Took my carry class yesterday + mother-in-law disapproves
This is a discussion on Took my carry class yesterday + mother-in-law disapproves within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; With this guy: Concealed Carry 2 per week. Beginner Handgun $50 class Visa/Mastercard.
It was great!
Greg is a leader in Missouri's concealed carry legislation. ...
November 4th, 2012 11:26 AM
Took my carry class yesterday + mother-in-law disapproves
With this guy: Concealed Carry 2 per week. Beginner Handgun $50 class Visa/Mastercard.
It was great!
Greg is a leader in Missouri's concealed carry legislation. He was big into getting concealed carry legal in Missouri in 2003, as well as developing our Castle Doctrine. Been instructing for 20 years, a great teacher.
It was a little tough because staring at a screen for 8 hours is hard! I'm not used to that and got a killer headache by the end of the day. But the information was good. Some of it was repeat info because I took his intro class already, but I'm always okay with reinforcing information.
I liked that he concentrated on how to prepare to use your firearm in self-defense. We didn't spend a lot of time on safety, holstering (none on holstering, actually), etc. He showed us drills to practice to develop muscle memory for how to fight in a combat situation. I found it extremely helpful. And of course, got LOTS of information on Missouri law, which is extremely important.
About half the people in the class (there were 6 of us, a nice small class) had not bought a firearm yet, so they were asking him advice on it. I got really nervous when he was strongly suggesting the revolver, going on about how unreliable semi-autos can be, etc...I thought, "Man, last time I was here he was pleased that I wanted an LCR, wait until he sees what I ended up with!" But he positively gushed over it. "Oh man, a Sig!!! Wow, this is beautiful. You can't go wrong with a Sig." I'm really happy it got his approval on it. That makes me feel even more comfortable with my choice.
I'm so excited to turn in my application tomorrow! He said they have 45 days to do it, but they usually turn it around much quicker than that. We'll see!
As a side note: while I was gone all day doing this, boyfriend was doing family stuff, and told his family where I was. His mother adamantly disapproves (re thread title: I know she's not legally my mother-in-law, but pretty damn close).
She's known about me doing this for awhile, but yesterday was the first time she had been vocal with me about it. She's very opinionated and has no qualms sharing them with people. She is told me she is EXTREMELY uncomfortable with me doing this, and doesn't understand why I feel the need to carry a firearm. "What, do you live in an unsafe area or something?!" I told her that nowhere is 100% safe. She told me, "You know, it's been proven that people who carry guns are more likely to shoot themselves than successfully use it for defense." I told her that was a myth. (she watches a lot of TV...she is also a staunch, staunch liberal, and while we pretty much agree 99% of the time, I'm thinking guns is somewhere we disagree). I told her a statistic I had found yesterday that says there are way more deaths by physicians every year than there are accidental gun deaths (and more gun owners to boot), and she said, "Oh, I don't doubt that." And I said, "But you trust your life with a physician." And she didn't have an answer to that.
She was also lecturing me about how I need to keep it locked up when I'm at home (first of all, it's not like we have kids, it's just boyfriend and me, I don't think she realizes that I intend to always carry it on me, until I go to bed, but I wasn't going to tell her that...I just nodded). I tried to explain to her that I'm taking a lot of training on this, practicing, and going about this extremely safely and responsibly. I don't think she cared. I mentioned how I am extremely familiar with the laws, as well, now. She said, "You need to make sure to teach Devin (boyfriend) all these laws, too." I said, "A lot of them don't apply to them because he's not carrying. But I'm going to be sure to go over the Castle Doctrine laws with him."
"What's a Castle Doctrine?"
So....I know that a lot of this stems from the fact that she is SO not used to this. Devin and his family are from Illinois. If she lived in Missouri, I wouldn't carry in her house solely because she's so uncomfortable with it, but it's a moot point because she's across the state line, anyway.
I just wish I knew a way to make her more comfortable about this. I'm going to do it whether she likes it or not, but I do care about her (she's basically family and we interact with her fairly often), and I don't like that she's so upset about it. When I walked in the house yesterday, I don't think she was doing it consciously, but as she was telling me how uncomfortable she was about this, she was actually moving away from me, like in fear (I didn't even have a gun on me!). Which kinda hurts, you know?
Any advice? Any material I can give her that focuses on educating and making anti-gun people comfortable with this?
Thanks y'all. Kudos if you read all that.
Proud owner of a Sig Sauer P238 SAS Explosive Space Modulator.
"I played the powerless in too many dark scenes. And I was blessed with a birth and a death, and I guess I just want some say in between." - Ani DiFranco, "Talk to me Now."
November 4th, 2012 11:35 AM
Well I actually read all that. I wish I had some magic advice but I don't. My only advice is that time will take care of it. Don't take it personally that she moved away from you. Don't bring it up either. She will, over time, get used to it and it won't be an issue. If it is, the b/f should help explain that he's good with it, etc. Some people just need time to adjust.
November 4th, 2012 11:37 AM
i say congrats and welcome to sig ownership. as far as the mother in law thing i can only say that in the end it is your constitutional right to do so. hopefully you will never have to use the sig in defense of yourself or family.
November 4th, 2012 11:44 AM
I have never successfully changed an anti's mind. I think once they are set in their ways they are not changing just like they can not change our minds. My MIL is not really anti but doesn't see the need for my wife and I to carry all the time. We have discussed it many times and it always ends up with everyone agreeing to disagree. I think the best idea is just not bring it up keep yourself and your family protected and let MIL be. Good job on the training BTW!
November 4th, 2012 11:51 AM
I usually present it as a "better have it and not need it" type of thing - like seatbelts, and fire extinguishers. You don't need them until you really need them. Same thing with carrying a gun. Good luck!
November 4th, 2012 11:54 AM
November 4th, 2012 11:59 AM
I grew up in a gun friendly home, but only long guns. When my dad found out I was carrying daily He just about flipped. Concealed guns were just for outlaws! But about 10 years later He bought his first revolver. And my Wife's family are very anti gun. One year while they were down visiting I took the boys out shooting and our 17 year old nephew got to go. His parents were very angry that he held a gun, but He survived it and now Hes planning a trip to see us and is asking if I can teach his daughter to shoot. Shes 10 this year. So don't sweat it, these things blow over quickly enough. DR
November 4th, 2012 12:01 PM
It can be a very sensitive/emotional issue for some people. I usually don't bring it up - even with family. People I talk openly about it with are the ones that I know share my opinions on the subject. The only person in recent memory that I have spoken to about it (cautiously) was my mother - and I have been carrying for 5+ years already without saying a word.
November 4th, 2012 12:16 PM
You will never change her mind until it affects her directly. Hopefully, it doesn't cost her her life to gain enlightenment. The thing for you to do is to keep practicing until it is instictive to draw, safety off, aim, fire. If the time arrises, you must be as ready as possible...all else is just noise.
When the time is right, you might ask her a question. "What sort of fear will go through your mind when the shooter shows up and starts to execute one person after another and your turn is next?" Never happen? It happens almost monthly lately and when more people have nothing to lose, they lose it, so the frequency of violence will go up as the economy and morality reach bottom.
Retired AF pilot, Vietnam FAC 1967-68
November 4th, 2012 12:20 PM
In laws are going to be in laws. You have to laugh at their bad jokes, complement them on food you may not like, and even agree when you disagree sometimes.
It sounds like you handled it well. You answered her questions and you weren't confrontational about it. I wouldn't bring it up again unless she does. Be respectful and kind, that's all you can do. You can't control the opinions of others.
November 4th, 2012 12:42 PM
You need to 'train' your husband to keep his mouth shut. Concealed means 'concealed.'
I had to do it with my father, but for somewhat different reasons. He was thrilled and thought it was really cool. I might not even have told them about it except that I do have guns in the house and my home defense gun is not locked up. They stay with me and we have night-time saftety procedures to discuss. I took him shooting, he'd never shot handguns before.
Ex: We'd go into a restaurant, where I cannot enter the lounge area armed, and mention casually that I'll sit in the waiting area until our table is ready...and he starts making comments and jokes that can be heard at a distance. I had to have some serious (more than one) talks with him about the serious consequences, (legally and safety-wise) of ever discussing or even acting like I'm armed. I told him to think about it like my cell phone...it's just there, no big deal, let it go.
As for the MIL, since you cant carry in her state anyway, I'd politely ignore the subject until she forgets about it. Change the subject, leave the room, whatever. Make your position clear to your fiance (if you havent already) and make him take the heat from his mother.
Fortune favors the bold.
Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.
The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)
November 4th, 2012 12:44 PM
You'll never convince the unwilling. My recommendation is to just go about your business and your life and ignore her criticisms as much as you possibly can. As time goes on she may realize that you're still the same girl.
It's sad to see how the language has been distorted... a "liberal" point of view once upon a time meant "open-minded." One wishes that a liberal (in the classic sense) would be understanding and accepting of a different viewpoint.
she is also a staunch, staunch liberal
NRA Endowment Member
NROI Chief Range Officer
November 4th, 2012 12:51 PM
how does your bf feel about you carrying? He is the only one that matters, what his mother feels means nothing, unless he shares her feelings. people now days worry too much about what others think of them, you have a right to protect yourself and feel safe, if others dont like it too bad for them. You will never change her mind, she may say she if fine with it but she will always think you are one of those "gun nuts". I wouldnt worry about it.
November 4th, 2012 12:56 PM
Only those who are more likely to shoot themselves. All the rest, not so much. That's the one little tidbit that gets lost in the myth-making racket.
Originally Posted by LaraCroft10
You're smart. Presuming she's just as intelligent, I'm sure you can figure a way to have a series of simple, non-threatening discussions focusing on the simple facts and realities about the world in which we live today. Crime is everywhere, mostly, and most particularly in and around larger cities such as where you live. It's an inescapable fact. The major metro stats aren't anything that can easily be ignored, 'cause they're so in-your-face. Everyone's got a story, or knows someone who's got one.
Originally Posted by LaraCroft10
Some thoughts on what you can try with her ...
Start with that: those situations you're specifically aware of, those that were nearby where you live or work, those that occurred directly to your friends or colleagues. The fact of the matter is, you've got a family to protect.
It is about knowing that crime can occur at ANY time. Almost certainly, when it comes, it'll be at the drop of a hat, a complete surprise. Being unarmed in such a situation is as sure a way to fail the test as there is.
Calling 911 is fine, but one has to survive long enough in order to be capable of making that phone call. No violent felon that I know of is going to take "five" to allow you to make such a call. Beyond which, one has to survive long enough for the cavalry to arrive once after you've made yourself understood on that call. If you fail to last that long, what's the point? Which is why so many people have found utility in being armed wherever it's lawful to do so. A few of them get taken down anyway. Many, many more of them live to tell about it. Of which group of attacked victims would your MIL prefer you to be?
Having the ability to withstand attack and last long enough for the cavalry to arrive DOES NOT EQUATE TO BEING A CRIMINAL. Having the ability to defend yourself also doesn't mean you're going to magically morph into a fanged felon, either.
It's simply that you're willing to fully step up to the responsibility of being a citizen who's charged with her own survival and the survival and well-being of her family. Can't be doing that with a telephone and pixie dust, not when the predatory felons in our midst are so violent and armed. It's just not sufficient anymore, if ever it was.
At some point, faced with such irrefutable, simple logic, I believe she'll come around. Might be years, but no utterly insupportable position that lacks any shred of evidence to back it can stand forever, despite any embarrassment it might cause her to retain her position even though she becomes aware of the lunacy of continuing to believe such drivel. Still, while she's got it, it's her opinion. She came to it via certain information and "facts," as she sees them. She was taught to think this way. It'll take some time to think her way out of that intellectual straightjacket she's in. IMO, you can help best by assisting her slowly, methodically, calmly, bit by bit, until she herself realizes the futility of the old arguments.
Good luck. It ain't easy, with "anti" family members. Most of us have to deal with at least a few of them.
Last edited by ccw9mm; November 4th, 2012 at 02:54 PM.
Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
self defense (A.O.J.).
How does disarming
the number of victims?
Reason over Force: Why the Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos)
NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.
November 4th, 2012 12:57 PM
Congrats! I took the class from Greg also, and thought he did a great job. I live in the city & my permit took 19 days to process. There's a box on the form you'll fill out that asks what states you've lived in. From what I've heard, the more states the longer it takes to process your application. Mine had 5.
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