proficiency on more than one gun (HK)
This is a discussion on proficiency on more than one gun (HK) within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Specifically, I have a P2000sk LEM and am looking at getting a DA/SA USP/c in .45 anyways, it has taken a long time for me ...
October 5th, 2006 09:35 PM
proficiency on more than one gun (HK)
Specifically, I have a P2000sk LEM and am looking at getting a DA/SA USP/c in .45 anyways, it has taken a long time for me to get used to the LEM, and am still working on it. I am wondering if I get a DASA if I will really be able to be proficient with both. In a stressful situation, will I reset the trigger of the LEM if I have been shooting the C&L USP? With enough practice, is it possible, or should I just not shoot the USP much since the P2k is my carry piece?
I have thought of trying to convert my LEM to DASA, but I don't think it's possible, and I'd rather not sell the P2k in favor of another P2k that is DASA...
October 5th, 2006 09:49 PM
VIP Member (Retired Staff)
First off - and in a general sense - I think it is good for us all to be able to handle successfully any gun we encounter. It might one day be well useful.
BUT ....... from a carry POV I strongly recommend familiarization with but one platform only and get darned good with it. If one system is not easy to master then change to one you manage well.
I carry the 226 and so am DA/SA - and I have to say now - in IDPA I hardly notice that first DA pull - and while my first shot will often go a bit higher - it is still an OK hit. Practice but - with what works for you, and stick to that.
Chris - P95
NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.
"To own a gun and assume that you are armed
is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."
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October 5th, 2006 09:50 PM
all depends on length of trigger reset i suppose i havent shot a Hk with lem but i have carried it and a glock and 1911 and feel comfortable with any of the triggers
yes you can have a da/sa converted to lem or order it that way
October 5th, 2006 10:18 PM
In a stressfull situation all that trigger control you practice won't be there any way so don't worry about that.
Other than that if you are not 150% comfortable with your carry choice find one that you are comfortable with.
October 5th, 2006 10:49 PM
Thanks for the input so far. I have to say, I think that's why we practice trigger control so it's second nature when the stress is there.
I am comfortable with the P2k, more so than with any other gun I have. I just need to practice some more to get 100% with the LEM trigger...
October 5th, 2006 11:41 PM
I carry several guns but all are double action with no safety - Kahr, S&W snubbies, Kel-Tec. Which I carry depends on attire. Though I enjoy my 1911, Beretta DA/SA, Ruger Mark III at the range, for carry I don't want to be confused in the heat of the moment about whether there is a safety, decocking, major trigger differences, etc. While my autos do have a lighter trigger pull than my snubbies of course, all are longer and heavier than any of my SA triggers. I also shoot several hundred rounds a month with each, so each feels familiar the instant its in my hand. So far I have never tried to shove a magazine into my revolvers or use a speed loader on an auto.
October 6th, 2006 12:17 AM
I have a P2000 w/lem, a da/sa gun and some glocks and other DAO for carry (among others). If you are going to carry the LEM, then get something that has similar manual of arms (consistant trigger pull, no safety, no decocker). If you want to try the da/sa, try it and then determine what manual of arms you want and stick w/ that.
The LEM trigger is good, however, it will amplify a users propensity to flinch on firing (due to looooong first trigger pull, NOT heavy, just loooong). Most people who I let try my HK usually initially shoot low due to anticipation and flinching.
October 6th, 2006 09:23 AM
As a trainer, I maintain a strong opinion that whenever possible people who carry a firearm for protection should be not only familiar with but also proficient multiple weapons platforms.
Originally Posted by Hobbes
By this I mean single-action, traditional double-action, Others (Glock).
One of my main reasons for this is based upon that although unlikely it will ever occur to the average person, should you ever encounter a situation where you need to pick up a weapon other than your own, you will NOT be hesitant to use it for lack of understanding.
I have trained people who have never handled a weapon in thier lives and have decided that they are going to enter the realm of civilian contracting in some of the more lovely areas of the planet. While certain types and models of firearms are more common than others in these parts of the world, there also exist several different types of weapons which if they are untrained in thier use can and will present problems.
While it would be impossible to train anyone in every weapon out there, it is NOT impossible to train and practice with a cross section of the action types.
Bryan S. Williams
Williams Associates Protective Services, LLC
October 6th, 2006 09:53 AM
Ditto on the above sentiments that training on the main carry platform is best. However, there is value, IMO, in being familiar with all platforms.
Me, I train seriously with a Browning BDM, which has a safety-down decocker / slide-release. Of course, that means the safety's on if the slide is released, requiring the safety to be flicked up in order to fire. Most find that strange. I've put tens of thousands of rounds and years of practice through it, so it's most comfortable to me. My new primary, a CZ 75 P-01 compact, is a no-safety decocker model with separate slide release. The Kahr PM9 is similar to that, but without decocker. The KelTec P3AT has no slide lock/release or safety. I make a point to practice enough with my two carry weapons to be intimately familiar and have strong muscle "memory" for the features. Haven't fired them in defense, so far, so I suppose I don't know for certain that it has made all the difference. I hope so.
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October 6th, 2006 10:29 AM
It has been said by several posters here, be proficient with multiple platforms. Be an expert in the one you use.
I spend equal time with all of mine when I have them at the range, even the .22's.
Not to sound boastful here, but there are only a few handguns and calibers that I haven't shot. Same could be said of many members here.
While the possibility may be remote that you should ever need to pick up and use whatever you find (battlefield gun) it is still a possibility.
Take the French Resistance during WWII. .45ACP Liberators were dropped by U.S. forces for them to use. Story goes that it took longer to load the gun than it did to make the gun. They would use it for very close up work where they would kill a German with the gun, ditch it, then take the German soldiers weapons and ammo. There was no previous familiarity with the guns. They had to learn on the run.
We have the luxury of not having someone else shooting at us while we learn the gun, so take the advantage and learn as many as possible, all the while conentrating on the platform that you carry as that will be your primary until it becomes rendered unuseable.
October 6th, 2006 10:30 AM
I have been shooting since the 60s and have been through about everything I could afford ie 1911s , wheel guns, Glocks ect and have carried most of them I try to keep one of each on hand and shoot them when I go to the range this way I can carry whatever I want and I believe we should be familiar with anything we might need to use
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