Please READ MD CCW Time sensitive

This is a discussion on Please READ MD CCW Time sensitive within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; 1) The right to carry is inevitable here in Maryland. It's a right (not given by, but ... ) recognized and guaranteed by the U.S. ...

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Thread: Please READ MD CCW Time sensitive

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    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Please READ MD CCW Time sensitive

    1) The right to carry is inevitable here in Maryland.


    It's a right (not given by, but ... ) recognized and guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution. None of our other recognized inalienable rights (life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness) mean anything without the means to protect them -- the right to carry weapons to defend ourselves. The means to protect ourselves and our other inalienable rights are guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution. The right to have and to carry arms for our self-defense and defense of the community is guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution. The scholarship on this issue over the last 30 years has built up a foundation and momentum that just won't quit. It has resulted in the Parker v. D.C. decision which I dare say is certain (nothing is certain, but this is as close to certain as anything can be) ... certain to be upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court. Once that happens ... there's no holding us back ... it doesn't matter how anti-gun and closed-minded our Maryland legislators are -- the U.S. Supreme Court is goi ng to trump them. The right to carry is inevitable in Maryland -- believe it.


    Even though it is inevitable ... our actions will determine if it happens sooner or later. To help it happen sooner:




    2) Apply for a Maryland Permit - you know you want one ...


    In 2006, the State Police received 5,881 initial and renewal applications: 2,085 initial applications, 2,653 renewal applications, and 1,143 initial and renewal applications from retired law enforcement personnel. The State Police denies ONLY about 250 applicants per year on the basis of a finding that the person did not have a good and substantial reason to wear, carry, or transport a handgun.


    This means that the MSP only rejected/denied about 5% of permit applications ... they approved 95% of Handgun Carry Permits !!!


    I hope you realize that there is a problem with this! 95% of the permits are approved, and yet most everyone thinks "There is no sense in my applying because I'll never be approved." Nationally, about 3% of the adult population gets CCW permits. Here in Maryland only less than 1% even apply for a permit -- and a lot of those apply because they HAVE to have a permit for their work -- guards, etc.


    We need YOU to apply for a permit!


    The MSP and the legislature uses this 95% approval rating to 'prove' that there is no problem with the existing system. We have to prove to them that there is a problem! We need you to apply for a permit to either (a) increase the numbers of people who have permits or (b) increase the percentage of people who are denied -- demonstrating a problem with the process.


    In order to win in the courts we will have to have people willing to be part of the suit who have been denied a permit ... all you have to do is to be of good character, be denied, and document (keep records of) the process.


    So ... apply! If you are given the permit ... then hallelujah! you can carry .... if you are denied ... then hallelujah! ... document it and we have another person who has standing to sue for the right for all of us.


    Some of the things that seem to help ensure that you are granted a permit are: having a permit from another state; having a clean record; having taken any NRA training courses; having a MSP trooper as a character reference; having a legislator as a character reference; being involved in any shooting sport; and being an NRA instructor. Get as many of these things together as you can before you apply for a Maryland Permit.


    Many states give permits to non-residents. The two state permits most important to Maryland residents are Florida and Virginia.... if you can apply for both Florida and Virginia at the same time it will save you trips to the barracks for fingerprinting and trips to AAA for passport photos. Florida has to respond in 90 days (usually much sooner) and Virginia has to respond in 45 days or give you a temporary permit. As long as you have a clean record, can legally own a gun, and have had some gun training (any NRA course, or participate in any organized shooting sport) you can easily get a permit through the mail from VA and FL.


    The non-resident Florida permit is good in at least 27 states -- more than half the entire United States! (At $117 for 27 states for 5 years that's less than $1 per state per year - an incredible bargain.) (The Utah permit is also good in about 27 states but has WA and MN in place of PA and KS ... and requires more training.) The Virginia permit is good in at least 18 states.


    Apply for a Florida Permit here:
    http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/weapons/apply.html


    Apply for a Virginia Permit here:
    http://www.vsp.state.va.us/Firearms_...Concealed.shtm


    After you have sent in your application(s) for FL and/or VA then start putting together your Maryland permit application. Download the Maryland application form and print out several copies and start filling one out in pencil ... contact legislators and/or MSP troopers who will be character references for you .. get all your ducks in a row. Once you receive your FL and/or VA permits then send in your MD application. Keep copies of everything along the way.


    Apply for a Maryland Permit here:
    http://www.mdsp.org/downloads/Licensing_Faq.pdf


    Remember ... if you get the permit ... you're good to go. If you are denied, then they can't hide behind 95% approval ... and if you document it ... then we have another plaintiff who has standing to sue ... and that's probably where we'll be able to get our rights.




    3) Have you used a gun to defend yourself?


    http://www.abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=3015150

    Have you ever defended yourself from a crime in your home,
    in your business, or in public by using a gun? Perhaps you warded off a
    potential attacker by si mply showing a gun?

    40 states now allow their citizens to obtain conceal-carry permits for
    handguns. Some people say that's dangerous, while others say it allows them
    to protect themselves.

    If you have a story of self-defense involving the aid of a gun and would
    like to tell it to 20/20, please fill out the form below. A "20/20" producer
    may contact you.





    4) MCSM meeting.

    C'mon down... tomorrow (Tuesday April 10th) at 7 PM .... The venue is as usual at the Wheaton American Legion Post with

    details at; <http://www.mcsm.org/location.html> ... we'll be talking about what happened in the 2007 session and what to do next.






    - Henry Heymering, President




    Maryland Shall Issue, Inc.

    P.O. Box 314

    Libertytown, MD 21762

    240-446-6782

    http://www.marylandshallissue.org
    henry@marylandshallissue.org
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

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  3. #2
    Senior Member Array Timmy Jimmy's Avatar
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    Rob I wish I felt your Optimism about "Parker"
    Timmy Jimmy

    If it is not in the US Constitution then the Federal Government should not be doing it.

    "Carrying a gun is a social responsibility."

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    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Timmy Jimmy,
    I didn't write that I just cut and pasted it from it from my office email. It sounded like a good cause.

    See you in St. Louis.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

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    VIP Member Array SammyIamToday's Avatar
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    So, any idea on the numbers for non-resident permits in Maryland? I have a lot of Marine buddies there that I hesitate to visit because I cannot legally carry in Maryland. That would be a nice relief to get that fixed.
    ...He suggested that "every American citizen" should own a rifle and train with it on firing ranges "at every courthouse." -Chesty Puller

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    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SammyIamToday View Post
    So, any idea on the numbers for non-resident permits in Maryland? I have a lot of Marine buddies there that I hesitate to visit because I cannot legally carry in Maryland. That would be a nice relief to get that fixed.
    I don't know you might be able to FOIA it
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

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    Distinguished Member Array Chooie's Avatar
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    So, according to the MD license application, you must have "documented proof", i.e. police report, notarized witness statement, etc. of abuse, assault, threats, etc. before they'll issue a permit? That's even worse than MA.

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    VIP Member Array mcp1810's Avatar
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    Maryland also provisions for people to get restricted permits. If say you are a coin collector and go to coin shows, you could get a permit that allows you to carry while you actually have coins in your posession. I imagine they are talking "valuable" coins as opposed to pocket change, but if they don't specify......

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    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
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    Yeah its pretty crappy....
    Quote Originally Posted by Jchoo View Post
    So, according to the MD license application, you must have "documented proof", i.e. police report, notarized witness statement, etc. of abuse, assault, threats, etc. before they'll issue a permit? That's even worse than MA.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

  10. #9
    kle
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    You oughtta post this in the OpenCarry.org Maryland forum: http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum28/

    And perhaps in the Virginia forum: http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum54/

    Yeah, those forums are about "Open Carry", but a lot of the people (myself included) have Concealed Handgun Permits anyways (I actually carry concealed 90&#37; of the time). Crossing Maryland to get to Ski Liberty or Ski Whitetail in PA is a PITA, so I'd like to see some sort of reform or reciprocity.

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    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    I've got no time right now to do it myself and I forget where it's located though I know I've seen it before in times/years past...

    Could someone post the specific limitations/requirements, verbatim, that MD requires toward approval for a license to carry and provide the URL for said citiation.

    I'd appreciate as much and thanks ahead of time.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

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    Distinguished Member Array Chooie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    I've got no time right now to do it myself and I forget where it's located though I know I've seen it before in times/years past...

    Could someone post the specific limitations/requirements, verbatim, that MD requires toward approval for a license to carry and provide the URL for said citiation.

    I'd appreciate as much and thanks ahead of time.

    - Janq
    Sure thing.

    From the licensing application itself:

    1) APPLICATION FOR AN ORIGINAL HANDGUN PERMIT:
    ATTENTION: SUBMISSION OF THIS APPLICATION DOES NOT PERMIT YOU TO WEAR, CARRY OR TRANSPORT A
    HANDGUN. BEFORE YOU MAY CARRY A HANDGUN, YOU MUST POSSESS A VALID HANDGUN PERMIT AND
    KEEP IT ON YOUR PERSON WHILE CARRYING A HANDGUN.

    [ ] One (1) completed application, having pages 7and 13 notarized.
    [ ] Two (2) 1&#189; ” x 1&#189; ” head and shoulder passport type photographs with a white background, full face, no hat, no dark
    glasses. Photographs must have been taken within the preceding 30 days. Computer generated photographs are
    acceptable.
    [ ] One (1) set of fingerprint cards using one orange and white CJIS-011 fingerprint card and one blue and white FBI
    applicant card bearing ORI-MDMSP6000 which can be obtained at any MSP barrack.
    [ ] Fees Required: Handgun Permit - Original $117.00 ($75 fee + $42 background check)
    Subsequent $74.00 ($50 fee + $24 background check)
    Retired Police $42.00 (background check)

    ADDITIONAL DOCUMENTS REQUIRED PER HANDGUN PERMIT CATEGORY:

    a) Owner or Employee of a Business: Submit photocopies of the Traders License or Business License, and if the purpose of
    the permit is for:
    (i) Making deposits: Photocopies of six (6) random deposit slips for the business showing the deposits within a
    year of the application submission date or a letter from the bank attesting that your business has a monetary
    flow.
    (ii) Cash Flow: Photocopies of Ten (10) receipts showing purchases for supplies and/or payments received for
    services.
    (iii) Requesting a permit for one of your employees, or if you are an employee and you have permission from your
    employer to obtain a permit: A letter from your employer on the business stationery, explaining in detail why
    you need to carry a gun as part of your duties.

    b) Professional Activities: Doctors, Pharmacies, etc., Must show evidence of legitimacy of business activity and valid
    certification or license.
    c) Correctional Officers: Must submit verification of employment and documentation of threats and assaults.

    d) Former Police Officer: If you have resigned or retired, you must show evidence of your tenure in law enforcement, such as
    a letter from your Agency.

    e) Private Detective/Security Guard/Special Police & Railroad Police Commissions: All applicants who are employed
    as Private Detectives, Security Guards, Special Police, and Railroad Police, must submit a certification of qualification with
    a handgun from a Maryland State Police Certified Handgun Instructor on an MSP form. A copy of the form letter supporting
    “good and substantial reasons,” ownership of weapon, and location where the weapon will be maintained, is also required.
    (This form can be obtained from your employer).

    f) Personal Protection: There must be documented evidence of recent threats, robberies, and/or assaults, supported by
    official police reports or notarized statements from witnesses.

  13. #12
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Bingo!

    Thank you much Jchoo!
    As I had recollected, the limitiations in MD to even be considered relevant for a concealedhandgun permit in MD are very narrow and thats just for business owners & persons. The 'personal protection' is fubar as well except for a person who has already been assaulted and is likely expecting to be assaulted again such as by a stalker or abusive spouse whilst in hiding.
    Again very narrow. :(

    It's no wonder the numbers of applicants are so low and approvals high.
    The legal allowances eliminate most folk right off the bat as stated on the app...

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

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    Distinguished Member Array Chooie's Avatar
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    Yep - and the folks that read f), and understand it, and know they can not provide such proof, won't spend the $117 just to skew the ratio.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jchoo View Post
    Yep - and the folks that read f), and understand it, and know they can not provide such proof, won't spend the $117 just to skew the ratio.
    That's an understatement. I know as much as I'd like a MD permit, I'm not about to waste (and there is no other way to say that) $117 and get a letter saying I've been turned down, so I legally have to state that in the future.

    On the really down side, lawmakers are going to look at the 95% acceptance rate and believe that is almost "shall issue", and think no changes to the system are necessary.
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Agreed RStickle...$117 is a case of ammo at even todays inflated rates.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

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