To quote Chris Rock: "Sure, it feels safe inside..."

This is a discussion on To quote Chris Rock: "Sure, it feels safe inside..." within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; "...but what about all those "jerks" waiting outside with guns?! They know you ain't got one ." I think of this quote whenever I think ...

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Thread: To quote Chris Rock: "Sure, it feels safe inside..."

  1. #1
    Member Array LaraCroft10's Avatar
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    Thumbs down To quote Chris Rock: "Sure, it feels safe inside..."

    "...but what about all those "jerks" waiting outside with guns?! They know you ain't got one."

    I think of this quote whenever I think about all the places I won't be able to carry.

    Most of the places I frequent do not allow guns, whether because of State or Federal law, or because of the law that respects a business owner's decision to not allow firearms. Since deciding I want my CCW, I have kept an eye out, and have noticed a LOT of places disallow firearms.

    Bars, stadiums, the Metrolink (our city's public transportation), liquor stores, the airport, casinos, amusement parks, and even some grocery stores around here I've noticed prohibit firearms. And I don't work somewhere where I can carry because I'm a nurse at a hospital. I'll be going back to school soon....OOPS, can't take it there, either. Can't take it at all if I cross the Illinois border (which I do occasionally as my boyfriend is from there). This literally leaves a very small fraction of my life to put this to use.

    It just sucks because the places that I feel like I need it the most are when I'm out at the bars (there is a LOT of crime on our main bar strip downtown) or when I walk to the Metrolink station a few blocks from my apartment (there's always shady stuff going down in that direction, too - including a forcible rape a couple months ago). This is when I feel the most vulnerable as a young woman, yet I can't carry protection here. I know that I can leave it in my car, but that won't do me any good downtown. If anything, my car will get broken into and it stolen (this is a big problem in the City. Criminals breaking into cars looking for guns. My car has been broken into twice) Not to mention liquor store robberies and whatnot...it's like criminals frequent the places they know people won't have guns, just like Chris Rock's song suggests.

    Getting my CCW is still something I want to do, but my boyfriend raised the good, "What's the point?" question after realizing all the places that prohibit it.

    Now, I'm not sure if it's like this everywhere, but carrying any of these places except on public transportation is not a criminal offense - they can just ask you to leave. So....do you carry anyway? Hope it's concealed enough that they won't notice? It says you can bring a gun to bars "with consent." What does that mean? Ask the manager? That seems like an awkward conversation (remember, I live in a very urban environment where very few people carry). I don't think I want to have a gun on me when I've been drinking anyway; that just seems unsafe.

    It's just kind of discouraging. It really DOES raise the question...what is the point?

    Thoughts?
    Last edited by Rock and Glock; October 3rd, 2012 at 10:49 PM.

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Thunder71's Avatar
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    Your 'CCW' is your gun (Concealed Carry Weapon).

    I won't tell you to break the law, but outside of federal buildings, schools, etc... aren't those signs just for people who are carrying illegally?. ;)

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    Carry where you are not prohibited by law, and if the owner of a private business ask you to leave (for whatever reason) then leave. If their sign doesn't have the weight of law then carry and keep it concealed.

    But the main thing is to not do stupid things, hang out with stupid people, or go to stupid places....ie don't drink and carry, don't hang out with friends who start trouble, or go to places where trouble usually starts.
    RichB70, archer51, Fitch and 1 others like this.
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    Senior Member Array GeorgiaDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder71 View Post
    I won't tell you to break the law, but outside of federal buildings, schools, etc... aren't those signs just for people who are carrying illegally?. ;)
    This. Missouri doesn't give signs the force of law, so you could technically carry it on you as long as you aren't in a place that is prohibited by the state (or fed) so long as you don't mind leaving if you get made and asked to leave.
    BigJon10125 likes this.
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    Member Array blanco64's Avatar
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    You listed a lot of really good reasons to move someplace else.

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    Senior Member Array kerberos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blanco64 View Post
    You listed a lot of really good reasons to move someplace else.
    +1

    Nurses are like certified mechanics...

    You can pick any city over 50,000 in the U.S. and get a job on any given day.

    It's worth considering at least.

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    Member Array LaraCroft10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder71 View Post
    Your 'CCW' is your gun (Concealed Carry Weapon).
    Semantics. Colloquialisms. You know what it meant. Technically I haven't bought a CCW so it still makes sense in context.

    don't go to places where trouble usually starts.
    So....avoid everywhere? That's the whole point of wanting to do this. The whole city is rampant with crime. I go out and have a fun and safe time all the time, (aside from drug-induced sexual assault at a nightclub, and the aforementioned car break-ins, I've gone scot-free for the last 6 years here) but trouble could start anywhere.

    The state Highway Patrol documentation I'm reading says: "Carrying a concealed firearm in any of the above specified places is not a criminal act. However, you can be denied access from the premises or removed from the premises." (that doesn't include public transportation, I believe that's federal)

    So as long as I leave if they ask me to, I'm fine to do it, even though the law explicitly says not to? It just seems weird. What if I end up having to use it? Even if it's in self-defense, am I going to get in trouble because technically I wasn't allowed to have it there in the first place? If I use it in justifiable self-defense, but had a couple drinks at a bar or restaurant, will that incriminate me, too?

    I guess these are questions that would get answered in the CCW permit class, but I'm just so boggled by it all, I wanted to ask here.

    You listed a lot of really good reasons to move someplace else.
    Oh, but there are exponentially more reasons to like it here. =]

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    Member Array LaraCroft10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kerberos View Post
    +1

    Nurses are like certified mechanics...

    You can pick any city over 50,000 in the U.S. and get a job on any given day.

    It's worth considering at least.

    Oh, I've considered it. The number one place I'd want to move though is....CHICAGO. So clearly that won't work out for me in this situation, either. ;) Boyfriend wants to hightail it to Colorado. But I'm a born and bred Missouri girl, and my aging parents and grandparents are here, so it's hard to leave (plus the whole starting school soon thing).....

    I don't know, moving is always kind of up in the air for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LaraCroft10 View Post
    Semantics. Colloquialisms. You know what it meant. Technically I haven't bought a CCW so it still makes sense in context.


    So....avoid everywhere? That's the whole point of wanting to do this. The whole city is rampant with crime. I go out and have a fun and safe time all the time, (aside from drug-induced sexual assault at a nightclub, and the aforementioned car break-ins, I've gone scot-free for the last 6 years here) but trouble could start anywhere.

    The state Highway Patrol documentation I'm reading says: "Carrying a concealed firearm in any of the above specified places is not a criminal act. However, you can be denied access from the premises or removed from the premises." (that doesn't include public transportation, I believe that's federal)

    So as long as I leave if they ask me to, I'm fine to do it, even though the law explicitly says not to? It just seems weird. What if I end up having to use it? Even if it's in self-defense, am I going to get in trouble because technically I wasn't allowed to have it there in the first place? If I use it in justifiable self-defense, but had a couple drinks at a bar or restaurant, will that incriminate me, too?

    I guess these are questions that would get answered in the CCW permit class, but I'm just so boggled by it all, I wanted to ask here.

    Oh, but there are exponentially more reasons to like it here. =]
    Become very familiar with local, state and federal laws, weigh the potential risks and rewards of a given behavior, and govern yourself accordingly. I would NOT rely on a permit class for accurate legal information. I say that as someone who teaches the class.
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    VIP Member Array nedrgr21's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaraCroft10 View Post
    Can't take it at all if I cross the Illinois border (which I do occasionally as my boyfriend is from there).
    ...it's like criminals frequent the places they know people won't have guns, just like Chris Rock's song suggests.
    ... but my boyfriend raised the good, "What's the point?" question after realizing all the places that prohibit it.
    ... I don't think I want to have a gun on me when I've been drinking anyway; that just seems unsafe.
    Good questions. I don't worry about signs, only places where it's explicitly illegal to carry. Not only is carrying while intoxicated unsafe, it's also illegal as I imagine a case could be made that carrying is handling: MO ReSt 571-030 (5) Has a firearm or projectile weapon readily capable of lethal use on his or her person, while he or she is intoxicated, and handles or otherwise uses such firearm or projectile weapon in either a negligent or unlawful manner or discharges such firearm or projectile weapon unless acting in self-defense. The point is you have the ability to choose what's really important to you. It's too bad more people haven't figured out what Rock has. Oh yeah, minus 2 pts for interacting with IL The boyfriend needs to be [assimi] educated.

  12. #11
    Member Array LaraCroft10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedrgr21 View Post
    MO ReSt 571-030 (5) Has a firearm or projectile weapon readily capable of lethal use on his or her person, while he or she is intoxicated, and handles or otherwise uses such firearm or projectile weapon in either a negligent or unlawful manner or discharges such firearm or projectile weapon unless acting in self-defense.
    There's the clincher. So it sounds like I could still use it in self-defense, regardless of my sobriety (or lack thereof). The kicker is the poor judgment that comes with drinking - maybe what I think in drunk-mind is self-defense isn't actually legally self-defense.

    I think I'm a pretty good judge of myself, though - just like I know when it's not okay to get in a car, I imagine I'd know when it is and isn't okay for me to carry a firearm. We'll see, I guess.

    Oh yeah, minus 2 pts for interacting with IL. The boyfriend needs to be [assimi] educated.
    He isn't "big into guns", but he accompanied me to the range the other day like a good sport and shot a few. He's hunted before. It's just not really his thing (yep, Democrat, too! BUT he respects the other side, and luckily he's supportive of this endeavor of mine, even though his knee-jerk reaction was not to be)

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    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Lara...

    KNOW the laws... of your state... of the states you plan to visit...

    You can carry in Illinois... It can't be loaded, the magazine has to be out of it.... But you can carry the same way any Illinois resident with an FOID card can carry (or transport) as long as you have your state's carry permit.

    Know the laws of your state.... Backwards and forwards...

    A trespass (most cases) is a misdemeanor and that's if you don't leave once requested... and I don't believe there is any federal mandate on public transportation...except commercial aircraft... I could be wrong there, but I don't use public transportation... If I did, I would study the law as it applies to me.
    It could be worse.
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    A lot of these questions can be asked when you take your training course. As to businesses being posted there in your area, I've found a lot of businesses post without really knowing the law and do not post properly. MO spells out the requirements for signs:

    Any private property whose owner has posted the premises as being off-limits to concealed firearms by means of one or more signs displayed in a conspicuous place of a minimum size of eleven inches by fourteen inches with the writing thereon in letters of not less than one inch.
    Even if posted, violating a private business sign, all they can do is ask you to leave.

    If you haven't been to this site: http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/missouri.pdf pay it a visit and read up on MO regulations. Good info to know.
    wraithls1 likes this.
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    Senior Member Array GeorgiaDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaraCroft10 View Post
    There's the clincher. So it sounds like I could still use it in self-defense, regardless of my sobriety (or lack thereof). The kicker is the poor judgment that comes with drinking - maybe what I think in drunk-mind is self-defense isn't actually legally self-defense.

    I think I'm a pretty good judge of myself, though - just like I know when it's not okay to get in a car, I imagine I'd know when it is and isn't okay for me to carry a firearm. We'll see, I guess.
    It's my opinion that you shouldn't drink when you are carrying, but others might find that too extreme. I look at carrying a firearm as a life-style choice which requires sacrifices in other areas of my life, such as the clothes I wear, the places I go, and even the drinks I take. If you avoid things that could put you in a compromising situation (such as having to shoot someone while buzzed or drunk), you'll probably be better off. Basically what pgrass said about not doing stupid things in stupid places with stupid people. Just my $0.02.
    First Sgt likes this.
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    Thanks everyone.

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