CCL And Churches - Page 2

CCL And Churches

This is a discussion on CCL And Churches within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/interne...rms/chl-16.pdf Page 38 and page 39: PC 46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER... (b)(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other ...

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  1. #16
    VIP Member Array 1MoreGoodGuy's Avatar
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    http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/interne...rms/chl-16.pdf
    Page 38 and page 39:
    PC 46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER...
    (b)(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established place of religious worship...
    (i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.
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  2. #17
    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RugerRules View Post
    Hey Farronwolf.... Thanks a BUNCH for you input. My info came also from my CHL instructor. Guess he needs some "updating" as well.
    You are saying... as long as there is NO 30.06 sign posted on my church, then there is NO Prohibition to CHL holders carrying in the church?

    That is JUST what I was looking for.

    I appreciate all the input.
    That is correct.

    You're welcome.
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  3. #18
    GH
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    We can't carry in my church. It's attached to a school & in WI it's a felony to carry on school grounds even if classes aren't in session. We 're checking into that for exemptions.

    There are certain exemptions about guns in school - an authorized firearms presentation/demonstration, police officers & security officers hired by the school. That would also go for the church that has a school on it's property. We're hoping...
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by RugerRules View Post
    RevTracy said "...Any BG (bad guys) walking into my church will not be walking out... "

    "Save 'em or Kill 'em" hey... that could be our next promo... hehehehe

    Ya know? I think I'll have my ushers start carrying... JUST THINK of the offerings we can TAKE then! WooHoo! (people accuse us churches of "robbing" 'em anyway. Let's give them something to REALLY complain about!) We are On A ROLL now. hehehe
    Oh my...now you've got me really thinking outside the box...hmmmmm...

  5. #20
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    I'm on staff at a church in Indiana that also has a preschool, which would prevent me from carrying. However, some smart Indiana lawmaker had placed in the statute this exemption:
    (2) A person who has been employed or authorized by:
    (A) a school; or
    (B) another person who owns or operates property being used by a school for a school function;
    to act as a security guard, perform or participate in a school function, or participate in any other activity authorized by a school.

    Our board of Elders has authorized me to be on the security team and carry my firearm on church property, so I carry everyday.

    It's also this part of the state law that would let school corporations approve teachers to carry in schools without having to have new legislation passed for that purpose.

  6. #21
    Senior Member Array Jemsaal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by calpoly12000 View Post
    I also have to say that even Jesus agrees with the right to defend yourself. Jesus himself said, "He who lives by the sword, dies by the sword." Matt. 26:52. Jesus also said, "But now whoever has a purse or a bag, must take it and whoever does not have a sword must sell his cloak and buy one." Luke 22:36

    I believe there are a few more cases where even in the New testament, Jesus encourages his followers to defend themselves. When it comes to someone threatening you with your life, it's not a "turn the other cheek" moment. That is a moment where you exercise your right to live and protect yourself.
    Actually, neither of those quotes are about "self defense." I won't say anything else since this forum discourages such posts, from what I understand, but I would if you would like, I'll share in a PM why I come to that conclusion.

    We are encouraged to "give a defense" but that is expressing a defense of faith. The early church never defended themselves in this way. They would defend passively, by leaving town or hiding, but when confronted, would assume it was the will of God to become a martyr and willing go to their death as Jesus did His. It's the reason that if ever confronted about my faith, I choose to follow His example and do the same. That's the testimony of the Gospels and the history of the early church.
    As far as my "right to live and protect myself" goes, that might be an American right, but as a Christian, my rights are much more limited by my faith. I have a right to freedom of speech, but I don't have a right as a Christian to say anything I want. I have a right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, but as a Christian, I don't have the right to use liberty in any way that would be immoral or even harmful to my witness as a Christian. The rights of an American should NEVER be confused with the rights of a Christian.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jemsaal View Post
    Actually, neither of those quotes are about "self defense." I won't say anything else since this forum discourages such posts, from what I understand, but I would if you would like, I'll share in a PM why I come to that conclusion.

    We are encouraged to "give a defense" but that is expressing a defense of faith. The early church never defended themselves in this way. They would defend passively, by leaving town or hiding, but when confronted, would assume it was the will of God to become a martyr and willing go to their death as Jesus did His. It's the reason that if ever confronted about my faith, I choose to follow His example and do the same. That's the testimony of the Gospels and the history of the early church.
    As far as my "right to live and protect myself" goes, that might be an American right, but as a Christian, my rights are much more limited by my faith. I have a right to freedom of speech, but I don't have a right as a Christian to say anything I want. I have a right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, but as a Christian, I don't have the right to use liberty in any way that would be immoral or even harmful to my witness as a Christian. The rights of an American should NEVER be confused with the rights of a Christian.
    Jemsaal, please PM me. I honestly enjoy philosophical discussions on this topic. I've thought about this topic quite a bit and based on my box o' rocks intellect, I've come to a decidedly different conclusion. The reason being that as soon as Kansas clarified the State's stance on concealed carry in church, I began carrying--but not without some introspection and research into the Catholic Church's views on self defense and the defense of others.
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  8. #23
    CJM
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    A few posts in this thread are quite sad. If I wasn't willing to ventilate a dirtbag in church, I wouldn't be willing to anywhere else either. I'm not waiting to find out if the person entering my church and shooting is doing it because of a hatred of Christians or just because they are a nut job, I'm just gonna do my best to stop the attack, no matter the motive.
    "Thank you for the advice Mr. Vice President, but I'll be keeping my AR15 for defending my home and family."

  9. #24
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    Amen to that..

  10. #25
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    With the blessings of both pastors I carry in church, and at every church event. The Lord helps those who help themselves.
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  11. #26
    mkh
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    Church carry is legal in Florida.

    As head of security I carry and I know of about 30 others in the church that have their permits. I don't question them about carry so some may not but I do,know of several that do carry a church.

  12. #27
    Senior Member Array RKflorida's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jemsaal View Post
    Legally, I think it should be up to the church.

    Spiritually - I have a hard time using force to defend something that is "God's to defend." I feel the same way about myself. If I'm confronted by deadly force and in the course of the confrontation I find out it's about my faith, my weapon is staying holstered.
    Maybe God doesn't want to use a miracle to defend the church, but instead He wants to use His people.
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  13. #28
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    If you are unwilling to defend yourself using your own gun, does that mean you would also be unwilling to involve the police ( because they might use their guns to defend you?

    There is an interesting book named "Shooting Back" by Charl Van Wyk you might want to read. He is a minister and carries all the time. When armed terrorists entered the church and began shooting people, he shot back, causing those cowards to flee. Some of his scriptural references are out of context but the majority are properly referenced.
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  14. #29
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    I use to be a member of a concealed carry website.One of the monthly magazines,i got once,had a preacher on the front cover,who carried during services.I THINK he may have been from Ohio,but not sure.I'm guessing,he probably didn't mind.

  15. #30
    Senior Member Array RKflorida's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by okiegunguy View Post
    With the blessings of both pastors I carry in church, and at every church event. The Lord helps those who help themselves.
    The bible teaches the opposite. This saying comes from Algernon Sydney in 1698 in an article titled Discourses Concerning Government. The bible teaches God helps the helpless.
    WINTEJER000 likes this.

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