Traveler sues Delta Airlines for New York arrest. - Page 2

Traveler sues Delta Airlines for New York arrest.

This is a discussion on Traveler sues Delta Airlines for New York arrest. within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Benedetto is a wealthy and powerful man who has grow accustomed to people kissing his arse. Sue NY for false arrest and leave Delta alone....

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Thread: Traveler sues Delta Airlines for New York arrest.

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array Doghandler's Avatar
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    Benedetto is a wealthy and powerful man who has grow accustomed to people kissing his arse. Sue NY for false arrest and leave Delta alone.
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  2. #17
    sgb
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    Isn't this the guy that had a connecting flight that delta CANCELLED which forced him to take possession of his checked luggage until his rescheduled connection the following day?
    "There is a secret pride in every human heart that revolts at tyranny. You may order and drive an individual, but you cannot make him respect you." William Hazlitt (1778 - 1830)

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  3. #18
    VIP Member Array Crowman's Avatar
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    In a strict legal sense then yes he was untimely responsible.

    With that said Delta needs to share in the matter. The issue in New York is not something new and Delta know of it and should advise someone in this type situation that New York law prohibits non-residents from carrying concealed weapons. Airlines post advisories on their webpages. An alert for New York and other cities with similar issues should be posted.

    The attorney mentioned that the airline advises about the gun laws in England so why not New York city.
    "One of the greatest delusions in the world is the hope that the evils in this world are to be cured by legislation."
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  4. #19
    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
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    How about this:

    The airline actually had possession of the firearm within the baggage and knowledge that it was there. They willfully and knowingly transported it into a restricted area. It was in their sole possession and control until they handed the luggage over to the passenger. That sounds like they themselves violated the law. How about charging them as an accessory, or charge them with Conspiracy since they knew ahead of time that it would be a crime in New York, they agreed to the transport, and then made the crime happen by transporting it into a restricted area.

    Personally I think it's the City of NY that needs to be sued, but it's interesting to look at how this could go if someone had the will and means to do so. The City, I am sure makes too much money off of Delta to bit the hand that feeds them, so it'll never happen.
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  5. #20
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    Another educated MORON,blaming somebody else for his failure to check the laws concerning carrying a firearm,anybody that carries should be fully aware of what states honor their permit,and if they are to lazy to check leave the gun at home.
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

  6. #21
    Member Array TVille's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoganbeg View Post
    How about this:

    The airline actually had possession of the firearm within the baggage and knowledge that it was there. They willfully and knowingly transported it into a restricted area. It was in their sole possession and control until they handed the luggage over to the passenger. That sounds like they themselves violated the law. How about charging them as an accessory, or charge them with Conspiracy since they knew ahead of time that it would be a crime in New York, they agreed to the transport, and then made the crime happen by transporting it into a restricted area.

    Personally I think it's the City of NY that needs to be sued, but it's interesting to look at how this could go if someone had the will and means to do so. The City, I am sure makes too much money off of Delta to bit the hand that feeds them, so it'll never happen.
    How are they to know if he does, or does not have, a federal LEO license which would make him legal in NY? He could be FBI, US Marshall, Secrete Service, or who knows what. Maybe they have a license from NYS because of who knows what.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by TVille View Post
    How are they to know if he does, or does not have, a federal LEO license which would make him legal in NY? He could be FBI, US Marshall, Secrete Service, or who knows what. Maybe they have a license from NYS because of who knows what.
    More paper work, more pain in the back end, but perhaps the common carrier should have some requirement that they
    not transport to a place where possession would be illegal; or to not turn it over at the destination if your license is not
    valid at that point. While the primary responsibility certainly must be on the gun owner, I think there are things the airlines
    might chose to do or might be required to do to help prevent these rather common errors.

    Something as simple as a red large font notice printed on the declaration would help--

    "You may not bring a hand gun to a destination where your license is not recognized; e.g., NY NJ".

    NY and NJ might also (but they won't) make their major transportation hubs permissive for folks with out of state licenses but
    post warnings at exits that you may not take a firearm out of the terminal without an appropriate NY or NJ license, LE or LEOSA
    authority. The Port Authority could even let folks turn weapons over to officers for safe keeping if someone must leave
    for a hotel due to an unexpected flight situation. That way someone who was headed to GA from OH for example, but
    delayed in NY, could safely leave the weapon at the airport and go to a hotel.

    There are certainly ways the whole problem might be better handled.

    Of course finding solutions is not going to happen.
    If the Union is once severed, the line of separation will grow wider and wider, and the controversies which are now debated and settled in the halls of legislation will then be tried in fields of battle and determined by the sword.
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  8. #23
    PM
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    Passenger is responsible. Per MSN's report agent is required by law to report. No win for guy in couurt; Delta has the law on their side IMHO

  9. #24
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    I'm gonna say he has less chance of victory than I have of scoring on Scarlett Johannson.
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  10. #25
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    I think we all agree that the passenger is ultimately responsible for his own stuff and knowing the laws at his destination. Having said that, I agree with Hopyard that the airlines could reasonably give a warning upon being apprised of the firearm; consider it a customer service.

    What really needs to happen is for a revision in the laws to allow for the temporary legal storage at the airport. However, I can't see that happening anytime soon, if ever.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hoganbeg View Post
    I think we all agree that the passenger is ultimately responsible for his own stuff and knowing the laws at his destination. Having said that, I agree with Hopyard that the airlines could reasonably give a warning upon being apprised of the firearm; consider it a customer service.

    What really needs to happen is for a revision in the laws to allow for the temporary legal storage at the airport. However, I can't see that happening anytime soon, if ever.
    from the delta web site:

    If you need to travel with a weapon as checked baggage, you are responsible for knowledge of and compliance with all Federal, State, or Local laws regarding the possession and transportation of firearms. For more information about this regulation you can visit the TSA site.
    If you are transporting a firearm to the United Kingdom as checked baggage, a permit from the United Kingdom is specifically required. You must contact the United Kingdom for more information about securing this permit.

    How much more of a warning does anyone think is necessary?

  12. #27
    Senior Member Array The Fish's Avatar
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    I have no love for any airline but the story said he was the Pres. of a university.
    How stupid was he to not know about N.Y. City's gun laws which have been in place since the 1920's.
    I hope he gets his clock cleaned in trying to sue Delta.
    " Keep On Packin' On The Bimah"

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by apvbguy View Post
    I agree, the guy is not going to win his case against Delta.
    the bad thing is that NYC regularly violates FOPA by denying the transport of firearms through the airports in NYC which is legal to do.

    for example if my trip begins in NJ, where I am legally permitted to possess and transport a weapon in a locked container, with a car ride to JFK airport which is in NYC in order to take a plane to FLA, where I am legal to carry I should fall under the FOPA rules for transporting a gun and as long as I adhere to the FOPA regs, NYC should not arrest and prosecute me, however like I stated NYC regularly does arrest people doing just as I've described.

    from wikipedia

    One of the law's provisions was that persons traveling from one place to another cannot be incarcerated for a firearms offense in a state that has strict gun control laws if the traveler is just passing through (short stops for food and gas) and the firearms and ammunition are not immediately accessible, unloaded and, in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment, in a locked container.[7]
    An example of this would be that someone driving from Virginia to a competition in Vermont with a locked hard case containing an unloaded handgun and a box of ammunition in the trunk could not be prosecuted in New Jersey or New York City for illegal possession of a handgun provided that they did not stop in New Jersey or New York for an extended period of time.
    However Washington D.C., New York, New Jersey, and several other states routinely ignore this provision; arresting, prosecuting, and imprisoning travelers who are complying with this federal law.
    APV I am 100 pecent sure that if you did the trip as you described with the Congressman Young Letter in hand you would be OK. The Port Authority Police could arrest you and tell you that you would have a defense in court but IMHO they would see that you are a Law abiding citizen and you would be good to go. If you were arrested, you would have a lawsuit and any half way decent attorney would get you a nice settlement.

    I have several post on traveling thru JFK and LGA. I have traveled 8 plus times carrying my firearm WITHOUT a NYC permit thru the ABOVE airports. I have a Nassau County license and I was legal where I started and legal where I was going so I was LEGAL to carry to the airport. I did have one leo who was busting my chops. See Posts. He did call NC Pistol licensing and got bad info from them but I was able to contuine on my trip to Vegas with my firearm.

    Anybody can bring whatever they want to NYC and nobody would have a clue. The problem is leaving NYC. ALL the AIRLINES (Not just Delta) are required to call the PA Police. I always carry two copies of everything. One on my person, one in my carry-on bag. Copies of my licenses. Copies of rules and regs, TSA and Airlines. Congressman Young letter. Get there early. Be Polite!!!! Know the rules. The ones from starting point and final point.

    If I was on a flight and have no choice to land in DC or NJ. I would either (a) not take possession of my firearm or (b) Go rent a car and drive home. I have said before I do not make the rules and yes they may not be good but I make the rules work for me. Please re-read my other posts.

    If I could not fly out of LGA or JFK I would fly out of Macarthur it is located in Suffolk County. http://www.flylima.com/

    Suffolk is the other half of Long Island and not part of the 5 boros that make up NYC. Suffolk honors Nassau and vice a versa. So 1000 percent legal.

    Heck, I would drive to connecticut. Have a CCW from them. It might be a little PITA but If you want something bad enough you can make it work for you. Like I said not my sandbox I just want to play in it.

    How many people would be bashing me If I posted I took my firearm to Cali and got arrested there? Who would be to blame? 3 people. ME, MYSELF AND I. Thats who.
    You do not know, what you do not know, until you realize that you do not know it

  14. #29
    PM
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    Quote Originally Posted by apvbguy View Post
    from the delta web site:

    If you need to travel with a weapon as checked baggage, you are responsible for knowledge of and compliance with all Federal, State, or Local laws regarding the possession and transportation of firearms. For more information about this regulation you can visit the TSA site.

    If you are transporting a firearm to the United Kingdom as checked baggage, a permit from the United Kingdom is specifically required. You must contact the United Kingdom for more information about securing this permit.How much more of a warning does anyone think is necessary?
    The underlined section does cover the delta to a point but read the Arial Black section which directs me to TSA; at this point they could put a statement about NY/NJ and IL Chi town. Especially with the UK statement that follows or put the statement about the three I used there. Again our job to know but would not the same the true if planning to carring to the UK? Especially whne the UK is the poster child for anti gun in the world (ok one of many poster children!!!)
    Hopyard likes this.

  15. #30
    Ex Member Array apvbguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PM View Post
    The underlined section does cover the delta to a point but read the Arial Black section which directs me to TSA; at this point they could put a statement about NY/NJ and IL Chi town. Especially with the UK statement that follows or put the statement about the three I used there. Again our job to know but would not the same the true if planning to carring to the UK? Especially whne the UK is the poster child for anti gun in the world (ok one of many poster children!!!)
    delta's business is transporting people via air, it is not in the business of issuing legal advice.

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