Shooting Threat at Work

This is a discussion on Shooting Threat at Work within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I agree it sounded harsh but I understand what he was trying to get across. What caught my eye about the post was the "pathetically ...

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Thread: Shooting Threat at Work

  1. #31
    VIP Member
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    I agree it sounded harsh but I understand what he was trying to get across. What caught my eye about the post was the "pathetically unarmed persons". I think sometimes people that dont arm themselves are percieved by carriers as "on the bottom of the ladder". We live by our choices and do what we feel is the best. Some people could'nt shoot someone if it came down to their lives or the BG life. Calling them pathetic doesnt accomplish anything.
    Limatunes, We all try to balance between a gun that is comfortable and a gun that will get the job done. When we're faced with a real threat it all shifts to "what will get the job done". You're in a tighter situation because you're carrying in a place where it's against the rules so you have to be sure and conceal well. Get something you know will get the job done. I'd hate to go to work everyday and doubt what I have on me in a real threat.

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  3. #32
    VIP Member Array SIGguy229's Avatar
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    What makes me upset through Lima's post--not that I would expect people in her building/office to go out to the store, pick-up a gun and get a permit...but the fact their mindset hasn't changed to "I need to protect myself" or "How do I protect myself". Although I believe being armed is a good idea (er, great idea)--if they don't have the mindset to protect and keep themselves safe, all they would be doing is carrying around an expensive paperweight...

    Hmmm....maybe some quotes from Supreme Court cases that indicate the police doesn't have a responsibility to protect individuals...posted in the break room....anonymously...in big bold letters

    That might get some people talking....

  4. #33
    Senior Member Array PapaScout's Avatar
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    Of course discretion would be even more important carrying in this situation. How unfortunate to be discovered with a gun and assumed to be the person giving the threats.
    "If you so much as bunny hop I'll cut your heart out!" Billy Bob Thornton in The Last Real Cowboys

    "I carry a gun for the same reason that I carry health insurance and a cell phone - be prepared."

  5. #34
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Echo_Four View Post
    I cannot believe that you just said that you would like to see someone come in and shoot a group of innocent people while the one armed person was out of the building. I'm sorry, but that is a disgusting thing for a human being to think.
    Fine if you think it's disgusting.

    What I think is FAR more disgusting is that a bunch of people are told, "Hey, a guy said he plans to come in here with a gun and slaughter "everyone," and oh, by the way, it's still a firing offense if you bring a gun for your own defense. Have a nice day, and try not to be so scared that you can't concentrate on your work."

    Just what are we to make of the steadfast refusal to try to be in a position to DO something if such an attack were to occur.

    What I'm saying -- and I'm not in fact wishing for innocent blood to be shed -- is that I'm SICK OF people insisting that there's safety in being helpless. And I'm SICK OF management and "leaders" standing by a policy that we knew would fail and cost lives before anything happened and which we darn sure now KNOW costs lives, because of what happened in Blacksburg.

  6. #35
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wmgn0evf View Post
    Seems to me that this is the perfect time to have all the 'potential victims' at the educational employer sit down together and discuss not only their feelings about this matter, but also a plan of action should this incident transpire.

    Oh, come on. We know that the policy is forced defenselessness. So we know what their "plan of action" is going to be.

    - Someone, quick, call 911!
    - Everybody run/hide under your desk!



    What, we're pretending that this is a big mystery? It's been the same in every office building shooting, school shooting (except the ones where someone ran to get a gun from his car) . . . Everyone blinds themselves to the fact that even just one armed victim can stop such an attack. So they persist in acting like they don't know that armed resistance is a viable alternative. They rule it out, because it involves having to use those icky guns, even though it means they're left to be slaughtered like lambs.

  7. #36
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by miklcolt45 View Post
    Sorry, Peaceful Jeffery,

    But what about people lawfully going about their work makes them 'deserving' of this BG coming in and threatening them, let alone, wounding or killing them? That is just WRONG, in my book.

    While I agree they are not being smart, people shouldn't have to die for being stupid. I, for one, and most of us, would have been dead already if that is the penalty for stupidity. Clueless is not a crime.
    Nor is it deserving of death.
    I think that the crime of their stupidity becomes an aggravated crime when they are going in every day IN FEAR, because they KNOW there is a SPECIFIC PERSON out there who has THREATENED MASS MURDER, and all they do is wring their hands and go in scared and think NOTHING of how they could protect themselves except by scattering and running for their lives.

    That's GROSS stupidity. To me, it's akin to being in a kitchen and having a fire start, seeing the fire extinguisher on the wall and shaking your head saying, "No, no, what else can I use to save myself from this?" and then having a major destructive fire result because you could see the response that would have the most effect, but eschewed it for nonsense reasons.

    It's not going to work that makes them "deserving" (if that's even the appropriate term) of being killed; it's the fact that they are aware of the threat and still act as though there's nothing that can be done besides going in defenseless and hoping that, if the time comes, he won't see them under a particular desk, in a particular closet, or as they run down the back hall. What's to respect about this, "I'm gettin' the hell out of here; every man for himself!!" mentality of fleeing helpless?

  8. #37
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pitmaster View Post
    Changing CCW policy is going to take a little longer. I'm sure there are quite a few issues that need to be addressed prior to making a change, including liability insurance for instance. There is no way they are going to let a "regular" employee carry concealed and be responsible. I wouldn't want to be the one carrying in this situation. I would prefer to have armed security professionals. I would just want to be the backup.
    The state of Florida licenses me to carry a concealed firearm in public. Did the state have to take out liability insurance to protect it in case I screw up with my gun and injure/kill someone? Or worse, if I go on a criminal rampage?

    Why should the company have to take out extra liability insurance just to allow state-authorized concealed carry of firearms? When they got this death threat, did they have to stop work until they took out extra liability insurance to cover them against the threatened actions of the would-be killer?

  9. #38
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    It's frowned upon and, of course, many schools and administration buildings have weapons policies ensuring employment termination should a weapon be discovered but it is now "illegal" by Pennsylvania law.
    Please confirm that you meant "not" illegal, rather than "now" illegal. It may be just a typo, but it makes the meaning dangle. From context, I guess you must have meant "not."

    My personal safety is second to my employment. If I'm fired because of my carrying, fine.. I'll just work full-time at the gun shop were carry is not only allowed but almost expected.
    Again I request clarification; did you mean that employment is second to your safety? As written, it would mean that your not getting fired for carrying is more important than your safety. My suspicion is that you meant the opposite.

    I'm ticked off that the only other person I know in my building who I know has his permit to carry has admitted to me that he never carries at work.
    Hold up! Isn't it very possible that he's doing the sensible, discreet thing? Perhaps he always carries, but knows better than to blab that fact to even a single other person, lest his refusal to be disarmed cause him to get fired. Isn't his response the one that most of US would give, just to continue to keep our forbidden carry a secret?

  10. #39
    Member Array crankshop1000's Avatar
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    I had a similar situation at work. i bought a 642-2 S&W took the safety course and now have a CPL. I look at it this way... I'll be damned if I'll die cowering under my desk while some jerk tries to set his world right at my expense.When was the last time you were asked to empty your pockets at work? Get something very concealable and keep your mouth shut. chuck.

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by crankshop1000 View Post
    I had a similar situation at work. i bought a 642-2 S&W took the safety course and now have a CPL. I look at it this way... I'll be damned if I'll die cowering under my desk while some jerk tries to set his world right at my expense.When was the last time you were asked to empty your pockets at work? Get something very concealable and keep your mouth shut. chuck.
    What he said!!!!!

  12. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    Please confirm that you meant "not" illegal, rather than "now" illegal. It may be just a typo, but it makes the meaning dangle. From context, I guess you must have meant "not."
    She did:
    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    Ooops.. You're right... clumsy me.. I meant "not."

  13. #42
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    Got it. I had posted before seeing her correction. I was pretty sure I knew what she meant anyway, but was hoping she'd perhaps edit the post so others didn't get confused.

    Also, there's the part about safety being second to employment, which I think is reversed. I didn't see a clarification on that, but again, I think I know she meant the opposite.

  14. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    Got it. I had posted before seeing her correction. I was pretty sure I knew what she meant anyway, but was hoping she'd perhaps edit the post so others didn't get confused.

    Also, there's the part about safety being second to employment, which I think is reversed. I didn't see a clarification on that, but again, I think I know she meant the opposite.
    I tried to edit my post but the "edit" button disappeared and then the forum disappeared altogether for awhile.

    I was speeding through that last post and didn't really recheck it to see what EXACTLY I was saying.. You all got the jist of the message, however.

  15. #44
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    Some folks should not carry for protection. If they do NOT have the correct mindset , then a gun for them is only a liability.

    Why do businesses ban carry for legal reasons. they can get sued , (and much more likely to lose) in court than a state would for issuing a CCW permit.
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  16. #45
    Senior Member Array Smith&Wessonfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    I hope this all blows over without the need for you to get involved in (or exposed to) bloodshed. But I find it striking that in the new, post-Virginia-Tech atmosphere, people are still running around going, "Oh what do we do?, what do we do?! with NO CLUE as to the positive value of armed self defense.

    You know what? Apart from you, who evidently are smart enough (and determined to survive enough) to carry despite the moronic rules, the rest of them kinda deserve whatever happens.

    If the guy comes in shooting and killing, he'll be only doing what he TOLD THEM WAY AHEAD OF TIME what he was going to do. Every day that they saunter into work defenseless is another day they wasted his warning.

    Let's flash forward: What if, a week from now, he does come in and, encountering a bunch of forewarned-but-still-pathetically-unarmed workers, he kills 11 of them. Pretend you are to be out that day. What the hell will the public response from the top of the ladder be?! What will they say about an office full of people who were warned about a potential massacre with a specific threat, but who kept coming in to work having decided nothing but where they planned to hide or what door they planned to try to escape out of?[/i]

    Forgive me for saying so, but one of the best things that could happen would be for you to be out that day (safely out of the situation), and this guy comes in and kills a bunch of people who knew they were going to be attacked and did nothing to help themselves -- in large part because it was "against the rules." It would probably, in the end, save lives -- IF the news media allowed it to be known that a) he had already warned everyone, and b) the only change that took place in the preparedness of the office is that everyone came in scared every day.

    How would it save lives? It might encourage more vehement contemptuous dialog condemning the idiotic policy of disarming the victim. Maybe more people would stop obeying that absurd rule.



    I respect your decision to put your life and safety first even if it jeopardizes your employment.

    If you were to be found out, without this guy coming in shooting, and fired for carrying, I would hope you'd make a HUGE ISSUE of it, hopefully in the media, and embarrass the hell out of them about forcing employees to be defenseless.

    Good luck.
    I could not agree more.

    Life > policy.

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