Limatunes "soap box" got me thinking.

Limatunes "soap box" got me thinking.

This is a discussion on Limatunes "soap box" got me thinking. within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Here is the "Soap Box" as a preface Originally Posted by limatunes And to get on my soap box for a moment or two... It's ...

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  1. #1
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    Limatunes "soap box" got me thinking.

    Here is the "Soap Box" as a preface
    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    And to get on my soap box for a moment or two...

    It's no one's responsibility but ours (the CCW holder) to know where we can and cannot LEGALLY carry. We should not rely strictly on what's posted in public. We law abiding citizens recall laws everyday even though they are not posted. We drive on the right side of the road though there's no sign telling us to. We pay for our items in stores even though there is no sign saying that not paying is theft and against the law.
    For the CCW holder we should have the same underlying knowledge of our local gun laws. We should already know where we can and cannot carry and what is our legal right and what is not. We may not be able to quote it word for word, but it should be as natural to us as paying for our purchases and driving on the right side of the road.
    I have been home this week on my (not so) Spring Break and have had more than a few CCW discussions with my father about PA law. I am getting a bit frustrated during our discussions because I always seem to have to point out to him where he is thinking in terms of laws that either do not exist or he is seeing to broadly. How do we get those who carry along side of us to take the time to keep uptodate on the laws regarding carry.

    My Parents have both had their permits for about 8 years and Sunday night my Father got into an arguement with me and told me #1 I could not carry my gun to drop my sister off at school while never getting out of the car, which is legal until I get out of the car and #2 that I could not carry to the Community college where I was going to renew my CPR cert, Also legal as colleges are not prohibited in PA. I did not end up carrying to either because he had my gun put away from when I was at school and had not yet gotten it out of his (new) hiding spot.

    I have alos had to contradict my Uncle and Father about an old way of thinking a few months ago. They were telling me that only Allegheny and Philadelphia county permits were honored state wide others were only in county permits - this was from back before a copy of all permits went to PSP.

    How do I get them to re-review the laws and understand these changes? They are intelegent men but have not taken the time to review these changes or have fallen into traps that people who dont have a clue have laid out. I have honestly been wishing we in PA had a short (2 hour or so) class that CCWers had to take on the law to get their permit but would this help the situation, I dont know.

    Limatunes thanks for the soap box to jump off of, I did not want to hijack that thread so I brought it here.
    Mark

    "The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose."

    -James Earl Jones


  2. #2
    Member Array wizardofgore's Avatar
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    Perhaps printing out the laws so they can read them over. Also it looks like a good opertunity. It seems like the 3 of you have different views all on the same subject. Perhaps you can suggest all of you take a Conceal carry class together.

    Not sure where you are in PA but in south east PA there is a local gun shop run by two awsome guys who run what appears to be a great class on it. I have not yet been able to take it but once the funds are together I will be taking it.

  3. #3
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    Seems like some folks need a refresher so as to update their knowledge!!!

    They could do worse than check thru some web material. IIRC the NRA site will provide some statute info but better still - get the blue covered book on PA firearms laws which I think should be available from a state rep's office on request.

    They are either being over cautious unnecessarily in some quarters or perhaps also risking over looking something thru ignorance, which in a court of law would not be an acceptable excuse.
    Chris - P95
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    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    1) Buy an current book on your state's gun laws. There are some great ones out there that discuss gun laws in-depth. I buy the "Texas Gun Owners Guide" everytime its updated. This particular book is approved by the Texas Dept of Transportation (the governing body for CHL). Leave it around for you Dad to read, maybe he'll learn something.

    2) Get them to join a group of like-minded gun enthusiasts. I belong to the Texas State Rifle Assocation (As well as the NRA). The TSRA sends out a communication whenever there is a gun law that affects CHL legislation in Texas. This will help not only in keeping up with gun legislation it will alert you when you need to reach out to your politicians to tell them you don't agree with them when they begin to enact another stupid gun law.

    3) Lastly, it might help if you could get someone that is more in your dad's age range to discuss the issues with him. I hate to say it but us Dad's are sometimes stubborn (I don't think I fall into that category but my son's would respectfully disagree). If you could find someone that is knowledgeable and up-to-date on gun laws it might resonate with your Dad a little easier.

    I really think Limatunes hit the nail on the head. We as a group (group being CHL holders - not necessarily CombatCarry members) should do a better job of keeping up to date with the changes and nuances of the carry laws in our states. As they old saying goes "ignorance of the law is no excuse"
    "Do not fear those who disagree with you; fear those that do and are too cowardly to admit it" - Napoleon

  5. #5
    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    In far too many cases, the laws are written in gibberish.
    "If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan

  6. #6
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    Yes, but gibberish usually goes hand in hand with loop holes and if you don't know the gibberish, you'll never be able to find the loop holes!

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    Keeping up with updated laws is a great idea. Perhaps bookmarking your states website pertaining to CCW. AG opinions help alot too. We have had a few opinions reversing DNR's take on carry in MI state parks.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  8. #8
    Senior Member Array cagueits's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by me View Post
    How do I get them to re-review the laws and understand these changes? They are intelegent men but have not taken the time to review these changes or have fallen into traps that people who dont have a clue have laid out.
    From the Pennsylvania's Department of State website:

    The official certified copy of each bill approved by the Governor is placed in the custody of the Secretary of the Commonwealth, given an act number and filed in the State Department. It then loses its identity as a bill and becomes an “Act of the General Assembly”.

    http://www.dos.state.pa.us/notaries/...av=|&bcelNav=|

    I sugest you go down to the local office and get a certified true copy of the law, then show it to your parents/any one who wants to argue about it.

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