Kids, Awareness, & Tactics?

Kids, Awareness, & Tactics?

This is a discussion on Kids, Awareness, & Tactics? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'm hoping that some of you with carrying experience might be able to offer some suggestions with a dilema I encountered today. I'm currently waiting ...

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Thread: Kids, Awareness, & Tactics?

  1. #1
    Member Array foreveryoung001's Avatar
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    Nov 2006

    Kids, Awareness, & Tactics?

    I'm hoping that some of you with carrying experience might be able to offer some suggestions with a dilema I encountered today.

    I'm currently waiting for my CPL (Most likely in January). This morning, my wife and I took our four kids to their bowling league. Since taking my class, I have been trying to be more aware and alert to my surroundings. My kids range in age (4 - 14), so they were spread out across the alley with their perspective teams. My two youngest bowl on the far end, so I sat with them, back to the wall, and view down the whole alley. Now, I don't expect anything to happen during a kids league, but after reading so many stories of "things" happening when least expected, I was really trying to practice some awareness skills. About half way through their first game, I began to wonder if this was really the best area to view things from. My oldest son was down, almost to the other end of the alley, and my daughter, who doesn't bowl, but comes to cheer on her friends, was hanging out towards the middle, right by the counter.

    I was trying to find the happy medium between knowing what my kids were doing, spending quality time with them to cheer them on and help out, and being aware of everone else in the whole place.

    Perhaps it gets easier with practice, but at one point I thought, if something were truly to happen, I might be faced with the decision of who to protect, and thought to myself, "That's it! These kids are never bowling again!"

    Of course I'm going to let them keep bowling, and I'll keep trying to improve my observation skills, but I guess I'm wondering, from those of you with kids, is have you had to change your routines to safe-gaurd them better?

    Sorry for the long post, and I hope, through all of my rambling, that my concerns can be understood. Any thoughts would be great.

  2. #2
    Member Array elance's Avatar
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    Mar 2006
    tulsa ok
    the youngest to the oldest would be my thought , the older ones need to already know better . 20/20 showed little kids 10 and under going with an undercover cop looking for a lost puppy . all of them went even the ones that were just coached about strangers before being loosed on the monkey bars .

    anyway good luck keep em safe

  3. #3
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by foreveryoung001 View Post
    I was trying to find the happy medium between knowing what my kids were doing, spending quality time with them to cheer them on and help out, and being aware of everone [sp] else in the whole place.
    Finding the balance between attentiveness and distraction is the trick.

    The older kids can be introduced to the rationale/logic of attentiveness, and why you're picking certain defensive steps to perform. He/she might even help in that regard. Ideally, the whole family's on the same page, when it comes to security/defense measures. Up to you, given your family dynamics.

    Perhaps it gets easier with practice ...
    Yes, it does. Pick up a copy of Ayoob's "In The Gravest Extreme." It will outline the risks/rewards of carrying. It will help identify the questions you need to be comfortable with. Once all that has gone down, simple practice helps. Taking walks through the neighborhood can help to increase awareness about how hardened folks' homes are, how aware your neighbors are, who should or should not be in the neighborhood. A bonus is that it puts you in-tune with the "pulse" of your own neighborhood, but it's great practice on your own turf. Going through more-crowded areas such as the local park or town square can also be good opportunities. With good shades on, you can discreetly view the scene and practice making judgments about the relative threat levels as you see them. In time, you can become a much better judge of this ... and then begin to ratchet down your stress levels, correspondingly.

    It gets easier, yes.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: Why the Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).

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  5. #4
    Senior Member Array purple88yj's Avatar
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    As the kids get older, teach them to watch thier surroundings. Also teach them to seek cover/concealment with out hesitation. They don't need to she who is causing the problem, just where the problem is and where the nearest exit/cover/safe place is.

    Teach it to them young. Make it a game. Before you and they know it, being threat aware will become part of their lifestyle as well.

  6. #5
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    Array nn's Avatar
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    you have stay with the youngest and hope you taught the others right.

  7. #6
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    Array rocky's Avatar
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    Jan 2005
    I would say same as others too. Watch the youngest first. Once you get in the groove of awareness you will be scanning without really realizing it.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson

    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  8. #7
    Senior Moderator
    Array RETSUPT99's Avatar
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    Central Florida

    Hard Call...

    Closer to the youngest...scanning for both...they should also understand the 'buddy' system.
    They ask you to use the restroom and they do not go anywhere else alone...

    Man, am I glad my kids are grown...

    Stay alert...stay safe!

    Proverbs 27:12 says: “The prudent see danger and take refuge, but the simple keep going and suffer for it.”

    Certified Glock Armorer
    NRA Life Member

  9. #8
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    Array Betty's Avatar
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    I agree with the others - watch the youngest and keep them the closest, and hopefully your good parenting and instruction will help guide the older ones into staying smart.

    My brother and I were very young and playing at the end of the driveway when the neighbor's car slowed down to pull alongside us. We both went on the alert because mom and dad taught us to not trust strangers, not take anything from them, or let them get near us. The woman inside was a parent of a kid we knew from our school bus, and she asked us if we wanted some balloons that were left over from a party. My brother told me to run inside and get mom, and he stepped back out of grabbing distance and told her No Thankyou.

    My brother (pardon my rant here) has decided to try the opposite approach to our parents' parenting (apparently he thought our parents were too strict). As a result, my two nieces, 3 and 5, are a tactical nightmare, not to mention everybody else's public nightmare. They loudly run amok everywhere, and I swear he doesn't know where they are half the time. I'm quite embarassed to be in a restaurant with them. He's let restaurant personnel pick them up and carry them around because those little girls are so cute. Letting the girls run amok and allowing anyone to handle them makes the girls careless and too trusting. A stranger could scoop up one of the girls and leave without him even knowing.
    "Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power." - Yoshimi Ishikawa

  10. #9
    Member Array Harold Green's Avatar
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    Oct 2006
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    My son and I run a monthly polite society shoot where we set up and practice various defensive scenarios. Part of this is discussing what works and what doesn’t with the folks who participate.

    After about half the group had run through one of the scenarios, someone asked, “What do I need to change in addressing this situation if I have my wife and kids with me?” My son has two small daughters and answered this question. Here are some of the points he touched on:

    He and his wife both practice situational awareness. If his wife sees something start to look suspect, she takes charge of the kids. If there are other people around, like in a convenience store, they try to find cover and/or fade into the woodwork. If they are alone, on the street or in a parking lot, she makes sure he’s between them and the threat.

    Unless some specific triggering event happens, she knows to try to remain unnoticed or discreetly exit the situation. If however a triggering event occurs, she knows he will likely become a bullet magnet very shortly, and to get the kids to someplace safe that’s not in his close proximity.

    Here are some triggering events: A potential adversary tells everyone to get on the floor, get in the back of the store, or get in the car. Things will stay low-key until something like this happens. Once it does, it’s time to neutralize the threat.

    So, enlist your wife and your older children into helping you protect the little ones. Talk through some potential scenarios and what their actions should be. Identify triggering events for them, so they’ll know when you’ll take action and what you expect them to do.
    "A gentleman will seldom, if ever, need a pistol. However, if he does, he needs it very badly!" -- Sir Winston Churchill

    "He who goes unarmed in paradise had better be sure that is where he is." -- James Thurber

  11. #10
    Member Array Robin Hood's Avatar
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    Dec 2006

    the family

    I'm Harold's son... (hi dad!)

    Look it comes down to this. Most of what you plan is going to go out the window when all h*ll breaks loose. All the talk and planning is probably going to be deposited in a small mass in everyones shorts.

    Practice beats talk.

    Take your older kids to the range. Let them shoot. Let them see you shoot. Let them know you carry (but impress on them that it's nobody else's business!)

    Then look up your local IDPA club and shoot a match or two with your kids present. Let them see movement and shotting on a range that is not static.

    Then, when you have a plan... find a nice location that you can walk your plan out, while shooting at targets. You may find that under live fire, your plan may need some tweaking.

    This is my perspective and evolves every day. I hope that is creates some constructive thought.

    Keep family safe and free from fear.

    R Hoodie
    "Guns aren’t toys! They’re for protecting your family, hunting dangerous or delicious animals and keeping the King of England out of your face!"
    -Crusty the Clown

    Keep your booger hook off the kill switch 'till you bead the boogeyman!

  12. #11
    New Member Array tdix's Avatar
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    Dec 2006
    cincinnati, ohio
    Just a couple of points from an old timer. Carrying and not having tactical experience is like owning a car and not knowing how to drive. The best piece of advise I ever received was from my first instructor. Get to a tactical instruction course. All law enforcement people would be helpless out there without the knowledge and practice to know what to do with this deadly force on their hip. Yes, it is an awesome responsibility, but without the knowledge of HOW to use it, may be worse than not having it (the weapon) at all.
    Lastly, great quote I just read in BERSA.TALK.
    When asked why I carry..."I carry a gun, because I can't carry a cop"

  13. #12
    VIP Member Array frankmako's Avatar
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    the youngest to the oldest. just hope the older ones got good heads on their shoulders. good luck with such a large group. you need it in today times.
    An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject.

    Red State State of Mind

  14. #13
    Senior Member Array cagueits's Avatar
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    Jun 2006
    Puerto Rico
    +1 on what everyone said.

    Consider giving them a "safety brief" every time you leave the house, when arriving to your destination(s) and before releasing them to wherever they may go hang out by themselves. Keep it simple - if trouble happens (fire, earthquake, crazy man shooting), look for fire exits and leave (not to go looking for you), then meet at "X" place (car/front of store/where the fire trucks/police vehicles are); if you get lost/separated, find a policeman, fireman, or someone with a uniform and let them know you need help (it helps if they know your cel phone # - LE can call you right away); if you are attacked fight the person and never give in (bite, scratch, kick, etc). Repetition is key here, if you don't do it every time, they'll forget/think is not important.

    Keep an eye on the younger ones first.

    Also, consider visiting and getting their ID kit (usually LE/fire gives it away for free at local Nights Out). The kit has a nice ID card style with your child's basic info, a photo and a thumb print. Way I see it is easier to say "my child is lost, here is his info" (give the ID card to LE), rather than going through the whole process of giving description, DOB, hair/eye color, height/weight, etc (ID has all that info). Another thing to always rememeber is the style/color of your child's shoes - in case there is an abduction the clothing can be changed easily, but shoes are seldomly changed.

    My 2 cents.

  15. #14
    Member Array Robin Hood's Avatar
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    Dec 2006
    Check Here

    These things are cool. USB flash stick just for your kids info. The Police/EMS can have your child's complete digital profile in seconds.

    I suggest one on your keychain and one on Jr's belt or backpack.

    Once you have the AMBER stick™ in your possession, you can feel confident knowing that if the unthinkable happens, your child goes missing, you have vital information you will need to provide law enforcement officers instantaneously to issue the local and national AMBER ALERT!

    * The AMBER stick™ also automatically creates "Missing Person" flyers instantly.
    * The AMBER stick™ automatically creates a file to be imported into a law enforcement officer's computer.
    * The AMBER stick™ is password protected and all information is encrypted for total privacy.
    * The AMBER stick™ can hold information about your entire family all on one AMBER stick™ .

    The AMBER stick™ is very simple to use:

    * Plug into any available USB port on your computer
    * Start the program and enter your password to unlock
    * Add your loved one's information and photos
    * Done, close the program and un-plug from computer
    * Attach to your key chain or place in your wallet
    * In case of emergency, plug into police cruiser's computer USB port
    * Give Officer the password to unlock the AMBER stick
    * Law enforcement officer gets all the information they require
    "Guns aren’t toys! They’re for protecting your family, hunting dangerous or delicious animals and keeping the King of England out of your face!"
    -Crusty the Clown

    Keep your booger hook off the kill switch 'till you bead the boogeyman!

  16. #15
    VIP Member (Retired Staff) Array P95Carry's Avatar
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    South West PA
    Lastly, great quote I just read in BERSA.TALK.
    When asked why I carry..."I carry a gun, because I can't carry a cop"
    That is so - so darned good - just love it!
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!." - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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