Stuff like this makes me not want to CC

Stuff like this makes me not want to CC

This is a discussion on Stuff like this makes me not want to CC within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Milwaukee man who fatally shot teens beating him with bat jailed on possible homicide charges (VIDEO) I know that a lot of people's responses will ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array thechriskarel's Avatar
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    Stuff like this makes me not want to CC

    Milwaukee man who fatally shot teens beating him with bat jailed on possible homicide charges (VIDEO)

    I know that a lot of people's responses will be "well at least he's alive." Which I agree with of course. But doesn't it worry any of you? Am I alone in this? If you get a biased or dumb jury, you're screwed.


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    Array Mike1956's Avatar
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    He hasn't been charged. A day or two in jail while things get cleared up comes as no surprise, and is much better than an eternity or two dead at the hands of violent assailants.
    "If I had my choice I would kill every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting reports from Hell before breakfast."
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  3. #3
    Ex Member Array Longstreet's Avatar
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    This story has run here in at least 2 previous threads. The info in your post is really dated; much has happened since that point in time. You should review the updates to the story and post them along with this really old video. Quick summary: the guy and the 3rd teen are both out of jail and both are awaiting a final determination by the DA.

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    Member Array Rock_Castle's Avatar
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    Looks like a pretty straight forward case of self defense. I doubt the DA will even file charges. Not sure why you would give up the ability to defend yourself because of this story though.

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    VIP Member Array Ghost1958's Avatar
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    Well the alternative is to not carry, not fire and be beaten to death with a bat. Seems like an obvious choice to me. Dead or a vegetable. Or possibly charged and make the DA look stupid at trial. I believe there is video of the guy being held and beaten with a bat.

    Here coming near to me with bat in hand in a threatening manner or verbally threatening and advancing theres no need to wait to get hit with the bat. Or worry about charges either in that case. Much less get struck with a deadly weapon before acting.

    They may charge this guy though i highly doubt it. If they do and he as a first year law student for a lawyer he walks.


    And please dont take this personally but if this situation worries you that much to the point of considering giving up carrying then likely you shouldnt be. This guy waited to long really. lucky he could get his weapon out to use. One good whack on the noggin with a bat can be game over as far as defending yourself. That much worry could result in waiting way to long to do anything but arm your attacker. JMO
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    Member Array Bigpoppa48's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thechriskarel View Post
    Milwaukee man who fatally shot teens beating him with bat jailed on possible homicide charges (VIDEO)

    I know that a lot of people's responses will be "well at least he's alive." Which I agree with of course. But doesn't it worry any of you? Am I alone in this? If you get a biased or dumb jury, you're screwed.
    Yes it does bother me, I think about it all of the time especially when the lawyers get together and but your social and B-day in a database and find out all of your assets and I am not fooling myself for one minute not thinking they do not do these types of things. Does it bother me to the point where I do not want to CC, Naw cause I am going to follow the law to the best of my ability and really that is all you can do whether you CC or not. My location does have the Castle Doctrine in effect but I know that it is still going to cost a bundle if involved in a self defense shooting and that is for real.
    thechriskarel likes this.

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    VIP Member Array high pockets's Avatar
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    "If you make something idiot proof, someone will make a better idiot."

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    Member Array Ditchwalker's Avatar
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    Does not scare me at all. I carry from the time I put my pants on in the morning until I take them off at night. When my pants are off there is at least one gun within reach. But in Washington we have this little gem of a law to protect those who defend themselves.


    RCW 9A.16.110
    Defending against violent crime — Reimbursement.

    (1) No person in the state shall be placed in legal jeopardy of any kind whatsoever for protecting by any reasonable means necessary, himself or herself, his or her family, or his or her real or personal property, or for coming to the aid of another who is in imminent danger of or the victim of assault, robbery, kidnapping, arson, burglary, rape, murder, or any other violent crime as defined in RCW 9.94A.030.

    (2) When a person charged with a crime listed in subsection (1) of this section is found not guilty by reason of self-defense, the state of Washington shall reimburse the defendant for all reasonable costs, including loss of time, legal fees incurred, and other expenses involved in his or her defense. This reimbursement is not an independent cause of action. To award these reasonable costs the trier of fact must find that the defendant's claim of self-defense was sustained by a preponderance of the evidence. If the trier of fact makes a determination of self-defense, the judge shall determine the amount of the award.

    (3) Notwithstanding a finding that a defendant's actions were justified by self-defense, if the trier of fact also determines that the defendant was engaged in criminal conduct substantially related to the events giving rise to the charges filed against the defendant the judge may deny or reduce the amount of the award. In determining the amount of the award, the judge shall also consider the seriousness of the initial criminal conduct.

    Nothing in this section precludes the legislature from using the sundry claims process to grant an award where none was granted under this section or to grant a higher award than one granted under this section.

    (4) Whenever the issue of self-defense under this section is decided by a judge, the judge shall consider the same questions as must be answered in the special verdict under subsection (4) [(5)] of this section.

    (5) Whenever the issue of self-defense under this section has been submitted to a jury, and the jury has found the defendant not guilty, the court shall instruct the jury to return a special verdict in substantially the following form:

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    Member Array thechriskarel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost1958 View Post
    Well the alternative is to not carry, not fire and be beaten to death with a bat. Seems like an obvious choice to me. Dead or a vegetable. Or possibly charged and make the DA look stupid at trial. I believe there is video of the guy being held and beaten with a bat.

    Here coming near to me with bat in hand in a threatening manner or verbally threatening and advancing theres no need to wait to get hit with the bat. Or worry about charges either in that case. Much less get struck with a deadly weapon before acting.

    They may charge this guy though i highly doubt it. If they do and he as a first year law student for a lawyer he walks.


    And please dont take this personally but if this situation worries you that much to the point of considering giving up carrying then likely you shouldnt be. This guy waited to long really. lucky he could get his weapon out to use. One good whack on the noggin with a bat can be game over as far as defending yourself. That much worry could result in waiting way to long to do anything but arm your attacker. JMO
    That doesn't make any sense.

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    Ex Member Array DetChris's Avatar
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    The man tried to save his own life. How in the world can this e considered first degree murder?? It's not even close to premeditated! I hope our justice system does good by the guy. Those teens made the wrong choice and picked on the wrong guy.


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  11. #11
    Member Array thechriskarel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DetChris View Post
    The man tried to save his own life. How in the world can this e considered first degree murder?? It's not even close to premeditated! I hope our justice system does good by the guy. Those teens made the wrong choice and picked on the wrong guy.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    My point exactly. If something this clear cut can be twisted, imagine what something more grey can be made to look like.

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    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    Stories like this confirm the reason I do. If I get attacked by a group of people with a bat, I'm going to defend myself accordingly and deal with the aftermath as prudently and judiciously as possible.
    Know Guns, Know Safety, Know Peace.
    No Guns, No Safety, No Peace.

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    VIP Member Array BenGoodLuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BugDude View Post
    Stories like this confirm the reason I do. If I get attacked by a group of people with a bat, I'm going to defend myself accordingly and deal with the aftermath as prudently and judiciously as possible.
    +1!!
    Ghost1958 and Aceoky like this.
    Ben

    Cogito, ergo armatum sum. I think, therefore I am armed. (Don Mann, The Modern Day Gunslinger; the ultimate handgun training manual)


  14. #14
    VIP Member Array Ghost1958's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thechriskarel View Post
    That doesn't make any sense.
    Not being the skilled word smith let me try again. And this isnt personally at you. If someone that worries about aftermath of a SD shooting is so concerned about it it makes them consider not carrying then they probably shouldnt be carrying in the first place.

    That much worry over litigation, etc to that point can easily cause a person, any person that worried about it, to hesitate out of fear of consequences when there is no time for hesitation. Get overwhelmed, disarmed of the very gun they carried for SD and possibly killed with it. Then either way BG has a new found firearm to take with him when he leaves you laying on the pavement.


    In a nutshell if worry over aftermath is THAT worrisome, especially over a cut and dried situation like the one mentioned with video no less, to the point they consider not carrying, that concern is likely to pop up and cause one to waver in defending themselves which honestly there usually isnt time for and be successful in your SD.

    Again I used you generically though worded it poorly. Hopefully if you dont agree at least now it makes some sense to you.
    " It is sad governments are chief'ed by the double tongues." quote Ten Bears Movie Outlaw Josie Wales

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    VIP Member Array nedrgr21's Avatar
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    All this does is reaffirm my decision to not live in a blue state.
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