This is a discussion on Sig 938 & 238 cocked and locked? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by Thunder71 No grip safety on a 938 or 238, why are people comparing them to carrying a 1911? Well, I'd say; if ...
"He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luke 22:36
"If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." Thomas Jefferson
I carry my 1911's & my Hi-Power condition one & in a holster. The little Sigs or the Colt Mustang (If I had One) I'm sure I'd do the same with a good holster.
The 938 and 238 are neat little toys but I personally would have a hangup carrying something that small cocked and locked. Personal opinion is there are better choices that require less mechanical motion (read that as take the safety off) required to deploy. Time spent not pulling the trigger can equate to time spent bleeding on the floor on your behalf. Also, my personal opinion of DA/SA or SA only toys is once the shooting is over you have a hyped-up person (could be me. Could be you) with a cocked gun. I will take my chance with a DAO platform.
At one with the gun.
1911's (and the like) are among my favorite guns.
For whatever reason, a thumb safety is what makes me feel the most comfortable, plus I like steel, so that's what I go with.
238, cocked and locked.
It is my first 1911 style pistol and it did kind of make me nervous at first, but I was really just overthinking it. My 229 has no manual safety, and I carried that with a round in the chamber and decocked. The 238 is actually probably safer.
Well I guess I'm in the minority. I have a P238, don't carry it much. When I do, I carry it condition 3 (no round in chamber). For me the need for safety outweighs the need to get a gun into action that fast. If I don't have a split second to rack the slide, then I guess the bad guy gets the first shot - at least if I survive I'll have a pretty good case for SD.
I also own and carry 1911s on occasion and for 4 years in the military. I carry my .45s in condition 1 (cocked and locked) but ONLY if I have a holster with a strap that goes between the hammer and the slide (as most leather holsters do).
The way the Sig 938 and 238 triggers are set up, they cannot fire even if dropped on the hammer. The reason for this is because there is a 'fork' that blocks the firing pin until the trigger is pulled. When, and only when, the trigger is pulled does this slide down out of the way allowing the firing pin to move forward. I can only think of 4 ways for the gun to go off in this configuration, 1. the trigger is pulled (what is supposed to happen), 2. someone modified the gun so this feature was removed (Darwin at work), 3. a catastrophic failure of the trigger assembly/firing mechanism (act of God) or 4. someone deliberately tried to get the gun to fire without the trigger being pulled (Darwin at it again).
I carry "Cocked and locked". Great small pistol. I use a couple different holsters. Never had an issue with the safety disengaging unintentionally.
Nothing wrong with carrying the 938 without a round in the chamber, but you had better train well and often.
To each his own but I've never liked the idea of a single action handgun with just a thumb safety.
Different than a 1911 with a thumb safety and a grip safety and different that a handgun with no safety but with a heavier trigger pull.
"If there is trouble, I stay here to help you. For your father -- for your father."
Reading through the posts in this thread, I see no mention of one premium safety feature available on a P938 and a few other 1911 style guns including my beloved Star PD, uncocked and locked. This is one of the few choices I personaly feel safe from NDs while carrying a round chambered. People are not robots or infallible. NDs do happen. One police chief has NDed himself twice in 20 years.
I most often carry Glocks with a full magazine and open chamber, but a 1911 round chambered uncocked and locked is acceptable to me.
I would not bring a gun to a fistfight, but I would bring a pair of brass knuckles to sway the odds in my favor. O wait, brass knuckles are against the law. Given lemons, make lemonade. If attacked in a fistfight, a handgun across the chin will knock someone out, and a carry permit is a permit to use a handgun for self protection. If I shoot someone attacking me with their fists, I go to jail and more than likely will be the subject of criminal and civil procedings. Chambered, uncocked and locked means one has more choices in how they can use a gun for self protection.
I hope and plan to never present a handgun for self protection or the protection of my family, but we live in a world where politicians allow predictors to walk among the good people. I never walk around unaware, so I feel cocked and locked is more ready than I need or feel comfortable with 24/7, and it gives me fewer ways I can safely use my handgun to protect myself.
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John Browning designed the 1911 to be carried cocked and locked. That is the way I carry mine and that is the way I carry my Sig P238. The 1911 was not designed to be used as a "club" in a fist fight! It was meant to be fired in a gun fight. And that is the only way I will use mine! It isn't a club, it isn't a hammer, it isn't a substitute for brass knuckles!
Live to ride, ride to live. Harley Road King And keep a .45 handy Kimber Custom TLE II
As I type this I'm packing a SIG P238 cocked and locked in an IWB at 3:00 under an un-tucked T-shirt.
The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety), by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary. by H. L. Mencken
Think about it. With your typical striker fired pistol, you need only one thing to go wrong if you carry with one in the chamber. That is, someone (you) pull the trigger when you did not intend to do so. And typically again, the average similar gun has a trigger pull of 5 to 7 pounds. With the 938 carried cocked and locked, you need TWO things to go wrong. First, someone (you) must disengage the safety. THEN, someone must pull the trigger. The trigger pull on the 938 from the factory is around 7.5 to 8.5 pounds, as heavy or heavier that the striker fired gun. I would submit the 938 cocked and locked is the safer of the two choices.
Best way to win a gun fight? "That's easy, don't show up."
"Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything."
-- Wyatt Earp