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Oy, the wait is killing me

7K views 66 replies 23 participants last post by  tex45acp 
#1 · (Edited)
Seriously, how long does it take the state of Texas to send a packet of papers?

I have recently discussed with some others who have decided they too wanted to get their CCW license in 2005, and I'm finding out that CCW permits are apparently not a high priority issue for the Department of Public Safety.

Now in my state, you basically have to mail in a form to get the application packet. You have to make the application to get the application in other words.

I spoke to one woman who sent off her paper work last November and still hasn't received her packet. It's February for all intents and purposes. That's 3 months waiting on the application alone!

I've gathered this is not a Texas phenomenon. It seems in other states the wait can be even longer, and the process more difficult.

The way I see it, I'm going to have to wait months for the papers to arrive, then I'll have to take time to get prints made, which is a real PITA, and then get photos made, and fill the thing out correctly. Then I'll have to wait for the 3rd Saturday of the month to take the freaking class.

Then I have to mail it all in and wait and wait and wait some more.

This is literally going to take all year. I suppose it's not all bad as I'm practicing an awful lot in the meantime, but honestly I'm competent to possess the license right now.

What if I were a recently divorced woman and my ex husband were stalking me? What if I were a prosecuting attorney or a retired peace officer?

I realize this process isn't quick but come on this is just silly. It shouldn't take them any longer to process than driver's license application. Why the wait? They make such a big deal out of all the paperwork and all the legal requirements and then they sit on them.

Heck I even looked into physically going to the DPS, but found out they're just going to give me a form to mail in. You'd think they'd at least let you go down there and get printed and your picture taken in person like they do for a driver's license. Instead, they give you a form to fill out and mail in. Come on, I could go in there any day this week, and walk out in a couple of hours with my first driver's license.

Well I saved myself a trip and just downloaded the pdf off the DPS website, filled it out, and mailed it in myself. That's a little bit of time saved. The form only actually had to travel about 34 miles to Austin. I could have delivered it myself if I'd felt so inclined.

Of course why can't I download the actual packet? That would save the state time and resources. It's my paper I'd be using!

I then found where it was buried on the state's website you could apply online. It took some doing to find it too.

This I think is a subtle form of gun control. The resources to process these permits faster are already present in Texas and I bet they are in your state too. They don't have to build a new DPS building. I should be able to walk into the DPS with a certificate stating I've completed a state approved CCW course, fill out the paperwork, get my mugshot taken, get the prints, pay $200 or whatever and walk out the door with my temporary CHL while I wait for the permanent one to come in the mail in 2 weeks.

Here's another pisser: I'm a Texas certified educator and I have a Texas Driver's License. The state has all this information about me already. They have my prints, they have my picture, my address, everything.

Also, I have to go to the County Sheriff's department to get prints made. The DPS can't/won't do it. Last time I did this, I arrived at 12:30 pm. The woman behind the counter said they don't start making prints until 1:00 PM. I said Okay I will wait. That's fair enough. At 1 o clock the woman who had been doing nothing but sitting at the counter filing her nails for 30 minutes gets up and says "Okay let's take those prints now."

I'm also going to have to go somewhere to get some Passport Photos it seems.

This is just silly. It really is. Well hopefully by 2007 they'll send me the packet to apply for the packet to apply for the application to take the test to be fingerprinted to send in so I can wait for the real application. Sheesh.

Anyone else have problems like this in your state? How many months did it take you to get your actual permit?
 
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#6 ·
OK Here is the problem...

Texas doesn't want your money
+Texas will honor a nonresident Florida
__________________________________

Can the mathematician figure out the answer?
 
#7 ·
The first carry permit I got in PA took about 16 hours. I went down to the county sheriffs office, filled out the paperwork in the afternoon and the next morning they called to tell me it was ready. There was no training requirment but you had to state a reason why you wanted the permit. At that time, just saying you need it for self defense was not enough. Funny thing is the county sheriff was the person behind the counter who stood there while I filled out the paperwork. He saw I was thinking real hard and long about what to put as a reason so he said "What do you need it for son." So I said self defense and he said "Well I know that! You can't put that as a reason so just put camping in remote areas and I will sign off on it."

The second time I got my PA carry permit renewed in another county and it only took about 15 min.

I now live in VA and after filling out all the paperwork and running around to different offices, it takes about 45 days. I used my DD214 from the military as proof of firearms training.
 
#8 ·
Ha!

F350 said:
OK Here is the problem...

Texas doesn't want your money
+Texas will honor a nonresident Florida
__________________________________

Can the mathematician figure out the answer?
HA! Excellent Answer F-350!

I'll give the system a chance to work first though. Yeah I'm a sucker. That non refundable application fee has something to do with it too.

As frustrating as the delays are though, the fact is that there are some people in situations who are in imminent danger and may really need the permit in a hurry. Luckily I'm not one of these people. That's why I think this whole process is ridiculous.
 
#9 ·
In Virginia mine took about 21 days. Submit the application, fingerprints, proof of training, pay your money and wait. My county required fingerprints, not all do. Don't feel bad about the fingerprints deal. I was just printed again this week for the umpteenth time. They take them every time I am processed for a security clearance including renewals and upgrades. Like they changed right? :ticking:

If I move to Missouri it will take six months for the residency requirement and another 45 days after that. So my solution is a Florida permit. Then no worries. :cool:

-Scott-
 
#10 ·
I got my CCW (Texas) last spring. The whole process took about 6 weeks. I've since moved, and had to get a change of address submitted for my CCW and so far it's been about a month. I agree that these permits are not exactly a priority. I would think just having a change of address shouldn't take more than a week.....hell, I didn't even leave the county!
 
#11 ·
In Arizona, I took my CCW class, the instructor did the fingerprinting and we took the packet home to mail. My class ended on Sunday and it was in the mail (at the main post office) on Monday morning. They sent it back to me in about a week and a half and said that I needed to fingerprinted again as they could not classify the ones I turned in. I did that a couple of days later and remailed the cards. After all of that, I had mine in just over three weeks after the end of class. While I was going nuts waiting, I was pleased that they turned it around in that amount of time. Hopefully it took a while because they are REAL busy with new applications :wink:
 
#12 ·
It didn't take me long to get my packet. I can't remember how long exactly. The license took almost the full 90 days. The norm is they won’t go over the 90 days, but they will take just about the full 90 days.

My renewal didn’t take very long, but I can’t remember exactly how long it took.

On a side note, the Texas State Rifle Association reported there is a bill to be introduced this year to get the licenses lengthened to five years. There is also a bill to allow non-licensed people to carry in their cars, but I doubt that will pass.
 
#13 ·
They need to pass that to clear up the legal ambiguity. I practice car carry now because I have no reason to believe it is illegal.

One of the FAQs on the TX DPS website about CCW says something to the effect of that the CCW permit ADDS TO existing carry rights, implying it was legal to car carry before the CCW permit was passed and it still is.

However, according to packing.org's data, it seems to only be legal in instances of making a trip across at least two county lines. For instance I car carry when I am driving from say Denton to Brady because that is a journey; it's a trip I don't make every day. My understanding is however that it's illegal to car carry from my house to work and back again because that does not constitute a journey.

There is no formal legislation on the matter I am aware of. They just need to come out and state it's legal to prevent someone from going to jail.

Another thing I find interesting is that assuming I am correct about what constitutes legal car carry in my state, is that a non permit holder is under no legal obligation to tell a LEO there is a gun in the vehicle. A CCW holder is under such an obligation. Should be either everyone has to declare it, or else it should be the other way around (a non permit holder would have to declare and a permit holder would not).

That's part of the reason I wanted to get my CCW. I realize I will have to inform any officer that pulls me over and I'm fine with that, but I want to be out of that legal gray area. Also, I can car carry to work and back.

But it all goes back to my main point. It seems like for some people in a lot of places, the process takes an unreasonable amount of time. Now to be honest it's not the end of the world if it takes X number of months for this to go through because I'm busy anyway and I'm not in imminent danger, but it just seems like they're doing the public a disservice.
 
#14 · (Edited)
It is illegal to carry a handgun in your car in Texas, without a license, unless you are traveling or for a “sporting purpose” (hunting, range etc.) When it say “adds to existing rights”, the existing right is the exemptions when it comes to cars. Here some FAQ from the weapons law handbook that deal with the issue.


Q: Can I still carry a handgun without a permit while traveling?
A: Yes. The concealed handgun law augments existing state weapons laws but does not replace them. The offense of unlawfully carrying a weapon does not apply if you are traveling.

Q: Can I carry my handgun to a shooting range without a license?
A: Yes, if you are traveling directly to the range and back home.
 
#17 ·
I live in Missouri where CCw is legal but still cannot get my permit becuase the county I live in has decided that it is above the law and not issue. It is the only county in the state that doesn't issue. But since it has such a large population [almost 1/3 ] it feels that it's above the law.
 
#18 ·
Euclidean said:
Yeah but that specifically says Traveling or Going to the Range. I think car carry for Going to the Grocery Store is still a no no without the permit.

It's not clear any way you slice it. The 2 county lines thing is a convention of case law, which means it's nothing more than a rule of thumb.
That's what I was getting at. That if it is not traveling or for a sporting purpose, it is definitely illegal. You also have to be careful about the traveling exception. Burden of proof is on you (even though the wording of the law has been improved)

Summary of Traveling Exemption said:
There is still a provision in the Texas Penal Code, which, if you are unlicensed, allows for an affirmative defense in the event you are stopped and a handgun is found in your vehicle. Your attitude and demeanor toward the officer is very important. Although there is no absolute definition for traveling, the courts have indicated that crossing two county lines defines traveling. Bear in mind, this only allows for you to have a handgun during the course of traveling on the highway from originating point to destination. It does not provide for the carrying of the handgun while traveling in and around your destination. In other words, when you reach your destination, you need to secure your handgun where ever you may be staying.
 
#19 ·
A lot of CHL instructors have the packets on hand. I was told about this after waiting about a month to get my packet from the DPS. Hang in there, it's worth the wait.
 
#20 ·
mtrapper-

I also live in the state of Misery :biggrin: Exercise your Out Of State option and never give that cesspool of a city/county a penny. Also I think one reason the Kansas Chitty area is going to issue is just so they know who has a permit, get an OOS just so they don’t know. I sent for my Florida permit the day after the court challenge put things on hold and had it in hand before the Supreme Court ruling, Florida is good in more states than Misery and I really can’t see any reason to spend the money, and if/when St. Loonie ever issues they will charge the full $100 allowed. To hell with them. Live free. :snake:
 
#21 ·
The Florida permit sounds like something a lot of people should look at. I applied for a Texas permit because it's reciprocal with several states I tend to travel in every so often, plus, well, I live in Texas so it seemed intuitive to get a Texas permit.

It's not like I regret applying in my own state. It shows my state that people want concealed carry here. Maybe in some small way, it will help because what I really want is a more streamlined application process. Well what I really want is my RKBA reinstated, but one step at a time I suppose.

I do wonder now if I could have saved myself some hassle.

C'est la vie I suppose. To be honest, my goal was to have it by June 1 and I think it'll happen with time to spare. I can't carry at work anyway, and I've gone for 2 years without it for this reason. But I hope someone might learn from my situation to examine all your options first.

F-350, I clicked around the internet and couldn't find the exact page where one applies for an OOS Florida permit. I found some info but couldn't find where one can apply by either snail mail or email. I know the Texas DPS has an online concealed carry page where you can apply over the internet and save some time, but the page is buried and you have to dig around to find it. I don't know if this is poor website design or if it's intentional. I think it's the former and not the latter because you have to pay $140 for the privilege. Do you happen to know the exact URL for the Florida permit? It might help someone else out.
 
#22 ·
Well quick update.

It took basically a month to get all the fingerprints, photos, affidavits and classes out of the way. The packet went in the mail last Monday and come tomorrow will have been out for a week.

From where I am located, the Austin DPS (who actually issues the thing) should have gotten it in the mail Wednesday if I had in in the mail Monday (Which I did). Add one day for the incompetent post office we have here and add another day for the possibly incompetent post office they have there, and it should have been in their mailbox Friday if not Thursday.

Out of simple curiousity I have checked my status online and it still reads "Packet Mailed to Applicant". I figure this means one of three things:

#1. They didn't get it
#2. It's physically there it just hasn't been processed
#3. They don't actually bother to update your status online throughout the process.

I think it's a combination of #2 and #3.

Now if I read the law correctly, the DPS has to act on your application within 30 days of receiving it. For the sake of argument I am going to assume it arrives March 1st.

Odds are significant that when they get these things they put them in a workbasket for 30 days ahead, so they probably aren't even obligated to crack the seal on the envelope until darn near April.

I've been told to wait 60 days to pass a background check, which is silly. It doesn't take 60 days to pass a check. But they say they need 60.

I've even pointed out to them as a certified educator they have all this information on me already and have already performed these checks on me, but they insist on doing it again.

And now we wait 90 days. I just hope they like the photo and prints I sent them.

I talked to some of the renewals at the range and most of them reported a turnaround time of 2-4 weeks after mailing all the materials in, but I've also found out that there's an awful lot of applications going through the works right now so I'm not holding my breath. The DPS sends the renewals their notice in the mail 6 months ahead of time. If it takes 6 months just to renew I am not looking forward to how long the initial license might take.

I'll update again when/if it's ever issued so someone else may possibly benefit from knowing what to expect for the turnaround time for their first license. It took 1.5 weeks to receive my application and about 3 weeks to get all the stuff taken care of, so I already have a month tied up in this process just taking care of the bureaucracy.

I will say this process does have one major upside. It got me frustrated enough to get off my butt and pay my TSRA membership fee so that maybe one day all this silliness won't be necessary. If this was my first driver's license this would have already been a done deal by now.

But in a way it's a relief. I have done everything I know to do to the best of my ability, and I did it all correctly. All I can do is wait to hear back. The worst that can happen to me now is I have to send in another set of prints or another passport photo.
 
#23 ·
I can tell you one thing. The internet page never changes the status of your app. Same status every day and then it pops up "license mailed" and a week or so later it shows up. I thought it would show the progress and etc. but it never did.In about 62 days it should be there.
 
#25 ·
I went in for a renewal. Figured 1 1/2 months lead would be enough. Now they tell me FBI is 3 months behind on fingerprint submitting. Looks like I may be without a CCW for a few months.
 
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