What to do when your workplace does not allow you to carry?

This is a discussion on What to do when your workplace does not allow you to carry? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Actually, I must confess that I do enjoy a heated debate from time to time... However that does not include hurling insults at those who ...

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Thread: What to do when your workplace does not allow you to carry?

  1. #61
    Senior Member Array GoodSamaritan's Avatar
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    Actually, I must confess that I do enjoy a heated debate from time to time... However that does not include hurling insults at those who disagree with you.

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  3. #62
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    GoodSamaritan ~ Good Comment

    Not every issue is "Black & White" & there are ALWAYS gray areas where even "like minded" folks will strongly disagree.
    So...it's OK to turn up the heat.
    The veiled personal flaming is not necessary in any debate though. :angryfire
    The standard Ultra Left Wing Liberal tactic is to resort to both outwardly blatant and sneaky masked personal attacks whenever they can't win an argument or debate with either logic or common sense.
    We should all try to stay above that here.

  4. #63
    Member Array SSKC's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter
    The standard Ultra Left Wing Liberal tactic is to resort to both outwardly blatant and sneaky masked personal attacks whenever they can't win an argument or debate with either logic or common sense.
    We should all try to stay above that here.
    Agreed. Just as we will be held to a "higher standard" in court, I feel that we should hold ourselves to a higher standard as human beings. It is the responsibility of every armed citizen to conduct himself/herself in a manner that reflects well on the rest of us.

    Now, where are you getting those cool smilies, QKShooter? The fencing smilies are the neatest ones I've seen!

    SSKC

  5. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSKC
    Agreed. Just as we will be held to a "higher standard" in court, I feel that we should hold ourselves to a higher standard as human beings. It is the responsibility of every armed citizen to conduct himself/herself in a manner that reflects well on the rest of us.
    And that's why those that DO flame and attack other members may find themselves invited to leave.

    Quote Originally Posted by SSKC
    Now, where are you getting those cool smilies, QKShooter? The fencing smilies are the neatest ones I've seen!
    When you "Reply" to a thread click on the [More] at the bottom of the random smilies. You'll be up to your eyeballs in them.... :wink1:
    Bumper
    Coimhéad fearg fhear na foighde; Beware the anger of a patient man.

  6. #65
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    Sskc

    Holy Smokes!! You are really missing out on the Smilies if you have not clicked on the [More] option directly under the shown Smilies.
    There are more Smilies on that Looooong page than grains of sand on your average beach.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

  7. #66
    Member Array mikaldulee's Avatar
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    I do not violate private property rights if I can help it, but it happens from time to time. My work is posted, so I cannot carry in my plant. My plant also has shop rules against all weapons and firearms. Even if I did, my type of work would make it difficult to carry and not get caught.(Automoblie Assembly)

    My pay and benefits are too good to walk away from. I carry in my vehicle to work, lock them away and go to work.
    People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to violence on their behalf.

  8. #67
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    Screw them....what they dont know wont hurt them, but a crazed former employee or other threat WOULD hurt me. Actually, about 1.5 mos after I started, our bldg was struck by what appeared to be "random" gunfire. A .45ACP Golden Saber went through a window and lodged into a wall about 25 feet away from my workspace. I was carrying at the time....that merely a) vindicated my carrying, and b) made me more careful about walking in front of the windows at night.
    http://www.myspace.com/sgeringer
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  9. #68
    Senior Member Array Prospector's Avatar
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    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by SGeringer
    Screw them....what they dont know wont hurt them, but a crazed former employee or other threat WOULD hurt me. Actually, about 1.5 mos after I started, our bldg was struck by what appeared to be "random" gunfire. A .45ACP Golden Saber went through a window and lodged into a wall about 25 feet away from my workspace. I was carrying at the time....that merely a) vindicated my carrying, and b) made me more careful about walking in front of the windows at night.

    What about c) Demand the company install bulletproof windows!

  10. #69
    Member Array SSKC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bumper
    When you "Reply" to a thread click on the [More] at the bottom of the random smilies. You'll be up to your eyeballs in them.... :wink1:
    Thanks Bumper. I don't see any smilies to choose from when I reply, just the icons for the post. I'm looking through FAQ, etc. to see if I can figure this out.

    SSKC

  11. #70
    VIP Member Array havegunjoe's Avatar
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    As I see it you have two choices. They are, find another job, and find another job. I won't recommend you do something against company policy no matter how stupid the policy is. That is your choice. Your employer has that right to impose stupid policies on their employees, just as you have the right to work elsewhere. I'm sure if you are killed at work because you were unable to defend yourself based on their policies they will say something nice about you in the company paper.
    DEMOCRACY IS TWO WOLVES AND A LAMB VOTING ON WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH. LIBERTY IS A WELL ARMED LAMB CONtestING THE VOTE.

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  12. #71
    Member Array TravisABQ's Avatar
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    Unless I go through a metal detector, get frisked, or work in a Speedo,
    how is anybody going to know?

    Um... Well.... I was working in Pizza delivery and I dropped a speedloader
    out of my pocket.... in front of the store manager.....OOPS!
    I HATE when that happens!

    He asked if I had a gun in the car and I honestly answered:
    no.....

    I couldn't believe he didn't ask the next obvious question....


    --Travis----

  13. #72
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    At the end of the day, each man stands alone, either with his integrity and principles intact, or having been discarded along the way. There's two points to this thought. First, what principles have I adopted as mine and how do I define integrity, and secondly, how everthing ends up. I've spent a lot of time with older people, folks dying, etc. The ones who lived by their principles and kept their integrity generally seem to have more joy and satisfaction in their lives even if they weren't necessarily easy lives. We all have rights but we all agree to limit ours so "we" all can have some degree of liberty. If everyone has absolute liberty/freedom, then no one agrees to be limited by any laws and you end up with anarchy. I don't want that and doubt seriously if anyone I've read on this forum would. The question then is how far I'm willing to be limited by others so we all can have some liberty! I believe the best way for a man to answer that is to look at where limited liberty intersects principles and integrity. Since this is subjective right down to the individual, you can see why this easily becomes a contentious issue. To make it even harder, we often want to preserve our liberty over the legitimate rights of others but have a fit when they would dare do the same. A very exagerated example would be how a Dad is dishonest in carrying a weapon in violation of clearly expressed requirements for his work center (notice I didn't say parking lot, theres actually state laws dealing with those) but expects his son to be totally honest about something the son is hiding in his room in his Dad's house that his dad has expressely forbidden. If I own the company, I have a right to restrict what you do on my private property. If you choose to have your liberty even at the expense of my liberty to set policy for how people act on my land, then we've got a problem that at some level involves integrity and principle. Now if too many people start doing that all at the same time, and if how others view integrity and principles deteriorates in a society, well then, we end up with one huge mess! What made America great was our ability to come together as a repuplic, and as a people, to set some limits on our liberty so that we could have liberty as a nation. It gets deep quick. Unfortunatley, when integrity, truth, etc., becomes too relative, it causes huge problems in society. We won't settle this but the discussion is interesting. I think any one of us reading a this thread might benefit from considering it from this point of view,...if we set aside the guns and defense issues, would we be upset if we were treated the way we'd be treating someone by knowingly violating their rule? I know you can't entirely leave the defense issue out but we might also be ignoring another possible solution. My company has a similar policy and I didnt' become aware of it until I happened to be looking at a work manual years after I started here. When I read the prohibition I stopped carrying at work and did two things. I checked state law and found that in Missouri its legal to carry and leave it in my car in a parking lot. Secondly, I talked to the HR Manager about the policy and I mentioned to him that I sometimes have guns in my car and wanted to be sure there wouldn't be a problem. He appreciated me bringing it up and said it would be no problem. He just asked me to be discreet about it. Now that brings up the issue about how best to secure a weapon in a car. I think that would be a great thread. To the gentleman who started this thread, I'd encourage you to honor your word which you've given "constructively" by continuing to work for the employer with your knowledge of their policy. Then I'd check parking lot laws in your state and I'd find a really good way to secure the gun in my car and I'd even suggest you talk to a boss or HR manager about your concerns over personal safety when traveling to clients homes or even while in them.

    I'm not sure if any of this helps or makes sense, but I intend to obey every law concerning my carry unless the law directly violates one of my principles. None of the carry laws I've ever hear even comes close and for me (a preacher) the Bible clearly teaches me to obey the Government (as if it's Him I'm obeying) unless the Government asks me to do something contrary to His commandments. I.e., if they ask me to steal, lie, murder, etc...so you can see where I adopted my principles from.

    Good discussion. Now if I could carry at work, I'd probably carry my Kel-Tec P3-AT .380 acp. I have carried it other places in a "Smart Carry" holster and it's VERY concealable and reasonable comfortable. It would be hard for anyone to detect it, even bumping into you as they'd likely be a little embarrassed.

    God Bless
    Gideon :embarasse

  14. #73
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    You make alot of good points, Gideon, thanks. I generally don't carry (except in my car) anywhere that disallows it. I say "generally" because I don't do it but might do it if for some reason I had to go somewhere work related where I felt it was necessary to carry my gun. When I go somewhere in my car (off of my employer's premises) I am no longer under their control. If I'm in their car I will adhere to their rules. I almost always go in mine.....
    Bumper
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  15. #74
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    Gideon, A business owner has a legitimate interest in his own property rights.
    An employer can dictate how I dress, and can even dictate how much I weigh.

    But his property rights do not supersede my right of self defense, NOTHING DOES.

    Many businesses prohibit people from carrying lawful weapons because they perceive a higher
    risk of being sued from employees shooting people, than from being sued by the families of
    employees or customers who get killed while they are denied their right of self defense.

    A similar faulty logic applies to the classic places where Lawful concealed weapon holders are prohibited from carrying weapons: at schools, courthouses, and church services....
    and what do you know? It is exactly these places where there have been some recent high profile mass murders. The killers in these cases paid no mind to the laws declaring these to be “safe” places, any more than they paid mind to laws against murder. There was no “good guy” in sight with a gun to oppose the killers.. No, let me correct, there WAS a good guy with a gun in Tyler, Texas. He gave his life and thereby prevented the killer from killing his own son.

    It is wrong for an employer who bears no burden of protecting my life, to demand that I not take measures to protect it myself. This makes as much sense as preventing construction workers from wearing hard hats, or chemical workers from using masks and haz-mat suits. It is worse than stupid, in my opinion, it is criminal.

    It is wrong for a government, which has no real ability, nor responsibility for protecting my life, to prevent me from taking measures to protect my life, myself.

    I do not owe alleigance, obediance, or even truthfulness to those who presume to interfere in my own defense of self and family. No more than I would to a government or employer which mandates that I murder or steal on its behalf.

    I believe it is a false dichotomy to present gun rights as being a case of “liberties in conflict”.
    The only conflict is people who mean to defend themselves, and those who mean to deny that right.

    That's just how I see it.

    --Travis--

  16. #75
    Distinguished Member Array LenS's Avatar
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    Travis is Right On!!

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