Mandatory traing states for CHL vs non training states

This is a discussion on Mandatory traing states for CHL vs non training states within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; OK, I see a lot of folks saying that mandatory training and mandatory qualification is needed and should be required for a CHL. They state ...

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Thread: Mandatory traing states for CHL vs non training states

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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Mandatory traing states for CHL vs non training states

    OK,

    I see a lot of folks saying that mandatory training and mandatory qualification is needed and should be required for a CHL. They state that it is for the protection of the public at large and for the protection of the person carrying the gun.

    Please, somebody show me stats, hard evidence, that mandatory training states are better than non mandatory training states as far as
    1. The wrongful use of a firearm by CHL/CCP holder
    2. Inicidents of arrests for trespassing by CHL/CCP holders
    3. Errant shots fired by CHL/CCP holders
    4. Illegel use of a fireamr by CHL/CCP holders EDIT:such as brandishing, bad shoots, ects....NOT crimes committed malichievously)

    Feel free to throw in other data.

    I understand that it may be the opinion of folks that training should be mandatory or not. But...if that is your opinion and you think it should be law then I would hope that you guys have the data to prove it. I for oone do not like laws neing made with anecdotal evidence or one or two spectacular events. That is like pushing through the AWB because of very isolted cases of misues of madman using those weapons.

    Laws should be made to protect the public and their should be data to back it up.

    OK...ball is in your court.
    Last edited by suntzu; February 1st, 2013 at 12:15 PM.
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    Short answer: If someone is legal to own a firearm, they should be legal to carry it.
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    Facts? We don't need no steenkin' facts!

    Oh, wait, it's the antis that don't need facts.

    I think your request will be very hard to fill, as there are few sources of any such data. Texas puts out a report on crimes and does indicated what portion are committed by CHL holders - as you would expect, they are at a lower rate than the general populace.

    Add to that the fact that permit holders don't all carry, or carry all the time, and the proportion of active carry may vary widely by locale.

    All we might really have to go on are anecdotal reports and the few news reports of bad behavior. Which, by the way, are few and far between.

    I know of no incidents in South Dakota, a no training required state.
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    There you go ruining another discussion by requiring people to cite relevant facts to support their argument.

    You know this won't get interesting until we start ignoring the facts, right?

    Just think of all the children that die from gunshots...
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    Member Array MJClark's Avatar
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    I personally think one should get training, but I don't think that it should be a requirement. I don't have any stats either way. Right now, I am scheduled to take my CPL class, but I would like to carry my gun until that class occurs. However, because of the laws here in Michigan, and the now open carry law in my City, my guns sit in a locked safe.
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    VIP Member Array Stevew's Avatar
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    I live in a state that does not require trianing to carry. When I see someone post a comment that trianing should be required I automatically make the assumption that they had zero experience with firearms before they started carrying. If a person has many years experience and good trianing by their parents and uncles and grandfathers and friends parents then why should they be required to attend trianing. The last class I attended (it was this month), was totally worthless, a waste of time and money. If a person does not know how to handle a firearm and they intend to handle a firearm they should act responsible and get so trianing. The trianing should not have to be conducted in a formal class setting in order to be valid trianing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MJClark View Post
    I personally think one should get training, but I don't think that it should be a requirement.

    I agree with this, I think that not getting at least basic safe gun handling training is stupid, but I don't think that it should be required
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    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sdprof View Post
    Facts? We don't need no steenkin' facts!

    Oh, wait, it's the antis that don't need facts.

    I think your request will be very hard to fill, as there are few sources of any such data. Texas puts out a report on crimes and does indicated what portion are committed by CHL holders - as you would expect, they are at a lower rate than the general populace.

    Add to that the fact that permit holders don't all carry, or carry all the time, and the proportion of active carry may vary widely by locale.

    All we might really have to go on are anecdotal reports and the few news reports of bad behavior. Which, by the way, are few and far between.

    I know of no incidents in South Dakota, a no training required state.
    This thread is not about anti's..it is about the attitude and opinions of folks on this forum that have professed that mandatory training should be a requirement. I just want them to put facts on the table since they advocate it should be law. You don't make law based on "I feel this is the right thing to do". You make law based on facts and how it will afffect public safety and blah blah blah.
    It is perfectly OK to say IMO....but when you advocate it should be a requirement then they need to pur the proof up.
    RickyD likes this.
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    Training is not required in GA, but like many others I personally think it is a good idea. I am actually taking a class this weekend and plan to take additional classes in the future. With this said, I am training because I think it is wise. I do not think it should be up to anyone else (insert government) to tell me it is necessary. I agree with Suntzu that there should be hard evidence and legitimate research before passing a law.

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    GH
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    I haven't seen any statistics dealing with illegal or negligent activity by those allowed to carry a firearm, concealed or open. I wouldn't have any ideas where to even find them.

    I believe that the 2nd Amendment should be the only permission that a person needs but if training is required it should be classes on the state's laws on concealed carry & firearms in general as well as safely handling a firearm. In those classes actual hands-on training should be strongly urged & offered at low cost. Proficiency in shooting safely & being able to hit your target should be stressed but not mandated by law.
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    Nice to have--firearm proficiency training, but not mandatory.
    Should have--training and familiarity with CC and lethal force laws. You really need to know what the reprecussions of your actions are.

    I don't feel like doing a lot of research that you can do, but, althought the outcome has not been finalized, there is the Zimmerman case as well as the guy who shot into the car with the loud music, both "questionable" incidents of SD shootings. There are others, but in agreeing with you, for every one incident, there are millions of daily "non-"incidents. You'll never seen a prime-time media report on the million plus Florida CWFL holders who obeyed the law and had no significant incidents.
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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Has anyone here ever been around anyone, that makes them feel uncomfortable when that person handles firearms? With your children or spouse around?

    In my opinion, mandatory training should be required to carry among the public. I have seen too many clueless idiots carrying guns because it's " the thing" right now.

    We have all read about them right here on this forum, and occasionally, we talk to them on this forum.

    Do you really want your kids or wife in the same store, let alone the same isle as some of these morons? I don't.
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    GH
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    I have yet to see a news headline - "millions carried firearms legally today and there were no incidences!" lol
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    Mandatory training, no but I still think that someone should have some training before toting around a gun in public.

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    I believe in personal responsibility. WA is a shall issue state (as I think all should be). I would encourage individuals to get training. The administration is trying to inject mental issues into the general public, let alone firearms owners. The pshchiatry bs has been driven by CIA money. The truth is they want everybody on ssri inhibitors.

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