Texas Carry

This is a discussion on Texas Carry within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by TPO . . . I am not offended if you do not agree with me or think that my opinion is not ...

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Thread: Texas Carry

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TPO View Post
    . . . I am not offended if you do not agree with me or think that my opinion is not credible.
    Oh, well . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by TPO View Post
    I do not consider what you say to be a correction. Crushing, as an example means ticketing a person for 31mph in 30mph and making them wait while a check of every conceivable data base is run on them. I have crawfished for you as much as I am going to about interpetation of the law.....just what makes you so clever, educated, smart and experienced? Are you an instructor, LE, lawyer or judge? or just someone running off at the key board without anything but a smigedon of experience? I am done with this verbal sparring. We agree to disagree. Take the advice or leave it. I have verified it with experienced professionals what are your sources? I am elected to my office so obvisouly the majority of people where I live believe in what I do and say concerning applications of my office. I will run for my third term in Nov. this year. I have put lots of BG's away and logged much court time......never been sued on the civil side....hope never to be. That's a big achievement with as many years total law enforcement as I have. Most LE are sued sooner or later by a BG or citizen for almost anything nowadays....but I sincerely doubt you are aware of it.
    Awfully testy to start quoting credentials. You see this happen all too often in online discussion forums. An opinion or assertion is challenged, and the poster takes umbrage that it wasn't just accepted because he's "an authority". I could make a response citing education, position, experience, etc., etc., etc., but it's neither credible nor instructive if the positions I espouse don't hold water. Every contributor to Combat Carry brings a unique set of knowledge, experiences and abilities to the table. Their willingness to share and engage in lively discussion without rancor makes this forum especially valuable.

    You can think of online discussions here as kind of like peer review. The validity of your position will be based on its merits, regardless of your "credentials". If the points you make are sound, then they'll be respected (although not necessarily agreed with). If, on the other hand, you take a goofy position, it's going to be called a goofy position. If it looks like a duck, . . . well, you know. If your response is, well, you should accept my goofy position just because of who I am, you might as well write, "Neener, neener, neener!"

    In this case, you made a recommendation: don't carry in any establishment that has any type of a "no guns" sign, legal or not. That's not only contrary to the letter and spirit of the law, it's contrary to common sense. It's a position, I might add, that I've never seen taken by anyone else on this forum (including LEOs, lawyers, and instructors). It's not what was taught by the LEOs and Assistant DAs in my Texas CHL class. It simply doesn't hold water. To make that kind of statement and expect it to go unchallenged is ludicrous. I certainly expect that any point I make will not escape the scrutiny of my peers. If I'm off-base, I expect to hear about it.

    I hope that you'll get over your pique, and continue to participate in the forum. Having to consider your preconceived notions in the face of a challenge can lead to a worthwhile re-evaluation. That said, I agree that this interchange has probably gone about as far as it needs to.
    Cheers,
    Rod
    "We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded!" Dick Winters

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  3. #32
    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
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    To jofrdo from Virginia (the original poster, - remember him?), I think farronwolf gave some excellent advice. And should you happen to be travelling to San Antonio, drop me a line and we'll go shooting! Hope you have a great trip.

    Quote Originally Posted by farronwolf View Post
    My suggestion is to read the actual Texas Penal Code.

    http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes....000046.00.doc

    Specifially sections 46.03, and 46.035.

    . . . It tells you exactly where you can not carry and in what manner you can carry.

    Pay specific attention to section. 46.035 (i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06. concerning hospitals, amusement parks, churches, and governmental meetings.

    The actual code in these sections is only about 3 pages long, well worth reading for yourself.

    And this is the actual law regarding the famed 30.06.

    30.06. TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF LICENSE TO CARRY CONCEALED
    HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license
    holder:
    (1) carries a handgun under the authority of
    Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another
    without effective consent; and
    (2) received notice that:
    (A) entry on the property by a license holder
    with a concealed handgun was forbidden; or
    (B) remaining on the property with a concealed
    handgun was forbidden and failed to depart.
    (b) For purposes of this section, a person receives notice
    if the owner of the property or someone with apparent authority to
    act for the owner provides notice to the person by oral or written
    communication.
    (c) In this section:
    (1) "Entry" has the meaning assigned by Section
    30.05(b).
    (2) "License holder" has the meaning assigned by
    Section 46.035(f).
    (3) "Written communication" means:
    (A) a card or other document on which is written
    language identical to the following: "Pursuant to Section 30.06,
    Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed
    handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411,
    Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this
    property with a concealed handgun"; or
    (B) a sign posted on the property that:
    (i) includes the language described by
    Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;
    (ii) appears in contrasting colors with
    block letters at least one inch in height; and
    (iii) is displayed in a conspicuous manner
    clearly visible to the public.
    (d) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor.
    (e) It is an exception to the application of this section
    that the property on which the license holder carries a handgun is
    owned or leased by a governmental entity and is not a premises or
    other place on which the license holder is prohibited from carrying
    the handgun under Section 46.03 or 46.035.

    So if a sign looks like it fits these specifications, my suggestion is not to ignore it.
    Cheers,
    Rod
    "We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded!" Dick Winters

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by TPO View Post
    I have verified it with experienced professionals what are your sources?
    I'm agreeing with rodc13 on the signs and the tresspassing thing;
    my chl instructor has been in LE for 38 years, been to grand juries 14 times for shootings he's been involved in, goes to court for his students (and gets charges dropped or aquited every time), helped write and edit the chl laws, knows the penal code better than the Captain of the DPS (told him so on the phone)......they guy has been there and done that several times over, he teaches the laws exactly as they are written and as we should ALL follow; there may not be cases/rulings for any technical details but if I was ever arrested over a misinterpretation then my $$$ fees would be recovered in a counter suit; I would always keep concealed unless the SHTF and even then if you have committed a tresspass or a felony for carrying in a wrong place then prevented a felony by using your weapon (armed robbery, murder, etc) then by the same penal code you are free from prosecution. Its all black and white in the penal code and thats what we all have to follow. I understand careful advice and CYA in your chl classes but I think its going way overboard to tell people to avoid gun buster signs.

    As for: "I am elected to my office so obvisouly the majority of people where I live believe in what I do and say concerning applications of my office."......no offense intended to you but people get elected to offices all the time, some good some bad, some not worth a pile of dirt; I would guess that the majority of people have no idea what your views of no guns signs are and have no affect on your election, seems irrelevant to this discussion.
    Thanks for your service to our state and our society.

    As for the OP and the topic of this thread: check out this page with info on legal/illegal weapons, where you can carry, etc:
    http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes....000046.00.pdf
    Last edited by 64zebra; May 10th, 2007 at 11:06 AM.
    LEO/CHL
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    "I got a touch of hangover bureaucrat, don't push me"
    --G.W. McClintock

    Independence is declared; it must be maintained. Sam Houston-3/2/1836
    If loose gun laws are good for criminals why do criminals support gun control?

  5. #34
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 64zebra View Post
    I would guess that the majority of people have no idea what you views of no guns signs are and have no affect on your election, seems irrelevant to this discussion.
    The problem with democracy is that half the people are below average.

  6. #35
    Senior Member Array jofrdo's Avatar
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    Made the Trip

    Quote Originally Posted by dlauriano View Post
    Just to clarify a few of the previous posts:

    You can carry into a bar/restaurant that gets 100% of it's revenue from liquor, if the 51 sign is NOT POSTED IN CLEAR VIEW. So if you don't see the sign, you are legal.

    You can carry anywhere else (except gvt buildings, sporting events, school buildings) except where the 30.06 sign is posted. The sign has to have the EXACT wording of the law, in English and Spanish, in contrasting colors with block letters at least on inch in height.

    Mostly you will see the 30.06 at health care facilities. But most of them are illegal signs as they are white block letters on glass so legally not 'Contrasting colors'. So you can carry anywhere there is an illegal 30.06 sign.

    I've never seen a church here with the 30.06 sign, so if you don't see it you are legal.

    Safe Travels!
    Thanks for the info. I made the trip to Texas. Unfortunately, my father was in the hospital the whole time. Sure enough, just as you predicted, it was posted with an illegal white-on-glass 30.06 sign, with the Spanish language text in only half-inch high font. I continued to carry there.

  7. #36
    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
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    Sorry your trip turned out that way and hope your father is doing well. Maybe your next trip down to these parts can be a bit more recreational, and you'll get to experience more our li'l ol' state has to offer!
    Cheers,
    Rod
    "We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded!" Dick Winters

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