Going to the southcenter mall carry or not carry - Page 3

Going to the southcenter mall carry or not carry

This is a discussion on Going to the southcenter mall carry or not carry within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Last Christmas Eve there was a gang shooting in the parking lot and entrance of our mall. Over 100 rounds fired Signs carry no weigh ...

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 31 to 43 of 43
Like Tree30Likes

Thread: Going to the southcenter mall carry or not carry

  1. #31
    Member Array Badbullgator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    310
    Last Christmas Eve there was a gang shooting in the parking lot and entrance of our mall. Over 100 rounds fired
    Signs carry no weigh in Florida, you may be asked to leave for any reason
    Consealed is consealed
    My safety is more important to me than the wishes of the cooperation or person that owns our local mall (or any other store).

    Police: Assault Rifle Used in Florida Mall Shooting, One Man Dead | Video | TheBlaze.com
    A word to the wise isn't necessary, save it for the stupid


  2. #32
    VIP Member Array 9MMare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Outside Seattle, WA
    Posts
    3,309
    Southcenter Mall has a bad reputation for crime to begin with. I dont go there, but there are malls closer to my house anyway.

    As someone said...why punish all the business owners because of a mall policy? True, they did sign a lease agreeing to it but then leave it up to them to enforce it if they, somehow, see a concealed weapon.
    Fortune favors the bold.

    Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free.

    The thing about "defense" is that it has practically nothing to do with guns. (As passed on by CCW9MM)

  3. #33
    Member Array CrackpotBob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Auburn, WA
    Posts
    26
    Signage or not, it is legal to cc at Southcenter. I have, and always will carry whenever I go there. If I'm made and asked to leave, then I will. If you conceal well you have nothing to worry about.
    ironmike86 and Badbullgator like this.

  4. #34
    Member Array Tangochuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    North Olympic Peninsula
    Posts
    59
    Just for grins I sent an email to the Southcenter customer service. Took a couple days for them to respond, but here's the exchange:

    From: Southcenter <Southcenter@us.westfield.com>
    Date: November 20, 2012, 9:58:35 AM PST
    To: <tangochuck@me.com>
    Subject: RE: Speak Up: Customer Feedback

    Hi Tom,

    As per our Westfield Code of Conduct posted at our mall entries, "The following are not permitted on Center property: ... Possession of any items that could be used as a weapon, including but not limited to: firearms, explosives..."

    Kind Regards,
    -Westfield Southcenter


    -----Original Message-----
    From: [mailto:tangochuck@me.com]
    Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2012 9:43 PMw
    To: Southcenter
    Subject: Speak Up: Customer Feedback

    Are firearms expressly prohibited on Mall property...and if so, is there obvious signage to that effect at entrances?

    Thank you

  5. #35
    Member Array Brademan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    150
    Thanks for that exchange between you and the Westfield folks.

    I assume that, since you did not print it, there was no mention of their signage quoting or referring to the Revised Code of Washington statutes? According to Washington law, I believe a business can post any sign about firearms but, unless it references or quotes the applicable section of the RCW, it amounts to a simple request and does not have weight of law.
    Brademan
    Special Projects manager - ACLDN

    American Militia - charter member, NRA Life/Benefactor member
    LEAA Field Rep, Aikidoka, motorcyclist, plain speaker, straight shooter
    My other nickname is "3-Knife"

  6. #36
    Member Array Bardo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    148

    Going to the southcenter mall carry or not carry

    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    I'd carry.

    For myself, when out and about in a state in which "no this-or-that" type signs hold no force of law, I carry everywhere it is lawful for me to do so. If requested to leave, then refusal will basically equate to criminal trespass (depending on the wording of the state statutes). If in a state where pretty little signage does carry the force of law, I go elsewhere.

    Up to you, whether concern over the property owner's concern is sufficient for you to refrain from carrying, despite the lawful nature of your activity. Seems to me that the benefit of such a concern hardly balances the cost of being unarmed if SHTF. Which is, IMO, why we carry.
    This is something I don't understand. In Arizona, handgunlaw.us States that signs have the force of law, but they also state that violating a sign simply results in a charge of criminal trespass. Nothing more. This is basically what you're saying here as well in relation to states where the signs don't have the force of law.

    What exactly does this "force of law" term actually mean? Does it mean that you will be charged with criminal trespass if you carry into such a location? Or does the owner of such an establishment have to ask you to leave before such a charge is brought?

    This is very confusing to me.

  7. #37
    Member Array HardBall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    W. Washington Kitsap CO.
    Posts
    204
    A quote from US Carry .....


    What places are off-limits when carrying a concealed weapon in Washington?

    (a) The restricted access areas of a jail, or of a law enforcement facility, or any place used for the confinement of a person (i) arrested for, charged with, or convicted of an offense, (ii) held for extradition or as a material witness, or (iii) otherwise confined pursuant to an order of a court, except an order under chapter 13.32A or 13.34 RCW. Restricted access areas do not include common areas of egress or ingress open to the general public;

    (b) Those areas in any building which are used in connection with court proceedings, including courtrooms, jury rooms, judge’s chambers, offices and areas used to conduct court business, waiting areas, and corridors adjacent to areas used in connection with court proceedings. The restricted areas do not include common areas of ingress and egress to the building that is used in connection with court proceedings, when it is possible to protect court areas without restricting ingress and egress to the building. The restricted areas shall be the minimum necessary to fulfill the objective of this subsection (1)(b).

    In addition, the local legislative authority shall provide either a stationary locked box sufficient in size for pistols and key to a weapon owner for weapon storage, or shall designate an official to receive weapons for safekeeping, during the owner’s visit to restricted areas of the building. The locked box or designated official shall be located within the same building used in connection with court proceedings. The local legislative authority shall be liable for any negligence causing damage to or loss of a weapon either placed in a locked box or left with an official during the owner’s visit to restricted areas of the building.
    The local judicial authority shall designate and clearly mark those areas where weapons are prohibited, and shall post notices at each entrance to the building of the prohibition against weapons in the restricted areas;

    (c) The restricted access areas of a public mental health facility certified by the department of social and health services for inpatient hospital care and state institutions for the care of the mentally ill, excluding those facilities solely for evaluation and treatment. Restricted access areas do not include common areas of egress and ingress open to the general public;
    EXCEPTION: this section does not apply to any administrator or employee of the facility or to any person who, upon entering the place or facility, directly and promptly proceeds to the administrator of the facility or the administrator’s designee and obtains written permission to possess the firearm while on the premises.
    (d) That portion of an establishment classified by the state liquor control board as off-limits to persons under twenty-one years of age; or
    EXCEPTIONS: proprietor of the premises or his or her employees while engaged in their employment.

    (e) The restricted access areas of a commercial service airport designated in the airport security plan approved by the federal transportation security administration, including passenger screening checkpoints at or beyond the point at which a passenger initiates the screening process. These areas do not include airport drives, general parking areas and walkways, and shops and areas of the terminal that are outside the screening checkpoints and that are normally open to unscreened passengers or visitors to the airport. Any restricted access area shall be clearly indicated by prominent signs indicating that firearms and other weapons are prohibited in the area.

    (2) Cities, towns, counties, and other municipalities may enact laws and ordinances:

    (b) Restricting the possession of firearms in any stadium or convention center, operated by a city, town, county, or other municipality, except that such restrictions shall not apply to:

    (i) Any pistol in the possession of a person licensed under RCW 9.41.070 or exempt from the licensing requirement by RCW 9.41.060; or

    (5) The perimeter of the premises of any specific location covered by subsection (1) of this section shall be posted at reasonable intervals to alert the public as to the existence of any law restricting the possession of firearms on the premises.
    My EDC G27 gen. 4
    Favorite range gun G23 gen. 3

    NRA Life Member

  8. #38
    Senior Member Array bzdog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Seattle(ish), WA
    Posts
    749

    Going to the southcenter mall carry or not carry

    Quote Originally Posted by Bardo View Post
    This is something I don't understand. In Arizona, handgunlaw.us States that signs have the force of law, but they also state that violating a sign simply results in a charge of criminal trespass. Nothing more. This is basically what you're saying here as well in relation to states where the signs don't have the force of law.

    What exactly does this "force of law" term actually mean? Does it mean that you will be charged with criminal trespass if you carry into such a location? Or does the owner of such an establishment have to ask you to leave before such a charge is brought?

    This is very confusing to me.
    The difference is in some states it is illegal to ignore the signs. If you are caught you likely will be charged because you are breaking the law.

    In WA, signs posted by property owners basically just mean "we don't want you". Sort of like "no shoes, no service". If you are caught you have not broken the law and the only think they can do is ask you to leave. Only if they ask you to leave and you do not comply are you guilty of a crime -- tresspass. Keep in mind the property owner has the right to ask whomever they wish to leave for most any reason. If they don't like your tee shirt, whatever. If asked, you must leave or you are tresspassing.

    -john


    Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer. :-)
    Last edited by bzdog; November 24th, 2012 at 03:52 PM.

  9. #39
    New Member Array Itsanaddiction's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    JBLM, WA
    Posts
    12
    I was there when the Tacoma shooting happed. It was like my first week here in WA. All my Army buddies carry at the mall. I was always the out cast for not ever going to get my CPL till now that is. I know one time we were sitting at the food court and i guess a friend of mine was sticking out. An older man just tapped him looked at his waist band and nodded. Lakewood aka lakehood and Tacoma aint the best wink. Seattle is 50/50.

  10. #40
    Member Array badger54's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Renton, WA
    Posts
    79

    Re: Going to the southcenter mall carry or not carry

    I try to avoid the mall and shop online but sometimes going there is unavoidable. I remeber walking in there once earlier this year and seeing a ton of security guards running through one of the doors. At first I thought it might have been a medical emergency but soon came to realise that there was a group of 20 guys fighting out side of Sears. I promptly left the mall at this point, before things escalated.

    Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk 2

  11. #41
    Ex Member Array gunslingergirl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    162
    RE the Washington question - I'd carry as usual. If for some incredibly stupid reason you drop your gun and it goes skidding across the polished floor and 300 people see it. I'd say I didn't see the sign, and leave if asked. Better to ask forgiveness than permission.

    As for the Arizona question. I also live in AZ. In AZ a sign does carry force of law and you can lose your CCW if you refuse to comply when informed.

    However it is conceivable that you didn't see it. Many businesses have a small sign in the corner of a window where it's easy to miss. In that case, and in general you are only in trouble if you make trouble. If you just apologize and say you didn't see the sign and leave if asked it is unlikely anyone is going to push the issue, since they would have to bring charges, perhaps provide video tape and go to court multiple times, etc. Why would anyone bother unless you are a jerk about leaving.

    And if you are CCW, nobody should know you have a gun anyway. Most of these signs are for Kalipornika wacko's who come to AZ to experience their open carry rights. That scares customers, especially in the big city.

  12. #42
    Member Array brazildsm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    castle rock WA
    Posts
    80
    Quote Originally Posted by Soccerfly View Post
    So I'm off to Seattle southcenter mall tomorrow I have ccl and carry IWB do I carry regardless or do I follow the mall rules about no firearms prohibited.?
    well that would be up to you. If u have a cpl then conceal your firearm and go on about your business.

  13. #43
    Distinguished Member Array BigStick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Gig Harbor, WA
    Posts
    1,455
    I've carried there plenty of times. If for some reason a mall employee were to see your gun, they could ask you to leave. As long as you do, there is no problem.
    Walk softly ...

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

can i conceal carry in malls in washington state

,

can you carry a gun in the mall

,

can you carry concealed weapon tacoma mall

,

carry concealed pistol in tocoma mall

,

concealed carry mall wa

,

gun laws in tacoma mall

,

pa concealed carry in mall

,

sex scandal at southcenter mall

,

south center mall gun free

,

south center mall gun free zone

,

southcenter mall gun policy

,
state of wa concealed carry in the mall
Click on a term to search for related topics.