Can chaperones with a permit carry for band trips?

Can chaperones with a permit carry for band trips?

This is a discussion on Can chaperones with a permit carry for band trips? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hi all. I'm going to be purchasing a concealed carry firearm in the very near future and getting my license. Here's my situation: I am ...

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    New Member Array green_gunner's Avatar
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    Can chaperones with a permit carry for band trips?

    Hi all. I'm going to be purchasing a concealed carry firearm in the very near future and getting my license.

    Here's my situation:

    I am a chaperone for our school's band program. I've done my best to research the law and I know that I CANNOT carry my gun on school property or any school sponsored event, like a football game and their competitions (I'm assuming in the case of the competitions - since they use school buses and school gas to get there). However, we have events that (from my understanding) are NOT school sponsored - like All State and Mid/JanFest and spring trip they take. Would it still be against the law to carry on a non-school-funded trip (even if I have my license)?

    On things like All State and Mid/Jan Fest, these are NOT funded by the school, and instructors and students are either driven by a chaperone or parent. The auditions, practices and performances take place in a school building (again, understanding that I couldn't carry here), but most of the chaperoning takes place either at the hotel or out in whatever city we're in.

    In the case of the spring trip, we use a charter bus (paid for by the band boosters and fundraising), nothing happens at a school, and we're always in some larger, out of state city (in other words, places I'd WANT to have my gun on me!). I know there are certain states where a GA weapons license isn't honored; I'm reading up on that too.

    Sorry for the lengthy post; I just want to make sure I understand where I can legally carry. Any advice would be most appreciated guys!


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    Member Array CCIE33560's Avatar
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    First of all, welcome to the forum. Looking for legal advice that you can take to the bank on a forum is not a great idea. That said, I think in my state I would be on shaky ground here. MN law states that I can not carry in a building that is under exclusive control of a school or schools. Meaning if the local wrestling team rented out a Pizza Ranch I would not be able to carry there. It does say that I can get written permission for the principal to carry in such a situation. I am not sure if it matters if it is funded by the school so long as it is sponsored/organized by a school. YMMV. I would check with a local lawyer to be sure.
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    Ex Member Array stylus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by green_gunner View Post
    Hi all. I'm going to be purchasing a concealed carry firearm in the very near future and getting my license.

    Here's my situation:

    I am a chaperone for our school's band program. I've done my best to research the law and I know that I CANNOT carry my gun on school property or any school sponsored event, like a football game and their competitions (I'm assuming in the case of the competitions - since they use school buses and school gas to get there). However, we have events that (from my understanding) are NOT school sponsored - like All State and Mid/JanFest and spring trip they take. Would it still be against the law to carry on a non-school-funded trip (even if I have my license)?

    On things like All State and Mid/Jan Fest, these are NOT funded by the school, and instructors and students are either driven by a chaperone or parent. The auditions, practices and performances take place in a school building (again, understanding that I couldn't carry here), but most of the chaperoning takes place either at the hotel or out in whatever city we're in.

    In the case of the spring trip, we use a charter bus (paid for by the band boosters and fundraising), nothing happens at a school, and we're always in some larger, out of state city (in other words, places I'd WANT to have my gun on me!). I know there are certain states where a GA weapons license isn't honored; I'm reading up on that too.

    Sorry for the lengthy post; I just want to make sure I understand where I can legally carry. Any advice would be most appreciated guys!
    Don't ask, don't tell.
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    Quote Originally Posted by stylus View Post
    Don't ask, don't tell.
    ^^^ Bad advice.

    Find out the law and follow it. Also if your trips take you out of state, you will need to research the state laws of the state you will be in. GA laws only apply while your in GA. You cross the border you must comply with that states laws.
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    New Member Array green_gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CCIE33560 View Post
    First of all, welcome to the forum.
    Thanks! :D
    Quote Originally Posted by CCIE33560 View Post
    Looking for legal advice that you can take to the bank on a forum is not a great idea.
    I'm still reading up on all this, and worst case scenario is I just don't carry the gun. I'm not going to just take someone's word for it by any means, but hopefully someone who is much more learned than I on this could point me in the right direction.
    Quote Originally Posted by CCIE33560 View Post
    I am not sure if it matters if it is funded by the school so long as it is sponsored/organized by a school.
    I think that's really what I'm trying to find out, since that seems to be the distinction. I haven't seen where that's really been clearly explained.

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    Member Array Rabbit212's Avatar
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    Sure why not I say go for it. Heck take two.
    No I am not a lawyer but I drove by a Super 8 on the way to work today and I am a french model.

    Yes I am coming off as an ahole sorry and welcome, but do you really want to take the advice from strangers on the internet?
    Seriously consult the issuing authority in your state. Most attorneys will not be up to date on such a specific/detailed question and neither will most peace officers, sorry fellow peace officer members but you know its true. We all know your jobs are hard enough without having to study/interpret all this in specific detail. Did I say welcome??? Welcome to the forum sorry for my bad attitude (cluster headache attack). I will get off till I'm more civil.

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    Ex Member Array stylus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by green_gunner View Post
    Hi all. I'm going to be purchasing a concealed carry firearm in the very near future and getting my license.

    Here's my situation:

    I am a chaperone for our school's band program. I've done my best to research the law and I know that I CANNOT carry my gun on school property or any school sponsored event, like a football game and their competitions (I'm assuming in the case of the competitions - since they use school buses and school gas to get there). However, we have events that (from my understanding) are NOT school sponsored - like All State and Mid/JanFest and spring trip they take. Would it still be against the law to carry on a non-school-funded trip (even if I have my license)?

    On things like All State and Mid/Jan Fest, these are NOT funded by the school, and instructors and students are either driven by a chaperone or parent. The auditions, practices and performances take place in a school building (again, understanding that I couldn't carry here), but most of the chaperoning takes place either at the hotel or out in whatever city we're in.

    In the case of the spring trip, we use a charter bus (paid for by the band boosters and fundraising), nothing happens at a school, and we're always in some larger, out of state city (in other words, places I'd WANT to have my gun on me!). I know there are certain states where a GA weapons license isn't honored; I'm reading up on that too.

    Sorry for the lengthy post; I just want to make sure I understand where I can legally carry. Any advice would be most appreciated guys!
    Let's say you find someone who's in a position to actualy have the truthfull fact-based authorative answer about your grey area question.

    The second you ask, a policy will be drafted closing your grey area.

    Therefore, don't ask. Do your own reserch in good faith and make your decision, but don't tell anyone if you choose to carry.

    Don't ssk, don't tell. Always the best policy.

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    New Member Array green_gunner's Avatar
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    Yes, Rabbit. You said welcome, like, three times LOL. Sorry for your headaches, and feel better soon! Hopefully, your mood will improve tremendously too!

    Yes, I get that I should be consulting with someone official. Again, I'm just trying to get some general advice from some (hopefully) more experienced gun toters.

    Anyone have any similar experiences to this at all?

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    Senior Member Array daffyduc's Avatar
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    Do your homework. Interstate travel is easy enough however laws on school associated things vary widely. Handgunlaw.us is your friend. If you believe you can and decide to, make sure your very covert. Laws are open to interpretation and kids have big mouths.

    Welcome aboard!


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    Member Array Rabbit212's Avatar
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    Thanks g.gunner. I really do apologize for that reply it was mean spirited and unwarranted. Thank you for being the better person.

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    Ex Member Array stylus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by green_gunner View Post
    Anyone have any similar experiences to this at all?
    I once took a bus tour. I was armed the whole time. In the middle of the tour while talking to my new single-serving-friend I was told that having a gun on such a bus wss illegal. I had no idea. At the next stop I asked the bus driver about it. He winked and badly pretended he couldn't hear me.

    Later I learned it's not illegal for the passengers, it's illegal for the driver if they know about it. Most drivers don't ask, most passengers don't tell, and the world keeps on spinning.
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    Go to Handgun Laws US, you will find a link to the GA code on lexis. Click on Ch. 16, click on Title 11, click on art. 4, then click on Part 3. Or go to gapacking.org. Now I am NOT giving you legal advice; if you want legal advice, and you want an opinion on whether a band trip as you outlined is a school function, I suggest you strike up a paying relationship with an attorney. You will get what you pay for in the Internet, and you have no way of knowing if some miscreant is intentionally giving you BAD advice. Do not seek legal advice off the Internet. Not trying to be snarky here. In general, if you have a question about a criminal statute, and you are unsure from reading the statute, you should consult an attorney, and not the Internet. Good luck, and don't think ANYTHING I told you is legal advice!

    16-11-127.1. (For effective date, see note.) Carrying weapons within school safety zones, at school functions, or on school property


    (a) As used in this Code section, the term:

    (1) "School safety zone" means in or on any real property owned by or leased to any public or private elementary school, secondary school, or school board and used for elementary or secondary education and in or on the campus of any public or private technical school, vocational school, college, university, or institution of postsecondary education.

    (2) "Weapon" means and includes any pistol, revolver, or any weapon designed or intended to propel a missile of any kind, or any dirk, bowie knife, switchblade knife, ballistic knife, any other knife having a blade of two or more inches, straight-edge razor, razor blade, spring stick, knuckles, whether made from metal, thermoplastic, wood, or other similar material, blackjack, any bat, club, or other bludgeon-type weapon, or any flailing instrument consisting of two or more rigid parts connected in such a manner as to allow them to swing freely, which may be known as a nun chahka, nun chuck, nunchaku, shuriken, or fighting chain, or any disc, of whatever configuration, having at least two points or pointed blades which is designed to be thrown or propelled and which may be known as a throwing star or oriental dart, or any weapon of like kind, and any stun gun or taser as defined in subsection (a) of Code Section 16-11-106. This paragraph excludes any of these instruments used for classroom work authorized by the teacher.

    (b) (1) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (c) of this Code section, it shall be unlawful for any person to carry to or to possess or have under such person's control while within a school safety zone or at a school building, school function, or school property or on a bus or other transportation furnished by the school any weapon or explosive compound, other than fireworks the possession of which is regulated by Chapter 10 of Title 25.

    (2) Any license holder who violates this subsection shall be guilty of a misdemeanor. Any person who is not a license holder who violates this subsection shall be guilty of a felony and, upon conviction thereof, be punished by a fine of not more than $10,000.00, by imprisonment for not less than two nor more than ten years, or both.

    (3) Any person convicted of a violation of this subsection involving a dangerous weapon or machine gun, as such terms are defined in Code Section 16-11-121, shall be punished by a fine of not more than $10,000.00 or by imprisonment for a period of not less than five nor more than ten years, or both.

    (4) (For effective date, see note.) A child who violates this subsection may be subject to the provisions of Code Section 15-11-601.

    (c) The provisions of this Code section shall not apply to:

    (1) Baseball bats, hockey sticks, or other sports equipment possessed by competitors for legitimate athletic purposes;

    (2) Participants in organized sport shooting events or firearm training courses;

    (3) Persons participating in military training programs conducted by or on behalf of the armed forces of the United States or the Georgia Department of Defense;

    (4) Persons participating in law enforcement training conducted by a police academy certified by the Georgia Peace Officer Standards and Training Council or by a law enforcement agency of the state or the United States or any political subdivision thereof;

    (5) The following persons, when acting in the performance of their official duties or when en route to or from their official duties:

    (A) A peace officer as defined by Code Section 35-8-2;

    (B) A law enforcement officer of the United States government;

    (C) A prosecuting attorney of this state or of the United States;

    (D) An employee of the Georgia Department of Corrections or a correctional facility operated by a political subdivision of this state or the United States who is authorized by the head of such correctional agency or facility to carry a firearm;

    (E) A person employed as a campus police officer or school security officer who is authorized to carry a weapon in accordance with Chapter 8 of Title 20; and

    (F) Medical examiners, coroners, and their investigators who are employed by the state or any political subdivision thereof;

    (6) A person who has been authorized in writing by a duly authorized official of the school to have in such person's possession or use as part of any activity being conducted at a school building, school property, or school function a weapon which would otherwise be prohibited by this Code section. Such authorization shall specify the weapon or weapons which have been authorized and the time period during which the authorization is valid;

    (7) A person who is licensed in accordance with Code Section 16-11-129 or issued a permit pursuant to Code Section 43-38-10, when such person carries or picks up a student at a school building, school function, or school property or on a bus or other transportation furnished by the school or a person who is licensed in accordance with Code Section 16-11-129 or issued a permit pursuant to Code Section 43-38-10 when he or she has any weapon legally kept within a vehicle when such vehicle is parked at such school property or is in transit through a designated school zone;

    (8) A weapon possessed by a license holder which is under the possessor's control in a motor vehicle or which is in a locked compartment of a motor vehicle or one which is in a locked container in or a locked firearms rack which is on a motor vehicle which is being used by an adult over 21 years of age to bring to or pick up a student at a school building, school function, or school property or on a bus or other transportation furnished by the school, or when such vehicle is used to transport someone to an activity being conducted on school property which has been authorized by a duly authorized official of the school; provided, however, that this exception shall not apply to a student attending such school;

    (9) Persons employed in fulfilling defense contracts with the government of the United States or agencies thereof when possession of the weapon is necessary for manufacture, transport, installation, and testing under the requirements of such contract;

    (10) Those employees of the State Board of Pardons and Paroles when specifically designated and authorized in writing by the members of the State Board of Pardons and Paroles to carry a weapon;

    (11) The Attorney General and those members of his or her staff whom he or she specifically authorizes in writing to carry a weapon;

    (12) Probation supervisors employed by and under the authority of the Department of Corrections pursuant to Article 2 of Chapter 8 of Title 42, known as the "State-wide Probation Act," when specifically designated and authorized in writing by the director of the Division of Probation;

    (13) Public safety directors of municipal corporations;

    (14) State and federal trial and appellate judges;

    (15) United States attorneys and assistant United States attorneys;

    (16) Clerks of the superior courts;

    (17) Teachers and other school personnel who are otherwise authorized to possess or carry weapons, provided that any such weapon is in a locked compartment of a motor vehicle or one which is in a locked container in or a locked firearms rack which is on a motor vehicle; or

    (18) Constables of any county of this state.
    (d)(1) This Code section shall not prohibit any person who resides or works in a business or is in the ordinary course transacting lawful business or any person who is a visitor of such resident located within a school safety zone from carrying, possessing, or having under such person's control a weapon within a school safety zone; provided, however, it shall be unlawful for any such person to carry, possess, or have under such person's control while at a school building or school function or on school property, a school bus, or other transportation furnished by the school any weapon or explosive compound, other than fireworks the possession of which is regulated by Chapter 10 of Title 25.

    (2) Any person who violates this subsection shall be subject to the penalties specified in subsection (b) of this Code section.

    (3) This subsection shall not be construed to waive or alter any legal requirement for possession of weapons or firearms otherwise required by law.

    (e) It shall be no defense to a prosecution for a violation of this Code section that:

    (1) School was or was not in session at the time of the offense;

    (2) The real property was being used for other purposes besides school purposes at the time of the offense; or

    (3) The offense took place on a school vehicle.

    (f) In a prosecution under this Code section, a map produced or reproduced by any municipal or county agency or department for the purpose of depicting the location and boundaries of the area of the real property of a school board or a private or public elementary or secondary school that is used for school purposes or the area of any campus of any public or private technical school, vocational school, college, university, or institution of postsecondary education, or a true copy of the map, shall, if certified as a true copy by the custodian of the record, be admissible and shall constitute prima-facie evidence of the location and boundaries of the area, if the governing body of the municipality or county has approved the map as an official record of the location and boundaries of the area. A map approved under this Code section may be revised from time to time by the governing body of the municipality or county. The original of every map approved or revised under this subsection or a true copy of such original map shall be filed with the municipality or county and shall be maintained as an official record of the municipality or county. This subsection shall not preclude the prosecution from introducing or relying upon any other evidence or testimony to establish any element of this offense. This subsection shall not preclude the use or admissibility of a map or diagram other than the one which has been approved by the municipality or county.

    (g) A county school board may adopt regulations requiring the posting of signs designating the areas of school boards and private or public elementary and secondary schools as "Weapon-free and Violence-free School Safety Zones."
    -PEF, a Framer with a Steelie...
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    1. All guns are always loaded.
    2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.
    3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target.
    4. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it.

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    New Member Array green_gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit212 View Post
    Thanks g.gunner. I really do apologize for that reply it was mean spirited and unwarranted. Thank you for being the better person.
    Hey man, it's cool. Headaches suck.

    Thank you everyone for your replies! I'll definitely check out Handgunlaw.us and be speaking to someone official soon (as that seems to be the advice from most of you).

    Thanks for sharing the real life experience, stylus.

    Thanks for the read (and disclaimer) PEF! I won't be taking your post as legal advice. ;) I love gapacking.org. Been using that site quite a bit to educate myself. Not sure the section you quoted answers my question, but I'll re-read it later (when it isn't 11pm at night for me).

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by green_gunner View Post
    Can chaperones with a permit carry for band trips?

    I am a chaperone for our school's band program. I've done my best to research the law and I know that I CANNOT carry my gun on school property or any school sponsored event ...
    That might well be all you need to know, right there.

    Know your state's statues, and know your school's and district's policies. Know them cold.

    You say these trips are specifically with the school band. I don't imagine those who'd have a problem with your carrying would see the distinction between it being on-campus or off-, or being funded by this or that source. It's a "school" event (with the school kids), something for the school's band, and I'd say that in most folks' minds that would qualify under the prohibition.

    Determine whether it's a school/district prohibition, which could result in disciplinary action against you (and potentially black-balling in your chosen profession), or whether it's also unlawful in your state to do so. Might impact your choice.

    And if it's really bugging you, perhaps make an inquiry to the school's administration or the district on policies related to security and protection for folks on such trips, whether any resources can be leveraged and/or chaparones/staff can take precautions. Of course, depending on how specific you get, such a discussion could let the cat out of the bag regarding your carry status, something you might not want to do. Folks have been ousted out of knee-jerk fear, when the wrong folks hear of such things. You know, folks who delusionally imagine that guns=crime by themselves, refusing to appreciate that well-armed staff can increase protection and safety over their charges. Up to you.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
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    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
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    New Member Array lmlures's Avatar
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    I am a high school principal who also carries within the confines of the law in NC. In my opinion a band trip where the school uniforms are worn is a school sponsored event, regardless of funding source.

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