Sighting problems...

Sighting problems...

This is a discussion on Sighting problems... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I wasn't quite sure where to post this this question, so hopefully some here might have some useful tips. I took my CCW class the ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array foreveryoung001's Avatar
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    Sighting problems...

    I wasn't quite sure where to post this this question, so hopefully some here might have some useful tips.

    I took my CCW class the other day and noticed a problem that I've never faced before.

    With all of the shooting I've done, I've always closed my left eye while aiming, so I could better aquire my sights and target. During the live-fire protion of the class, the instructor really wanted me to work on keeping both eyes open. While we worked on some point shooting (another new technique to me), I was as accurate as anyone else on the range. When we got to using the sights, with both eyes open, I was struggeling big time.

    My instructor told me I was having problems because I was not fully dominant in one eye over the other, but he was obviously busy and couldn't work with me much on overcoming my problem. He ended up teling me to shoot however I was comfortable, but encouraged me to work on it at my own pace. That's was fine, but he didn't offer me any advice on how to "work" on it.

    Has anyone else struggled with this? and if so, what exercises have you done to help compensate for this? Any advice would be great.


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array JimmyC4's Avatar
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    As a starting point, take a simple test to determine which eye is dominant. Try this one, and see what you come up with... http://www.archeryweb.com/archery/eyedom.htm
    "It's a big gun when I carry it, it is also a big gun when I take it out” – Clint Smith

  3. #3
    Senior Member Array razorblade's Avatar
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    A modification that you can to to the above link. Hold your hands out like described, or make the "OK" sign with your hand (it doesn't matter which) and extend your arm. Find something to put into the middle of the hole, such as a door knob and begin to pull the "OK" sign towards your face while keeping the door knob between your thumb, index, and web of hand. pull it all the way to your face. If you kept the object in between your fingers and pulled your hand to your face, it should be over whatever eye you are dominant with.

    It sounds like you have a hard time retaining focus between your two eyes. Once your right eye picks the sights up, your left eye immidiately wants to take over. The problem is that your left eye isn't in-line with the sights. A good trick to strengthen your dominant eye is to put clear scotch tape over the shooting glasses of your weak eye. Your left lense will be kind of clear, but just fuzzy enough for your brain to force itself to rely on your right eye. Now with your taped-glasses setup, practice your range routine as usual, but now keep both eyes open. If you keep up with it while at the range, and during dryfiring at home, within a month, you'll notice a difference.

    Good luck
    Last edited by razorblade; November 28th, 2006 at 11:54 PM.

  4. #4
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    I have a similar problem and it is not because I am not fully dominant in one eye or the other. It is because I am right handed and left eye dominant. Discovering this has explained alot of the problems I have had in my life. I cannot drive a nail unless it is between my feet. At that point it does not matter which eye is dominant. I have worked on using an isosceles in stead of a weaver stance so that the gun would be more in the middle of my body and that helps some, but not enough. I shoot much better left handed whether both eyes are open or not. Unfortunately at age 58 I am not flexible enough to change with hand I shoot with. Besides that left handed shooters constantly complain about guns not being made for them.
    George

    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein

  5. #5
    Senior Member Array razorblade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dr_cmg View Post
    I have a similar problem and it is not because I am not fully dominant in one eye or the other. It is because I am right handed and left eye dominant. Discovering this has explained alot of the problems I have had in my life. I cannot drive a nail unless it is between my feet. At that point it does not matter which eye is dominant. I have worked on using an isosceles in stead of a weaver stance so that the gun would be more in the middle of my body and that helps some, but not enough. I shoot much better left handed whether both eyes are open or not. Unfortunately at age 58 I am not flexible enough to change with hand I shoot with. Besides that left handed shooters constantly complain about guns not being made for them.
    A lot of right hand/left eye people resort to twisting their head or switching hands. Next time you're at the range, try this: when completing your draw, keep the gun in your right hand, keep your head straight, but bring the gun further to the left side of your left eye. Since you said your draw is completed at the center of your body, it will be a minor movement from the center, to the left side. At first it will feel odd, but it works (or so I've been told). There are two (that I know of) IPSC Grand Masters, Phil Strader and Matt Burkett that use this technique because both have the same problem. Infact, Burkett teaches this technique in one of his instructional videos.

  6. #6
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    I'm in a somewhat similar situation (right eye is stronger, but not totally dominant). What's worked pretty well for me is to train my body, rather than my eyes. During dry fire I pick out a spot on my target and bring the gun up from low ready (or drawing from the holster) so the sights align with the point I'm looking at. As long as I present my right eye with the proper sight picture, it takes over and I can use it to focus on the front sight. However, if I don't get the sights lined up correctly, I still sometimes have to close the left eye for a second or I'll end up spending a long time fishing around for the proper sight picture. Hitting the proper sight picture every time isn't easy, but with a lot of practice, it is possible.

    Remember, the body aims, the eye verifies.

  7. #7
    Member Array tj1231's Avatar
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    I agree with razorblade. I'm right handed, left eye dominant. Modify your stance with the gun more under your left eye. It works for me, and it feels more stable to me because I drop my left elbow down and closer to my body. I am curious about the tape over the glasses, because I USED to be right eye dominant! Let us know what you find out.

  8. #8
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    Another way to tell which eye is dominate is to hold up a finger, point it at something with both eyes open, close each eye one at a time. The one that sees the finger pointing the same place as both eyes is dominate. If your rt handed and rt eyed dominate just practice, while shooting or dry firing or just practice sighting

  9. #9
    Member Array foreveryoung001's Avatar
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    Thanks for all of your suggestions.

    Just to clarify, I am right handed, and when trying to detremine which eye is dominant, using some of the suggested techniques, I am right eye dominant... but not always.... sound weird, but a good 20% of the time, my left eye is the one that will focus on the object. It baffeled my instructor a bit too.

    I have seen that tape idea in practice before. A gentleman I was shooting skeet with had his glasses taped as such, but I never thought to ask why. I will give that a go my next time at the range.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Array tegemu's Avatar
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    My friend, a new shooter, is right handed left eye dominant. What suggestions do you have for rifle shooting?
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence in their behalf. - George Orwell

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array PapaScout's Avatar
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    Foreveryoung001,

    I also have the "issue" that you mention. What I have done is rotate my head slightly to the left.

    For me my nose is big enough to sort of block the left eye from seeing the front sight. :) But I can still keep the eye open.

    Hope this helps!
    "If you so much as bunny hop I'll cut your heart out!" Billy Bob Thornton in The Last Real Cowboys

    "I carry a gun for the same reason that I carry health insurance and a cell phone - be prepared."

  12. #12
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    Lots of draw and sight practice with both eyes open. It was kind of a struggle for me , after shooting competition for so many years to shoot both eyes open.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by razorblade View Post
    A lot of right hand/left eye people resort to twisting their head or switching hands. Next time you're at the range, try this: when completing your draw, keep the gun in your right hand, keep your head straight, but bring the gun further to the left side of your left eye. Since you said your draw is completed at the center of your body, it will be a minor movement from the center, to the left side. At first it will feel odd, but it works (or so I've been told). There are two (that I know of) IPSC Grand Masters, Phil Strader and Matt Burkett that use this technique because both have the same problem. Infact, Burkett teaches this technique in one of his instructional videos.
    I basically have been doing that with ok results. I tried the isosceles and although it helps I have not gotten to the point where it is natural. It really improves my shooting more than pushing the pistol more to the left. Neither one is a natural feeling, but I believe that the isosceles will be easier to consciously do until the muscle memory takes over. My concern with the isosceles is retention. With the Weaver it is easy to pull the elbow back and have the pistol in a retention position. I haven't yet figured out how to do that in the isosceles. I expect that I will just have to learn to use the same retention position for both.

    I think I am going to try the tape idea for a while though and see if I can force right eye dominance. That would be the best solution.
    George

    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein

  14. #14
    Senior Member Array razorblade's Avatar
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    The trick with using the tape is you have to choose the kind that's transparent, but not completely clear. Scotch tape made by 3M is slightly fuzzy, almost frosted looking. You want to be able to see general shapes, but not sharp detail, like your front sight.

  15. #15
    Member Array symbiont7's Avatar
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    I think I may have this "no true dominant eye" thing too.

    When I do the hole in hand look at a doorknob routine, I get one of two things based on what I focus on:

    If I focus on my hands I see two doorknobs of approximately equal intensity (neither is more solid/clear).

    If I focus on the doorknob I see two holes with the bordering hands of equal intensity.

    Each hole/image lines up with the corresponding side's eye of course, but neither seems dominant. It depends on which image I pick!

    Does this make sense? I tried explaining it to my wife but she explains to me that she sees a definite image and not two. She says she's left eye dominant BTW.

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