not yet spotted a gun.
    I was wondering what I should do when it finally does happen? Should I make a big deal out of it and call the university PD or talk to them and ask them to leave?
    There are always pressures to be political correct since there are a lot of people who visit the museum that are rich contributors to the university. That's why I'm not sure what I would do.

    So my question is two sided. What would you do if you were me and you saw someone with a CCW? Also, if you were the one with the CCW how would you want the situation to be handled?

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  3. #2
    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    If it's your job, if I were you, I'd notify the campus PD, and give them a description of the person or persons carrying gun(s). If you confront them about it, it's possible they could turn ugly, and pull the gun on you. If I was the person carrying, I would most likely comply, and go put the gun in my car. It's not worth it to escalate the situation.

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    Member Array Maverick7340's Avatar
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    It is illegal to even have the gun on campus so they can't put it in their car and come back in. They have to leave the campus.

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    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    In that case, contact the University Police Department, and let them handle it. That's a university I probably wouldn't attend. Here you can legally have a gun in your car, even if the property you're on has a no gun policy.

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    Senior Member Array cagueits's Avatar
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    There is a related thread somewhere, however I couldn't find it.

    Is it not legal because of a state law? If the University just came out with an administrative order, it should be legal to carry for visitors; employees/enrolled students would have trouble depending on what the carry law for that state reads.

    Ask your employer what you should do in this case.

    My 2 cents / not giving legal advice.

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    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
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    Ask your boss

    You should ask your boss at work what to do. Asking a bunch of guys on the Internet won't give you a definitive answer.

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    Member Array Maverick7340's Avatar
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    Since my supervisor wants to be politically correct he won't give me a straight answer because if he tells me to call the PD and it's a VIP then the SHTF and things roll downhill. Then if he tells me to do nothing, if something happens then the SHTF again. It's a no win situation. I am looking to see what others would do. It doesn't mean I will do it because so and so said.

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    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
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    I respect your answer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick7340 View Post
    Since my supervisor wants to be politically correct he won't give me a straight answer because if he tells me to call the PD and it's a VIP then the SHTF and things roll downhill. Then if he tells me to do nothing, if something happens then the SHTF again. It's a no win situation. I am looking to see what others would do. It doesn't mean I will do it because so and so said.
    I understand. You are the designated fall guy here.

    Okay, what I would do in your situation is to never see a gun unless it is clearly in the open and other people see it as well. You don't have X ray vision and can't be expected to see concealed guns, so you're off the hook there - printing could be a cell phone or orthopedic device under that Hawaiian shirt.

    But if somebody whips out their magnum and starts scaring the sheeple or shooting holes in the art work, I'd call the campus police immediately and report it. Then I would hide behind a heavy marble statue.

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    Member Array myusername's Avatar
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    I too am curious why they can't keep their gun in the car. In most states the law about not carrying on university campus' allows for in vehicle carry, if allowed in that state.

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    Distinguished Member Array fed_wif_a_sig's Avatar
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    Its actually simple. Your hired to do a job. If you spot a criminal act you are to report it. Thus no matter how nice the person is, if thier carrying a weapon in violation they took the chance, leave the decision up to the pd and call. If you dont call and the armed person does something bad, its you behind and you'll be hanging yourself out for civil damages. If its a VIP type person, no big, learn to hid the equipment better or advise those paid to look for that of their presence. Old chief once said, the day I cant do what I'm paid to do, its time to resign.

    Steve
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    Member Array Hobbes's Avatar
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    The vast majority of people who carry concealed are not law breakers (many are unaware of the university law I bet, if it is even a law). Those are not the people you need to worry about.
    If you THINK you see printing or something, as one poster said, you don't have xray vision- just forget about it.

    Anyways, I wouldn't be in a real big hurry to get someone in trouble over something they have the constitutional right to do. If I was in your shoes I would not report anything unless they were causing a disturbance.

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    I was once a security guard many moons ago and we were told that we are just there for looks. In no way were we cops and if we saw something we radio it in to the front desk. Now it seems to me you are looking a lot deeper to find trouble. Although I would never break the law and carry in a non carry zone the person you are so closely looking for might just be a good person who's life you are about to ruin. If someone flashes a gun sure call the cops but if you see a bump under someones shirt on their waist how far are you going to go to prove it is anything.

    Take care

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    Don't Be a Turkey...

    concealed means concealed. If you see a gun, that is one thing, but if you can't see a weapon...don't worry about it!

    You weren't one of those guys in class years ago who...2 minutes before the dismissal bell...would raise his hand and remind the teacher that she forget to give homework? If you were, then you would probably feel very comfortable exposing CCW'ers.

    Don't spend your time trying to guess who is armed because of their dress...

    Stay safe and be COOL!

    ret
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    I would make one written request for clarification to your boss and file the answer away to CYA. (e-mail or memo etc.)
    Then follow pogo2 and fed_wif_a_sig's advice.
    Worst case, you were looking for a job when you found that one... no worries!
    ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!

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    judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
    superior skills."

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    Member Array PolarBear's Avatar
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    Unless the person is causing a disturbance you may not want to "call it in" right away even if you do see a gun. For all you know that person may be authorized to carry. I have seen more than a few "plain clothes" LEOs stopped and their "cover" blown because someone (like a security guard) called them in.

    Another thing to keep in mind is the fact that you work at a university and you should be aware that EVERY call the university PD gets is put into a report at the end of the year. This "crime report" is used to show "how safe" the school is and is looked at by a lot of important people. If you end up calling campus police about a "man with a gun" a few times, then at the end of the year, the report will show a sharp increase of "gun related calls" on campus. Most times this report is a summery that uses a chart or percentages; it will not show the outcome of the incidents just that "x" number of "x" type of calls occurred during the year. This report may be part of the reason why your boss is giving you the run around.

    I am not saying you should never call it in or that you should not pay extra attention to someone you suspect of having a gun, just don’t “jump the gun” (sorry for the bad pun). If the subject gives you a "bad feeling" then call it in. But take a minute to observe the individual before you do. During this time you can take in all the details you will need to give a good description and be able to decide if this person seems to be a "person of interest" to LEOs (if you can, write it down ASAP). By doing this, you will be better able to explain why you called in the LEOs and also be able to give an accurate description of the individual.

    Just something things to think about. Good luck and stay safe.
    "Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud..."
    -Jeff Cooper, "The Art of the Rifle"

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