Cover question

This is a discussion on Cover question within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Ok, so on my evening walk I was looking at objects that could be used for cover. As I passed a telephone pole a question ...

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    New Member Array Jc93230's Avatar
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    Cover question

    Ok, so on my evening walk I was looking at objects that could be used for cover. As I passed a telephone pole a question came to mind.

    Given that most bad guys out there do not train regularly, would it be better to be exposed firing around the left side of the pole when facing a bad guy using the theory that he would probably be pulling shots to the left and low(assuming a right handed bad guy)? It would seem he would be more prone to hit the pole. Here we go!

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    If you weigh over 80 pounds I'm wondering if a telephone pole could "cover" all but one side of you?????
    Getting old was not on my list of "things to do" in the Golden Years!

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    New Member Array Jc93230's Avatar
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    Well, personally probably not. But the question applies to whatever cover you had where there was an option to shoot from either side. I would take partial cover over none any day though!

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    Any cover will provide a smaller target for the criminal; even a telephone will cover some vital organs possibly saving your life.
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    Distinguished Member Array dangerranger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShooterGranny View Post
    If you weigh over 80 pounds I'm wondering if a telephone pole could "cover" all but one side of you?????
    Granny, stand behind a Telephone pole and tell me if it covers more or less than the average bullet resistant vest. We send our boys in blue toward gunfire with just a postage stamp sized vest everyday. DR

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    Sorry - I know that partial cover is better than none. I really didn't mean to side track the OP's question about which side to expose.

    I'm not adept at standing sideways like a real Weaver stance when I shoot and that is probably the reason for my question. I was wondering if a telephone pole would be wide enough to give you a choice if you have to use more of an isosceles stance???

    dangerranger's comment (posted while I was writing this) about the pole probably covering more than a bullet resistant vest is a good point.
    Getting old was not on my list of "things to do" in the Golden Years!

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    Whatever you choose for cover, don't think about it too long.
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    VIP Member Array StormRhydr's Avatar
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    there was a pretty famous video...6-8 years ago, of an attorney who was attacked by his client after leaving court. The BG was some old man, who otherwise wouldnt have appeared very threatening, but for the pistol in his hand, shooting at the attorney at near point blank range.

    I think the BG emptied the gun. The attorney got behind a VERY thin sapling. I mean it prolly wasnt 2 inches wide. The idiot shooting at him would sort of jab the gun forward, and pull the trigger. The atty would move to the other side of the sapling, and the bg would jab his gun on that side of the sapling, and pull the trigger. This went on till the gun ran dry, I think.

    The atty was shot up some, but was still on his feet, and lived. No one misunderstand my point; The atty could easily have been killed by anyone who knew anything about guns & shooting. Or even the fool shooting at him who got in a lucky shot.

    But, with little or nothing to work with, that atty used what he had to his utmost advantage, and "walked away" from it all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by StormRhydr View Post
    there was a pretty famous video...6-8 years ago, of an attorney who was attacked by his client after leaving court. The BG was some old man, who otherwise wouldnt have appeared very threatening, but for the pistol in his hand, shooting at the attorney at near point blank range.

    I think the BG emptied the gun. The attorney got behind a VERY thin sapling. I mean it prolly wasnt 2 inches wide. The idiot shooting at him would sort of jab the gun forward, and pull the trigger. The atty would move to the other side of the sapling, and the bg would jab his gun on that side of the sapling, and pull the trigger. This went on till the gun ran dry, I think.

    The atty was shot up some, but was still on his feet, and lived. No one misunderstand my point; The atty could easily have been killed by anyone who knew anything about guns & shooting. Or even the fool shooting at him who got in a lucky shot.

    But, with little or nothing to work with, that atty used what he had to his utmost advantage, and "walked away" from it all.
    Found the video here but tree was a bit bigger than a sapling. It does illustrate any cover is better than no cover. Oh, and the shooter was taken down by a bystander and held until police arrived.

    Man shoots at his lawyer - YouTube
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    Distinguished Member Array Brady's Avatar
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    Use anything for cover that you can pucker up behind.
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    VIP Member Array NC Bullseye's Avatar
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    Don't waste time trying to figure out if the bad guy is going to pull left or right or if at all. Shoot from your strongest point and stop the threat.

    You'll have enough on your mind so don't try to over think your response. If you have cover then use it and don't forget the threat while you think about your other options.
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    Distinguished Member Array Fitch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StormRhydr View Post
    there was a pretty famous video...6-8 years ago, of an attorney who was attacked by his client after leaving court. The BG was some old man, who otherwise wouldnt have appeared very threatening, but for the pistol in his hand, shooting at the attorney at near point blank range.

    I think the BG emptied the gun. The attorney got behind a VERY thin sapling. I mean it prolly wasnt 2 inches wide. The idiot shooting at him would sort of jab the gun forward, and pull the trigger. The atty would move to the other side of the sapling, and the bg would jab his gun on that side of the sapling, and pull the trigger. This went on till the gun ran dry, I think.

    The atty was shot up some, but was still on his feet, and lived. No one misunderstand my point; The atty could easily have been killed by anyone who knew anything about guns & shooting. Or even the fool shooting at him who got in a lucky shot.

    But, with little or nothing to work with, that atty used what he had to his utmost advantage, and "walked away" from it all.
    There was an attorney in LA that was dancing around on the grass outside the court house while someone was shooting at him. I think this may be the incident you are talking about. I think that that was in 2003 - the year before I moved from So. Cal. to PA. I saw the video of it on the news. Nobody did anything to stop the shooter. He emptied his revolver and then tried to walk away. There were, of course, no civilian concealed carry folks around to help, and apparently no cops close enough to help before the guy emptied his gun.

    Your original post is an interesting question. I see right handed folks jerk the trigger which causes them to shoot low and to their left from 4" to as much as 12". Especially beginners. With just a small part of your body sticking out from behind the pole, there is a good chance they will miss because, other than your head, there isn't much to shoot at on that side of the pole. I'd imagine their focus will be on the side of the pole with the gun. So even if you are two poles wide, they will probably instinctively try to hit the side that's shooting at them. It would take a pretty cool customer to deliberately shoot at what was sticking out the other side of the pole and ignore the gun that's shooting at him/her.

    That said, I think the focus should be on doing what you need to do to get a hit. Once you start shooting back, that in and of itself is a pretty good distraction. Especially if the attacker is in the open and you have at least your most vital zones shielded by a phone pole.

    Fitch
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    VIP Member Array StormRhydr's Avatar
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    Yes thats the video I was talking about. And yes, its a tree, not a sapling. Funny how the mind remembers things. I would have bet it was not more than a twig.


    Quote Originally Posted by msgt/ret View Post
    Found the video here but tree was a bit bigger than a sapling. It does illustrate any cover is better than no cover. Oh, and the shooter was taken down by a bystander and held until police arrived.

    Man shoots at his lawyer - YouTube

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    Distinguished Member Array BadgerJ's Avatar
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    Though this a rather ridiculous over thinking of a tactical situation, the best position would be prone, aligned with the pole, shooting with your left hand. But that reduces mobility. Perhaps you could simulate that posture at the range, though. Always good to have a reason to shoot lefty now and then (in case you're wounded?).

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    Best tactical video on how not to be seen:

    Monty Python "How Not To Be Seen" - YouTube
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    Cogito, ergo armatum sum. I think, therefore I am armed. (Don Mann, The Modern Day Gunslinger; the ultimate handgun training manual)


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