Killer in church - merge

Killer in church - merge

This is a discussion on Killer in church - merge within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,274013,00.html Well, we have been talking about it.... Funny thing, I was sitting in church this morning thinking, "I won't carry in church." Now, one ...

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Thread: Killer in church - merge

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array miklcolt45's Avatar
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    Killer in church - merge

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,274013,00.html

    Well, we have been talking about it....

    Funny thing, I was sitting in church this morning thinking, "I won't carry in church." Now, one more example of why I should.
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliott

    The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it.
    Albert Einstein


  2. #2
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    Nowhere is by default immune from danger or tragedy. Thus the usefulness of carry in all legal places.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Member Array whitestone's Avatar
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    Unfortunately church is not a sanctuary from attack

    Here's another church attack, this time in NY. That worshipping lady fought her attacker off with the only thing she had: her pen, which she promptly put into the BG's neck. Sounds like that woman knew a thing or two about makeshift self-defense!

    http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/art...tack18-ON.html

    I think this shows a belief by BGs that people in church are not prepared for an attack or are unwilling or too aged to fight back. Moreover, usually the church is empty and open to anybody who can walk in. Being in church has never changed my willingness to carry there.

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    Officers and others shot in Moscow, Idaho

    MOSCOW, Idaho - The bodies of two people were found this morning inside a church that had been surrounded by law enforcement officers after two officers and a civilian were wounded in bursts of automatic gunfire from the building.

    The incident occurred in Moscow, Idaho. About 75 shots were fired in the attack late last night, said David Duke, Moscow's assistant police chief. Duke says the attack was apparently an ambush, with the shooter firing into the nearby Latah County Courthouse to lure people into the line of fire.

    Tactical officers went into the First Presbyterian church after a standoff of more than five hours early this morning and found the bodies of two people inside.

    He says they believe one of those is the shooter. They do not know who the other person is, and do not know the identity of either person in the church.

    The semi-automatic rifle believed used to shoot the two officers and the civilian was found with one of the dead people, as was some ammunition and spent shells.
    The news conference revealed that the Moscow city officer died this morning. The Latah County Deputy still in serious condition. The civilian heard shots fired, came out of his house, and walked to the scene to see if he could help (?) and was shot. He's still in the hospital as well.

    The shooter used an SKS and started shooting into the building that held the dispatch center, the first couple officers responded and were shot at, the shooter retreated into a church. They found him dead this morning of his own devices. Not much is being released yet.

    They are calling him a "sniper" but that doesn't really seem to fit what he did. It was humorous to listen to the news talking heads discuss "rifle casings" found at the scene and other mis-quotes.

    Here's the link for the story so far http://www.q6.com/Global/story.asp?S=6541638

    Please pray for the officer's family and recovery of the other two injured. Moscow PD said they will have another news conference tomorrow morning at 11 with more information.

    Heck of a thing to get to work to this morning.

    To the guys in uniform (and others): stay safe.
    eschew obfuscation

    The only thing that stops bad guys with guns is good guys with guns. SgtD

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    Sorry, I missed miklcolt45 already posted this story.

    http://www.defensivecarry.com/vbulle...ad.php?t=25650
    eschew obfuscation

    The only thing that stops bad guys with guns is good guys with guns. SgtD

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    Senior Member Array kylebce's Avatar
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    I was in a seminar with Leo Gaje who is the "grandfather" of Pekiti Tirsia- a Filipino Martial art. He lives in the Philipines today. Was that a long enough intro? Anyway-

    Leo related this story- "I carry my .45 around the clock, it's with me everywhere I go. My wife complains "Oh Leo why do you have to carry into church?" His reply- If the Moros (Muslims) attack our church- I'm the only one armed and all your friends will say- "Wow I sure am glad Leo was here with his gun."

    My wife isn't into guns but tolerates me and my addiction, uh. habbit. After the Virginia Tech tragety she suggested- "Maybe you should carry to church too." Because thats about the only time I don't.
    G-23, 27, 35 (all .40)
    G-29 10mm
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    Les Baer Thunder Ranch 5"

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    The civilian heard shots fired, came out of his house, and walked to the scene to see if he could help (?) and was shot. He's still in the hospital as well.
    "Walked" to the scene of gunshots, to see if he could help. Strolled? With/without concern over maintaining cover? Armed or not. Unknown how, exactly, this citizen actually "walked" to the scene, given so little information, but it's a good reminder to all of us of the risks and reality of gunfire. Until proven otherwise, you've got to be prepared for the likelihood that the gunfire is coming from a BG wielding the gun in anger.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

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    Sorry, I missed miklcolt45 already posted this story.
    No problem John - I just did a merge
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Member Array DizTbone's Avatar
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    Wow...... Prayers and condolences.

    My DA says the church is my "place of business"...so...I'm good to go!

    Michael
    XD9 Service, CZ-75B, Glock 21, Kel-Tec P3AT
    Rifles...yes...and shotguns....and
    "Unofficial Legislative Attache...er...Watchdog...er...Agitator."
    "Yes, I vote...but not for the candidate I prefer: None of the Above."

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    Quote Originally Posted by ccw9mm View Post
    "Walked" to the scene of gunshots, to see if he could help. Strolled? With/without concern over maintaining cover? Armed or not. Unknown how, exactly, this citizen actually "walked" to the scene, given so little information, but it's a good reminder to all of us of the risks and reality of gunfire. Until proven otherwise, you've got to be prepared for the likelihood that the gunfire is coming from a BG wielding the gun in anger.
    Yeah, no details yet, according to the asst chief, he was still in surgery, so they hadn't had time to do any detailed interviews. Walked, ran, scrambled, what's the difference? He heard gunshots and went towards them. Not the smartest thing I've heard this morning.
    eschew obfuscation

    The only thing that stops bad guys with guns is good guys with guns. SgtD

  11. #11
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    MOSCOW, Idaho - The bodies of two people were found this morning inside a church that had been surrounded by law enforcement officers after two officers and a civilian were wounded in bursts of automatic gunfire from the building.

    The semi-automatic rifle believed used to shoot the two officers and the civilian was found with one of the dead people, as was some ammunition and spent shells.

    This kind of "mistake" is either DELIBERATE (like the public confusion about "assault weapon" that Josh Sugarman of HCI is quoted as intending) or it is the result of INCOMPETENT WRITING AND EDITING.

    The end result is that the public gets confused, and mistakenly puts its support behind efforts to ban things like semi-automatic rifles, because anti-gun propagandists lead them to think there is no difference between those, and guns that "spray" bullets.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    This kind of "mistake" is either DELIBERATE (like the public confusion about "assault weapon" that Josh Sugarman of HCI is quoted as intending) or it is the result of INCOMPETENT WRITING AND EDITING.

    The end result is that the public gets confused, and mistakenly puts its support behind efforts to ban things like semi-automatic rifles, because anti-gun propagandists lead them to think there is no difference between those, and guns that "spray" bullets.
    Yeah, it was strange that the asst chief kept calling it an automatic rifle and a member of the media tried to clarify "automatic or semi". Backwards if you ask me.
    eschew obfuscation

    The only thing that stops bad guys with guns is good guys with guns. SgtD

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    Theres no place that is off limits to evil. Be prepared for any thing but try not to become parrnoid.

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    My prayers go out to the families of the folks killed down there in Moscow. May God grant them peace and ease the pain of their loss. I know a few guys from Moscow and I have heard that it is a tight-nit community. I pray they help each other get through this tragedy.
    JJ Honeycutt- GodGunsGlory.com

    To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic. - Ted Nugent

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    VIP Member Array ELCruisr's Avatar
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    What's really weird is Miklcolt45 and the rest of us were just discussing the potential for violence in churches and synagogues yesterday at lunch. Evil knows no borders and respects no buildings.
    If you stand up and be counted, from time to time you may get yourself knocked down. But remember this: A man flattened by an opponent can get up again. A man flattened by conformity stays down for good. ~ Thomas J. Watson, Jr.

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