Online CCH courses

This is a discussion on Online CCH courses within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Here in my home state, Washington, all that is required is $52, a valid ID, some fingerprints and successful passing of a background check. Personally, ...

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Thread: Online CCH courses

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array Dandyone's Avatar
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    Here in my home state, Washington, all that is required is $52, a valid ID, some fingerprints and successful passing of a background check.

    Personally, I've done a lot of research on laws, and I've done a lot of deep thinking regarding the pros and cons of *me* carrying.

    Sounds like the VA online course is a lot more than what is required here in WA state. I don't think that it is unreasonable to require a proficiency exam that would include safe use of weapon and ability in keeping the lead on target, and I would like to know that other permit holders also know the laws.

    Of course this would all cost $$$... and for many/most folks it would be an inconvenience and a 'waste' of time (meaning folks like me would not likely gain much from being forced to jump through the hoops).

    In the end, I think I prefer fewer hoops than more hoops. I worry a lot more about the folks that skip the permit process.

    my 2c on 2a

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  3. #17
    Distinguished Member Array claude clay's Avatar
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    drive on line....park with a joy stick or your license limits you to the fancy auto-moron self park cars
    too stupid to learn, no problem, we developed a car with your handicap in mind.
    and how could you mind, you never were taught how to use yours.

    so, guns on line permits--but you are limited to one bullet per month
    of a calaber that looks like it should work in the picture of the gun
    your allowed to carry; folded no more than 2 times and concelled in a pocket.

    --can someone help me here with the shopping bag gun picture please....
    http://www.shoppingbags.com/images/f...s-crimebag.jpg

    thats gonna be my OC gun.
    Last edited by claude clay; June 15th, 2012 at 01:38 PM.
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  4. #18
    Member Array Cremator75's Avatar
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    Bearing arms is a right from our constitution. No where in there does it say what training, if any, for you to own or carry said guns. It's a slippery slope when you start to tack on regulations just to exercise your right. What's next? Training for how to use your first amendment properly? I don't like how some people speek, and it can really hurt people sometimes even to the point of suicide, but its their right to talk how they want. They should be more responsible, but you can't force it on their right.

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  5. #19
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Some states allow constitutional carry... NO TRAINING AT ALL... Buy a gun (legally), strap it on.

    The antis will tell you that "THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT JARED LOUGHNER did."

    He could have saved money by renting a U-Haul truck and done exactly the same damage... maybe worse.

    No matter the comprehensiveness of the training, some will sit through the class and gain NOTHING.

    If I owned a gun shop... and someday I may... I would give a copy of In the Gravest Extreme to every first time purchaser of a handgun (for self defense). If they take the time to read it a time or three... they will get most of what they need to know about the mindset required to carry.

    The fellow in Texas that shot his neighbor for partying too loudly, and got found guilty of murder... had OBVIOUSLY been through a CCW class... "They're going to kill me" "I'm in fear for my life." "I'm standing my ground." all while video taping his actions.

    Classes, range time, and edumication won't fix those that make us CCW holders look bad... Any more than classes, jail time, and forced DETOX keep drunk drivers off the road.

    The majority of CCW holders are law abiding citizens who wouldn't pull their gun unless all the necessary criteria were met. The majority seem to be successful in defending themselves. Some fail, and even have their own gun used on them.

    "A man's gotta know his limitations."
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  6. #20
    Ex Member Array barstoolguru's Avatar
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    Does anyone see what is lost with this or is it just me? For one the online class loses something, it loses the human factor. The trade of Ideas that make a class what a class is; too inner react with others. To talk about things and get a feel for what is right and what is wrong; to be part of a think tank.

    When you have an online course it loses something, the ability to converse with other who think alike

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barstoolguru View Post
    Does anyone see what is lost with this or is it just me?
    Yup. If a person's going to bother with acquiring information and understanding, it seems pointless to deliberately undermine the effort. I'm with you, on that score.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
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  8. #22
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    I support Constutional Carry

    For the record, I'm on the side of "There should be no prior restraints on ANY constitutional Right -- including the RKBA and to defend yourself with a firearm. NO constitutionally protected rights should even require a permit or license or training or proficiency test to exercise."

    I do agree that training should be encouraged -- strongly encouraged. I think someone carrying w/o training is setting themselves up for serious consequences. But I object to "Nanny May I" laws requiring it.

    IMHO, all the arguments for restrictions on carry (e.g., “may issue”, OKs from the chief LEO, prior training, proficiency testing, checking more frequently to see if a person is still fit to carry a weapon) are exactly the same as those that the hoplophobic use for restricting carry in the crazy patchwork quilt of hurdles to be cleared before exercising and to continue the exercise of our RKBA.

    However, there is no evidence that there is any higher rate of gun related problems in those States with little or no such nonsense, as there is in those States with draconian restrictions on the 2A.

    During a public panel Q & A session, I saw a leaders of the Antis, here in Virginia, sandbagged into actually defining what “reasonable restrictions” and adequate “training & proficiency” he would agree to as the minimum for carry. I know what Washington DC thinks is reasonable (no carry outside of your home), what Chicago thinks is reasonable (only the connected), and what his-dishonor-from NYC talks about as reasonable. They are all extremely high hurdles or outright blocks to serve as prior-restraints on a right they do not want you (the average citizen) to have.

    These antis are convinced that it is better to deny “the many” the right to protection because it could stop some small number from [fill-in-the-blank] in the future – all the while being in denial of the criminals’ disregard for those very laws that create vast “unarmed victim zones” on which those very criminals prey. They preach “It could be, but never mind what it is doing”-- and that is not logical.

    The bottom line is that all these prior-restraints do not work. The blood baths that the antis hope that their manta might stop sometime in the future are happening, right now, in the “unarmed victim zones” as they continue to preach their trust-us-we’ll-take-care-of-you. OTOH, in places where the prior-restraints are being reduced crime is being reduced.
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    I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.

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  9. #23
    Distinguished Member Array noway2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveH View Post
    However, there is no evidence that there is any higher rate of gun related problems in those States with little or no such nonsense, as there is in those States with draconian restrictions on the 2A.
    Interestingly, this is the excuse often sited for refusal to engage in interstate reciprocity.


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  10. #24
    Senior Member Array NH_Esau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RayBar View Post
    In my state, Virginia, you can go online and take a one or two hour course that will qualify you to apply for your CCH permit. I'm sure Virginia is not the only state that allows this. I'm wondering what others think of this, and if they recognize the danger of providing someone with the ability to get a permit without ever seeing them or talking to them, while determining as certainly as you can, that they possess a reasonable attitude about carrying a firearm, that they appear able to accept the responsibility that is part of the right we have. Allowing people to get their training online, in my opinion, is dangerous, irresponsible, and should not be allowed. You don't know if they can handle firearms safely, there are no shooting skills to observe, you don't really know who's taking the exam or if there is someone with them giving them the answers or telling them what to write, the list could go on forever, you get my point? They can be a complete moron and still pass the background check, and now we are all grouped together with these fools. When they screw up, and they will, it hurts all of us. Should anything be done to stop online training for CCH permits?
    There should be no "allowing." CC permits and licenses shouldn't exist, no more than permits or licenses for going to church, speaking my mind, writing a letter, hanging out with folks, complaining to my government, or keeping my stuff private. If I do something that justifies, through due process, the removal of my rights, that's a different matter. If you find me on the streets carrying a firearm when I've been banned from doing so, it's easy enough to check. Especially if you've got SCMODS ;) I shouldn't have to carry some piece of paper that says I've been a good citizen.

    Besides the above, I have no strong feelings on this subject.
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  11. #25
    Distinguished Member Array noway2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NH_Esau View Post
    There should be no "allowing." CC permits and licenses shouldn't exist, no more than permits or licenses for going to church, speaking my mind, writing a letter, hanging out with folks, complaining to my government, or keeping my stuff private.
    That very well may be but for a hand full of states with constitutional carry, it simply isn't reality. If as much energy were put into supporting and enhancing the system as is spent ranting about it, maybe some of these issues would get resolved.

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  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by noway2 View Post
    If as much energy were put into supporting and enhancing the system as is spent ranting about it, maybe some of these issues would get resolved.
    Many of us who are ranting about about the existing system are putting even more energy into enhancing the system in ways to restore our rights.

    OTOH, energy supporting the existing "Nanny May I" laws and draconian restrictions on the 2A is counterproductive to the RKBA, IMHO.

    There is no dichotomy between ranting about about the existing system vs. working hard to improve it. I can and I am doing both -- as do a lot of other folk.
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    I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.

    Veni, Vidi, Velcro

  13. #27
    Distinguished Member Array noway2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveH View Post
    Many of us who are ranting about about the existing system are putting even more energy into enhancing the system in ways to restore our rights.
    And this is to be commended. However, most of the "the only permit I need is the constitution" posts in this forum do not reflect this view. Whether or not NH_Esau, whom I quoted, falls into this camp or not I can't say and I am not trying to single him/her out. The perpetual rant, that is pervasive every time these types of questions come up is getting old.

    OTOH, energy supporting the existing "Nanny May I" laws and draconian restrictions on the 2A is counterproductive to the RKBA, IMHO.
    There is a difference between supporting "Nanny" laws and working towards an improved system. It isn't an all or nothing. In many states, it will be a very long time and require a lot of intermediate steps working within the system to get there. My state is a good example in that it has some pretty screwed up restrictions. Many, myself included (by financially supporting gun rights organizations and actively campaigning the legislature), are trying to get the most egregious of these changed, but it is an uphill battle. Constitutional carry, isn't anywhere near being in the cards.

    There is no dichotomy between ranting about about the existing system vs. working hard to improve it. I can and I am doing both -- as do a lot of other folk.
    No there is not. But posts spewing "I shouldn't need no stink'in permit.." are less than worthless in terms of value add. In all likelihood, the vast majority of this forums member base would agree with constitutional carry.

  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by noway2 View Post
    It isn't an all or nothing. In many states, it will be a very long time and require a lot of intermediate steps working within the system to get there.
    BINGO!

    +1 here.

    I fully understand incremental improvement/advances.

    Walking the talk and investing sweat equity in advancing the RKBA is what I ask.

    I wonder how many members have ever lobbied (physically not just sent an email) at their State legislative session? How many have spoken pro-RKBA at local councils/assemblies/etc? Attended protest/demonstrations against anti-RKBA actions? Are publicly identified with the RKBA movement?

    Just agreeing with constitutional carry isn't going to get it done, IMHO.

    Suggesting that requiring training or profession test to carry is counterproductive, IMHO.
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    I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL.

    I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.

    Veni, Vidi, Velcro

  15. #29
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveH View Post
    Walking the talk and investing sweat equity in advancing the RKBA is what I ask.

    I wonder how many members have ever lobbied (physically not just sent an email) at their State legislative session?
    I've been doing this for 20+ years on a variety of issues, including RKBA. It takes some doing, but getting 'face' time with sitting politicos can be done. IMO, it can make all the difference, above and beyond just a letter or email that can be round-filed and forgotten about. A handshake, brief discussion and photo 'evidence' can be harder to ignore.

    How many have spoken pro-RKBA at local councils/assemblies/etc?
    Haven't spoken, no.

    Attended protest/demonstrations against anti-RKBA actions?
    Have done this on several occasions.

    Are publicly identified with the RKBA movement?
    My affiliations are publicly stated, though I'm not publicly "known" per se. Just another citizen doing what I can.

    Pushing it in the right direction hopefully will keep it going in the right direction.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
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  16. #30
    P95
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    I can see some potential problems with this "online" certification. Here in KY....it takes an 8hr course....tests over legalities....and some range time to demonstrate gun knowledge and safety. It is about an 5 week process before you get your actual permit.

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