Absolutely no guns allowed!
This is a discussion on Absolutely no guns allowed! within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hi all,
i got a "little" question...
I just started working for a major company. The company has facilities throughout the states, anyhow i'm just ...
April 5th, 2007 12:26 AM
Absolutely no guns allowed!
i got a "little" question...
I just started working for a major company. The company has facilities throughout the states, anyhow i'm just working at their Oklahoma City Campus. I also applied for a CHL a couple of Weeks ago and should get it within the next weeks...
Unfortunately, these two things (Job & CCW) doesn't mix
They don't allow weapons in their buildings and their premises. The Code of Conduct states:
(i hate how that paragraph pretty much says that concealed carry is only inflicting harm and not having any self defense weapons at all is the safest way to be . Bunch of there...)
VIOLENCE, THREADS AND WEAPONS
The safety of our employees is extremely important to XXXXX. XXXXX employees are prohibited from engaging in violence or other deliberate acts intended to harm another person or his/her property. Similarly, XXXXX employees must not make threatening or menacing comments, or behave in such a way that may threaten the personal safety of property of another person. Violence or threats of violence should immediately be reported to XXXXX Seurity.
Therefore, XXX prohibits the possession, concealment, use or transfer of any firearm or other weapon, including knives, clubs or other devices that are primilary used to inflict injury, on XXXXX premises (including buildings, parking lots, walkways and any other property leased or owned by XXXXX). These prohibitions also apply to employees in any location outside the home, on and from their way to work and when conducting XXXXX business.
That pretty much tells me, that i can't carry at work. Ok, it sucks, but i could live with that. But can they really tell me not to carry on my way to or from work? What if i carry at my private time, unholster at the parking lot (or at someplace else), lock the gun in a metal box underneath my seat. According to their code of conduct, i'm not allowed to do so. Is that legal for them to say so?
Unfortunately "get another job" is not an option
Edit: Wait a minute! Does "These prohibitions also apply to employees in any location outside the home, " <- that really say i'm not allowed to carry at all, no matter where i am, just because i'm a employee ot this company?
Last edited by kante; April 5th, 2007 at 12:32 AM.
April 5th, 2007 12:29 AM
Check local laws, then violate co policy(if legal) at your own risk.
"In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson
Nemo Me Impune Lacesset
April 5th, 2007 12:30 AM
don't ask, don't tell. that's what "concealed" carry is all about.
April 5th, 2007 12:31 AM
According to their code of conduct, i'm not allowed to do so. Is that legal for them to say so?
They can tell you whatever they want...that dont make it legal.
They can prohibit it on their property, including a company vehicle if you happen to use one.
Saying that you cant carry to or from work in your own vehicle is out of line.
I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.
AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
Like custom guns and stuff? Check this out...
April 5th, 2007 12:50 AM
That's exactly what they're saying and it slipped by the company legal eagles. It's lawsuit time. Get a progun attorney. NRA should be able to recommend one or perhaps THE RUTHERFORD INSTITUTE.
Originally Posted by kante
Some folks will say "If you don't like the rules don't join the company." That probably plays for activities on the job and maybe to and from work (parking lot) UNLESS you park off the property! Then the sneaky little clause they've slipped in would come into play. The problem is that it blatantly violates (I'll BET) the STATE CONSTITUTION and probably STATE LAW. In this matter, forget the US Constitution. One of the first things I learned in law school is that the Bill of Rights is a restraint on Government...ONLY.
Private entities can violate the US Constitution at will which is why they can read your e-mail and keep you under surveillance on the job or whatever. But state law is the basis for the 10th Amendment (states rights) and so, get a lawyer....Make sure he works on contingency which says that if you lose, he gets zero. But if you win he gets 30-40% and then ask for enough to make it worthwhile AND be sure to go for "punies" or punitive damages because in many states it's triple whatever the initial award is....
Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.
April 5th, 2007 01:05 AM
The "on and from their way to work" part is probably not enforceable. Do you want to file suit? You'll probably end up getting fired anyway. If the parking lot that you use is owned by the company and not used by the general public then they can probably fire you for leaving a gun in your car--if they catch you.
Only you can decide how great the risk is--both the risk of getting fired and the risk that you'll need your gun.
Sometimes life sucks. Good luck.
April 5th, 2007 02:26 AM
Do you want someone to tell you it's okay? Well it isn't. It doesn't matter what anyone says, you took the job and by so doing agreed to obey their rules. It's called a "condition of employment". Obey them or break them at your own risk!
It's totally up to you and only you!
ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!
"A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
April 5th, 2007 02:50 AM
Well, i dont want you guys to tell me "it's okay, just go ahead and carry". I saw their "no guns" sign already at the job interview, so i knew it before. They pay pretty good, they have excellent benefits, my coworkers seem to be pretty nice people, so i can't complain and i guess i just have to play by their rules.
I just thought i heard something about "you can have a carry weapon locked away in your car, even if the company has a no gun policy" in oklahoma, so i thought maybe you guys know about that. I won't carry at work (although it sucks) and i have to obey their rules while im clocked in. I just don't agree with their policy about trying to tell me that i can't carry when i'm not working.
And i also just wanted to rant a little about sheeples and their stupid thoughts about gun free zones. I really want to see how the crazy badass madman, armed with a handgun, ready to shoot up a place, stops at the entrance, moans "oh maaaan!" and puts his gun away, because it would be illegal for him to shoot the place up, since there's a "no guns allowed" sign posted...
April 5th, 2007 02:57 AM
That's what I think, too.
Originally Posted by jahwarrior72
The keys to winning a gunfight are first to bring a gun and secondly to take your time, quickly.
Always remember that if your opponent is within range, so are you.
POWER TO THE MEPEOPLE!!!
April 5th, 2007 03:17 AM
If SHTF, you might also die, with that. Choose accordingly.
Originally Posted by kante
Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
self defense (A.O.J.).
How does disarming
the number of victims?
Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos)
NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.
April 5th, 2007 03:19 AM
Something that can save your life in a dire situation is worth keeping quiet about.
April 5th, 2007 03:23 AM
True. But whatever i do, if i carry or not, i wouldn't tell anyone. Keep it concealed.
Originally Posted by ccw9mm
If i would carry in a "no carry" zone, i wouldn't broadcast it over the internet *hint, hint* ;)
Last edited by kante; April 5th, 2007 at 03:29 AM.
April 5th, 2007 04:29 AM
Companies can force you to do what they want most of the time. CNN employees can not smoke even in their own home, and yes it is legal.
I am not a lawyer (but I listen to one from the NRA ever so often) but you might be able to win in court if Oklahoma has a preemption clause about gun laws but since I think Oklahoma is a fire at will state (meaning they can fire you for no reason) you would lose your job.
I can not carry at the office but I can have my weapon in the parking garage.
If it is not in the US Constitution then the Federal Government should not be doing it.
"Carrying a gun is a social responsibility."
April 5th, 2007 08:21 AM
April 5th, 2007 09:18 AM
That policy doesn't sound legal. Sounds like you can be fired for defending yourself or your loved ones on a Saturday night out. I would definitely talk to a lawyer. You should not have to choose between feeling safe and a paycheck. Giv'em Hell.
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