Us and them...

This is a discussion on Us and them... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by MadMac The presence of "crime" in no way implies the need to shoot someone. In MOST communities, the average citizens is far ...

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  1. #61
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadMac View Post
    The presence of "crime" in no way implies the need to shoot someone. In MOST communities, the average citizens is far more likely to need a defibrillator than a firearm. I am NOT saying not to carry, or be prepared, or whatever, but get some perspective. If you want to spend a good deal of your waking life dreaming of and preparing to shoot a "bad guy", enjoy your fantasies and your gun hobby. But don't try to fool others into believing their Hobson's choice is to either carry/train or die young.
    When you imagine your life to be a non-stop scene from Grand Theft Auto, you will see what you want to see.
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  3. #62
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    "I live in a nice, upscale, peaceful neighborhood" is great to say but the bad guys looking to rob, rape or do whatever are not gonna turn around and break into a ghetto apartment they are looking for a nice, upscale, peaceful neighborhood.
    Actually, when I read the local PD crime report every day, I would estimate half of the breakins I read about to be in the less than stellar neighborhoods.

    I like to Google Map the addresses of the residences that are broken into. One begins to see some common vulnerabilities when one does.
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  4. #63
    Ex Member Array MadMac's Avatar
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    It's WAY more than half, Chad. That old post about how house breakers look for upscale, peaceful neighborhoods is complete hookum and has been debunked here repeatedly. Predators tend to prey on their neighbors, and almost all predators DO NOT live in upscale, peaceful neighborhoods. A couple outlier anecdotes don't refute the statistics.
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  5. #64
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    Actually its a peaceful neighborhood except for a few crackheads. It's definitely not South side of Chicago....yes...it definitely depends on where you live. I don't walk out the door everyday with five extra mags, and two or three knives paranoid that everyone I meet is a potential bad guy who is out to kill me.

    Well only a few crackheads in a peaceful neighborhood wow, those are the ones you see.

    It's paranoid people like this that will shoot their own family one day by accident of they are not careful thinking they were the bad guys lurking behind the couch.


    I am really trying not to be rude but where in the hell did you come up with this? You are kidding right? Do you have any fact to base this on?

    The fact that someone trains does not mean they are itching for a gunfight or to kill someone and to the member who posted that those who train would be crucified in the press and courts should they shoot someone? I pose the same question to you, where in the hell did you come up with this?

    Madmac you are correct as soon as we are born we become a statistic whether we like it or not but whether you believe them or follow them is your choice. As an example you can manipulate stats to say anything you want if you just keep asking questions. When they do a telephone survey for presidential approval ratings lets say they ask the standard Republican or Democrat, race, age and so on then the last question is "If the man running against the president was a convicted child molester who wants to make drugs for kids legal who would you vote for? Gee all of a sudden you a 99.9% approval rating for the sitting president.

    All it takes is one event/person to mess up the whole thing. Tell me where does a man eating another man's face, who is shot then keeps eating the other guys face fall into the stats? You mean to tell me there is a category for that? I bet the guy who writes the format for the stats rubbed his head a bit wondering where to put that one.

    If you don't want to train don't. There are amatuer's that qualify for the Master's(?) golf tourney, don't know if it is the right tourney or not, but you don't see them winning it, the pros who actually practice and train all the time do win.

    It is a personal choice as to how far you go with your skills but all it takes is one guy who is better than you to really ruin your day.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  6. #65
    P95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    Neither do most here. Paranoid and prepared are two different things. I carry two spare mags, one knife and my firearm, does that make me paranoid or does it make me prepared. I think you should take a class somewhere to find out what you might be lacking. It is a real eye opener....
    My eyes have been open for 52 years....I'm not paranoid....not gonna pay someone to make me paranoid....it's all about perceptions anyway isn't it?

  7. #66
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    So what your saying is that 50% are in Ghettos,well where is the other 50% taking place?Please note I am in L.E.,so I have first hand knowledge on this.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chad Rogers View Post
    Actually, when I read the local PD crime report every day, I would estimate half of the breakins I read about to be in the less than stellar neighborhoods.

    I like to Google Map the addresses of the residences that are broken into. One begins to see some common vulnerabilities when one does.

  8. #67
    P95
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    Actually its a peaceful neighborhood except for a few crackheads. It's definitely not South side of Chicago....yes...it definitely depends on where you live. I don't walk out the door everyday with five extra mags, and two or three knives paranoid that everyone I meet is a potential bad guy who is out to kill me.

    Well only a few crackheads in a peaceful neighborhood wow, those are the ones you see.

    It's paranoid people like this that will shoot their own family one day by accident of they are not careful thinking they were the bad guys lurking behind the couch.


    I am really trying not to be rude but where in the hell did you come up with this? You are kidding right? Do you have any fact to base this on?

    The fact that someone trains does not mean they are itching for a gunfight or to kill someone and to the member who posted that those who train would be crucified in the press and courts should they shoot someone? I pose the same question to you, where in the hell did you come up with this?

    Madmac you are correct as soon as we are born we become a statistic whether we like it or not but whether you believe them or follow them is your choice. As an example you can manipulate stats to say anything you want if you just keep asking questions. When they do a telephone survey for presidential approval ratings lets say they ask the standard Republican or Democrat, race, age and so on then the last question is "If the man running against the president was a convicted child molester who wants to make drugs for kids legal who would you vote for? Gee all of a sudden you a 99.9% approval rating for the sitting president.

    All it takes is one event/person to mess up the whole thing. Tell me where does a man eating another man's face, who is shot then keeps eating the other guys face fall into the stats? You mean to tell me there is a category for that? I bet the guy who writes the format for the stats rubbed his head a bit wondering where to put that one.

    If you don't want to train don't. There are amatuer's that qualify for the Master's(?) golf tourney, don't know if it is the right tourney or not, but you don't see them winning it, the pros who actually practice and train all the time do win.

    It is a personal choice as to how far you go with your skills but all it takes is one guy who is better than you to really ruin your day.
    I don't think forum rules allows such language...2. While debating and discussion is fine, we will not tolerate rudeness, insulting posts, personal attacks or purposeless inflammatory posts or PMs. Trolling, flaming, and personal attacks are strictly prohibited. You are welcome to disagree with opinions other than your own, but flaming other members will not be allowed. If you can't figure out how to compose a post without it being confrontational or a personal attack on someone, simply bite your lip and don't post it.

  9. #68
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    My brother died 5 years ago going down a ridge road, doing 35 miles an hour, when, during a thunderstorm, a tree fell on his truck. Stuff happens. Slip and fall, diet, genetics, tobacco users.
    It's all about the law of averages, which catch up to all of us sooner or later.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  10. #69
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    Glockman, I also have a dd214. Even though I am old and gray the aggresiveness I aquired earnining that dd214 is still with me. I do not take training classes. I never lost what I learned. I am not afraid to go anywhere and I am not paranoid. I am prepared to use my head first and weapons last. Brother.
    Semper Fi
    "Marines don't surrender-they win or die." from Brute

  11. #70
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockrocker View Post
    So what your saying is that 50% are in Ghettos,well where is the other 50% taking place?Please note I am in L.E.,so I have first hand knowledge on this.
    What I am saying is that when I read the daily crime reports for my AO, it seems that half the breakins are in the less than stellar neighborhoods. In fact on the occasional odd day almost every single residence reported burglarized is in a less than stellar neighborhood.

    Now of course one's AO would have to have less than stellar neighborhoods in order for residences in less than stllar neighborhoods to be broken into.

    Congratulations on your law enforcement status.
    "People who take an Internet handle of a great warrior, are usually the first to go fetal when crunch time comes." - Me

  12. #71
    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P95 View Post
    My eyes have been open for 52 years....I'm not paranoid....not gonna pay someone to make me paranoid....it's all about perceptions anyway isn't it?
    Im not paranoid either, but my perception is a little different than yours. See you live in a nice neighborhood with crack heads, I do not.....
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

  13. #72
    Member Array PilotAlso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    Actually its a peaceful neighborhood except for a few crackheads. It's definitely not South side of Chicago....yes...it definitely depends on where you live. I don't walk out the door everyday with five extra mags, and two or three knives paranoid that everyone I meet is a potential bad guy who is out to kill me.

    Well only a few crackheads in a peaceful neighborhood wow, those are the ones you see.

    It's paranoid people like this that will shoot their own family one day by accident of they are not careful thinking they were the bad guys lurking behind the couch.


    I am really trying not to be rude but where in the hell did you come up with this? You are kidding right? Do you have any fact to base this on?

    The fact that someone trains does not mean they are itching for a gunfight or to kill someone and to the member who posted that those who train would be crucified in the press and courts should they shoot someone? I pose the same question to you, where in the hell did you come up with this?

    Madmac you are correct as soon as we are born we become a statistic whether we like it or not but whether you believe them or follow them is your choice. As an example you can manipulate stats to say anything you want if you just keep asking questions. When they do a telephone survey for presidential approval ratings lets say they ask the standard Republican or Democrat, race, age and so on then the last question is "If the man running against the president was a convicted child molester who wants to make drugs for kids legal who would you vote for? Gee all of a sudden you a 99.9% approval rating for the sitting president.

    All it takes is one event/person to mess up the whole thing. Tell me where does a man eating another man's face, who is shot then keeps eating the other guys face fall into the stats? You mean to tell me there is a category for that? I bet the guy who writes the format for the stats rubbed his head a bit wondering where to put that one.

    If you don't want to train don't. There are amatuer's that qualify for the Master's(?) golf tourney, don't know if it is the right tourney or not, but you don't see them winning it, the pros who actually practice and train all the time do win.

    It is a personal choice as to how far you go with your skills but all it takes is one guy who is better than you to really ruin your day.
    That would be my comment. I can actually think for myself. I don't require an "expert" to tell me what could happen.

    THINK ABOUT IT:

    A SD shooting will always be second guessed. That would include evaluations of the shooters motives and history. It doesn't take a genius to understand that a guy who has taken multiple "training" courses could be looked at with a certain amount of curiosity by the press and prosecutors.

    From what I've read, there are very very few SD shootings that everyone agrees is a "good shoot" or a "no other choice" situation. In your mind and according to your "training" a shooting might be 100 percent right but history has shown there will always be someone or some group that will jump at the chance to persecute you for your deed. If you don't think they will attack your penchant for "training", well I'd say you don't understand reality.

  14. #73
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    I'm telling!!!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by P95 View Post
    I don't think forum rules allows such language...2. While debating and discussion is fine, we will not tolerate rudeness, insulting posts, personal attacks or purposeless inflammatory posts or PMs. Trolling, flaming, and personal attacks are strictly prohibited. You are welcome to disagree with opinions other than your own, but flaming other members will not be allowed. If you can't figure out how to compose a post without it being confrontational or a personal attack on someone, simply bite your lip and don't post it.
    tcox4freedom and ILoveSigs like this.

  15. #74
    Member Array Simonsay's Avatar
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    Curious... how many that are serious about self defense training also compete in the practical pistol games?

  16. #75
    Ex Member Array MadMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simonsay View Post
    Curious... how many that are serious about self defense training also compete in the practical pistol games?
    I am deadly serious about self-defense for me and my family. I just don't expend 98% of my self-defense activity time with handgun proficiency in unrealistic conditions.
    tcox4freedom likes this.

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