Why All Carriers Should Take At Least One Advanced Class

Why All Carriers Should Take At Least One Advanced Class

This is a discussion on Why All Carriers Should Take At Least One Advanced Class within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Lots of good points made here: What does training do? | Cornered Cat...

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Thread: Why All Carriers Should Take At Least One Advanced Class

  1. #1
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    Why All Carriers Should Take At Least One Advanced Class

    Lots of good points made here:
    What does training do? | Cornered Cat
    "To reject the notion of expertise, and to replace it with a sanctimonious insistence that every person has a right to his or her own opinion, is silly."

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    Senior Member Array NETim's Avatar
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    Couldn't agree more. You don't know what you don't know.
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    VIP Member Array Ksgunner's Avatar
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    I am not against any kind of training. Most training classes I have found so far vary from $300 to $600. I am on a fixed income and it is not very much. At 71 years old I am not sure I have the stamina to compete in most training classes today. I carry everyday and go to the range when I can afford it. (not to often). I am going depend on what I can learn online and use common sense to tell me what is good and what is not.
    OldVet, patri0t, lchamp and 6 others like this.

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    Good information! Thanks!
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    Senior Member Array CommonCents's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ksgunner View Post
    I am not against any kind of training. Most training classes I have found so far vary from $300 to $600. I am on a fixed income and it is not very much. At 71 years old I am not sure I have the stamina to compete in most training classes today. I carry everyday and go to the range when I can afford it. (not to often). I am going depend on what I can learn online and use common sense to tell me what is good and what is not.
    Try talking to an instructor and tell them your situation. I bet you find one that will comp you some training. There are just all kinds of good and understanding people in the 2A world!

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    "During that same year, more than 500 people died from unintentional gunshot wounds. Thatís one or two desolate gravesites, one or two devastated families, one or two grieving communities every day of the year.

    Do you find yourself marveling at how many unreported unintentional discharges must happen, in order to create this many tragedies? After all, catastrophe doesnít always follow these potentially-deadly mistakes. Nobody tracks the close calls. We do know that private, unreported mistakes are more common than reportable accidents where someone got hurt or killed by a stray bullet."


    Good stuff right there and a major reason to take some amount of formal training. It's a good thing to have another person who knows watch you handle a gun and ell you what you are actually doing with it that might make you a better gunner and make you safer at the same tim.

    VooDoo
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    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Good article. It speaks volumes...Thanks for sharing Mike....
    Mike1956, OD* and gatorbait51 like this.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

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    VIP Member Array flintlock62's Avatar
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    I went through level III, and need a refresher
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    Senior Member Array dennis40x's Avatar
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    Ok who qualifies the instructors to instruct and be competent in the subject matter outside of the NRA? Is there an accredited professional organization that sets standards thus qualifies the competency of instructors? Just asking?

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    Distinguished Member Array Happypuppy's Avatar
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    Why All Carriers Should Take At Least One Advanced Class

    This is the problem I have with these article written by trainers that lets be honest have a vested interest in getting you into a class.

    "I donít disagree with much of what John said, and want to add one more important point to the discussion. My point Ö well, itís a bit like touching the third rail of American gun culture, but Iím gonna do it anyway. Itís about safety. After 15 years of learning and teaching defensive handgun classes at the professional level, itís my deeply held belief that people who have not had serious defensive handgun training are not as safe with a firearm as they believe they are.

    Based on what ? There is nothing to validate her opinion other than 15 years of training.

    Any objective data ? There is a attempt to correlate ND to training and infer that with proper training this would not happen.

    Is it really that complicated ? How to draw
    How to holster
    Keep the finger off the trigger until you wish to fire
    There is not much more to it.

    Having to take an advanced class to learn that is a stretch.

    I don't take an advanced class to learn that. I take an advanced class mostly for fun and to learn :

    Point shooting
    Low light / weapons light
    Refresher on malfunction drills.



    I read an interesting piece a bit ago about LE and the perceived training problems on a well known LE forum I will toss in here too.

    The discussion was about reaction loop and training and how they maybe training maybe leading to increased shootings.

    The issue

    They trainers teach by using a list of commands and then reaction such as Gun! Or Threat! The student then draws and fires. This is repeated over and over until it's programmed

    Then guess what happens ... Our LE is out on a call for domestic violence with his partner. Office A sees the suspect pull out his cell phone he mistakes it for a gun and shouts Gun! Office B based on his response based training pulls his gun out and fires...

    The point is there are different types of training IMO

    Response
    Skill

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    VIP Member Array Kennydale's Avatar
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    I have found an instructor whose rates are reasonable. My classes with her are two hour blocks. Right now I am up to section 6( of 6) of the Wnchester/NRA Marksmanship Course. I realize that this isn't a High Stress SWAT like scenario. But because it is a timed shooting (then minimum score needs to achieve advancement ). It creates a minimal amount of stress. This course has really given me the confidence, and muscle memory skills, to protect myself and family, without endangering others.

    Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk
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    Thanks for posting, Mike.

    Love this from the article:

    The blind spot problem is why it’s good to have someone outside ourselves watch us handle the gun and help us spot what we’re actually doing, compared to what we think we’re doing, when we handle the gun.
    I got DQ'd from a shooting event for the first time a couple of months ago for that exact reason. I got flustered when something caught me by surprise, and I wasn't actually handling my gun the way I thought I was handling it at the time. The safety folks watching the stage stopped me immediately, and it was an eye-opener.

    There is ALWAYS value in having a knowledgeable person watch you do things that take special skills, and then offer constructive critique.
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    VIP Member Array Hodad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happypuppy View Post
    This is the problem I have with these article written by trainers that lets be honest have a vested interest in getting you into a class.

    "I don’t disagree with much of what John said, and want to add one more important point to the discussion. My point … well, it’s a bit like touching the third rail of American gun culture, but I’m gonna do it anyway. It’s about safety. After 15 years of learning and teaching defensive handgun classes at the professional level, it’s my deeply held belief that people who have not had serious defensive handgun training are not as safe with a firearm as they believe they are.

    Based on what ? There is nothing to validate her opinion other than 15 years of training.

    Any objective data ? There is a attempt to correlate ND to training and infer that with proper training this would not happen.

    Is it really that complicated ? How to draw
    How to holster
    Keep the finger off the trigger until you wish to fire
    There is not much more to it.

    Having to take an advanced class to learn that is a stretch.

    I don't take an advanced class to learn that. I take an advanced class mostly for fun and to learn :

    Point shooting
    Low light / weapons light
    Refresher on malfunction drills.



    I read an interesting piece a bit ago about LE and the perceived training problems on a well known LE forum I will toss in here too.

    The discussion was about reaction loop and training and how they maybe training maybe leading to increased shootings.

    The issue

    They trainers teach by using a list of commands and then reaction such as Gun! Or Threat! The student then draws and fires. This is repeated over and over until it's programmed

    Then guess what happens ... Our LE is out on a call for domestic violence with his partner. Office A sees the suspect pull out his cell phone he mistakes it for a gun and shouts Gun! Office B based on his response based training pulls his gun out and fires...

    The point is there are different types of training IMO

    Response
    Skill
    I am with you on this. I came to guns relatively late in my life (40 years old). I am closing in on 25 years of handling a semi auto pistol almost everyday and have never had an accidental or unintentional discharge.

    It could be that I have just been lucky or it could be that I am, by design and intention, extra careful when I am handling a deadly weapon. I have never been to any kind of training class related to guns.

    I am by no means overconfident with my weapons and certainly not an expert, but I do stay alert, aware and practice basic gun safety whenever I have a weapon in my hand.
    "Life is tough but it's really tough if you are stupid"

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    Distinguished Member Array blackhawkfann24's Avatar
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    I have been trying to find a good instructions class in this state for awhile. The only advance class I can come up with here is what they call a tactical call not advance. They focus move on moving and shooting and shooting for cover. Not saying this is bad but I want to learn more about shooting in general. Like I'm I doing it wrong yes I know I'm hitting target, but learning how to correct my mistakes. I will like to take the so called tactical courses but after I get more of the fundamental of shooting down. In illinois I guess that is hard to find with out spending a small fortune or learning stuff I don't care about. I have ready books on advanced but want more class time. I'm hoping one day I will see something here I will want to do with out having to put a second mortgage on the house. For know I will stick with the range and do the best I can
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    Senior Member Array Rainsong's Avatar
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    It's reading this that makes me realize how lucky I am to belong to a tactical shooting club that meets once a month for 4 hours taught by an ex Vietnam Ranger and APD officer with help of an ex Homeland Security agent. Draws from concealment, moving targets, moving shooters etc all for $25/year and $12 per each class to cover range fee, targets etc.


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