Statement of the Century, Lets Discuss.

This is a discussion on Statement of the Century, Lets Discuss. within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; From a very cynical standpoint, people like the author of that quote are necessary: they give a BG a target to shoot at while one ...

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 46 to 60 of 71

Thread: Statement of the Century, Lets Discuss.

  1. #46
    VIP Member
    Array Miggy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Miami-Dade, FL
    Posts
    6,258
    From a very cynical standpoint, people like the author of that quote are necessary: they give a BG a target to shoot at while one can take actions to defend him/herself.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #47
    Ex Member Array HOLYROLLER's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Spokane, WA
    Posts
    269
    Pacifists are necessary human targets? They distract the BG so we can save ourselves? Thats not cynical, its reprehensible.

    If our primary goal in this life is to save ourselves above all else, then we are the BG's.

  4. #48
    Member Array dustoff451's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Stockton, CA.
    Posts
    53

    Personal Will

    Ok, his/her choice. Like myself, many members on this forum have served in military and public service and have interacted with people that have opossing veiws. My point sir, don't fight back, don't resist evil, don't help the family next door. But... this same person(s) will try to force their will, ideas, lifestyle, ect. on others/us. And then when the rubber meets the road these same people want to see people 'swing'. I wonder how we stack up moraly? Clear Right!

  5. #49
    Senior Member Array DMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    MT
    Posts
    1,012
    I have a great example of someone who did refuse to kill, and would rather die than kill. His name was Desmond T. Doss. He is a true American hero! He was/is the only conscientious objector that has won the Medal of Honor. During World War II he refused to carry a gun, but also wanted to serve. He was became a medic and put his life on the line many times to save his fellow Americans.

    Look him up. Refused to kill, that doesn't say he was a complete pacifist. The book about him is also available named "The Unlikeliest Hero". A "Book Preview" is available here.
    "Gun Free Zones" is where only criminals carry guns.

  6. #50
    Senior Member Array Smith&Wessonfan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    508
    Some ask why some of us will only VERY reluctantly intervene on the behalf of others during a violent confrontation.

    That right there is one of my reasons. If most are not mature and responsible enough to provide for their own defense, why should I burden myself?

  7. #51
    Senior Member Array Smith&Wessonfan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    508
    Quote Originally Posted by HOLYROLLER View Post
    There is a fine line between us and the bad BG.
    No, there is not. Not even close.

    Frankly, I find your insinuation very insulting.

  8. #52
    VIP Member Array rodc13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas
    Posts
    2,753
    Quote Originally Posted by DMan View Post
    I have a great example of someone who did refuse to kill, and would rather die than kill. His name was Desmond T. Doss. He is a true American hero! He was/is the only conscientious objector that has won the Medal of Honor. During World War II he refused to carry a gun, but also wanted to serve. He was became a medic and put his life on the line many times to save his fellow Americans.

    Look him up. Refused to kill, that doesn't say he was a complete pacifist. The book about him is also available named "The Unlikeliest Hero". A "Book Preview" is available here.
    Doss is without a doubt a true hero, as are so many of the medics and other support troops who serve alongside combat units in the line of fire. Of course, they would hardly be true pacifists, since they're supporting those who do the fighting and killing. A pacifist in the strictest sense would not be an enabler of violence.
    Cheers,
    Rod
    "We're paratroopers. We're supposed to be surrounded!" Dick Winters

  9. #53
    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    1,387
    Quote Originally Posted by Andy W. View Post
    The Quakers & other pacifists believe it is worse to harm another than to be harmed. I sure don't understand it, but that's how some think.
    No comparison to the previously quoted statement.
    Quakers , Amish , and Mennonites aren't suicidal wimps.
    -------
    -SIG , it's What's for Dinner-

    know your rights!
    http://www.handgunlaw.us

    "If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
    {Bernhard Goetz}

  10. #54
    Senior Member Array Andy W.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    KY
    Posts
    983
    Quote Originally Posted by AKsrule View Post
    No comparison to the previously quoted statement.
    Quakers , Amish , and Mennonites aren't suicidal wimps.
    Most Quakers believe that it is wrong to engage in violence, I didn't say anything about Amish & Mennonites or call them suicidal wimps. The point I was making is that some people would rather be harmed than to cause harm, at least they claim to. That may very well change when they are under attack. Whatever their reasons are, religious beliefs, hippies, etc, I still don't understand it. But I respect their right to believe as they wish, just don't force it on me.

  11. #55
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    24,153
    Quote Originally Posted by HOLYROLLER View Post
    Pacifists are necessary human targets? They distract the BG so we can save ourselves? Thats not cynical, its reprehensible.
    Easy there. The point, here, is simple: in a field of two targets, the BG will typically choose the softer target to strike. It's a simple recognition of the weaker target's role in the "relationship" between BG and multiple GG's. This isn't like GG #1 is forcing GG #2 to do anything, here. It's acknowledging what's real and true about the nature of the people in play.

    Reality can be hard on those without a clue. Those innocents who walk around in the mistaken assumption they're not targets are, instead, setting themselves up as the most-appealing targets in the field by virtue of that lack of awareness.

    Nobody's opinion of that act changes that. The BG will be drawn to such folks. That is what it is. And, from the perspective of an armed GG that's less likely to become a target because of that, this isn't a bad thing.

    BG, GG/armed+aware, GG/oblivious: these three types of "actors" in the field are worlds apart. There is a monstrous gulf of difference between the three. But it's only the oblivious GG that sets himself up for a fall. Not our doing. Setting oneself up as the juiciest target in the field, without a clue and (by one's own hand) with little recourse? Reprehensible? No arguments here.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  12. #56
    Senior Member Array INTJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Middle Tennessee
    Posts
    596
    I'd rather be killed than take another life any day, no matter how tortured they are. Perhaps not a popular view, but it's mine.
    And he will be. What's the discussion?
    "Beware of the man who only owns one gun. He probably knows how to use it."

  13. #57
    Senior Member Array Andy W.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    KY
    Posts
    983
    Quote Originally Posted by INTJ View Post
    And he will be. What's the discussion?
    Good point!

  14. #58
    Senior Member Array INTJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Middle Tennessee
    Posts
    596
    Quote Originally Posted by Andy W. View Post
    Good point!
    I'm a black and white kinda guy.
    "Beware of the man who only owns one gun. He probably knows how to use it."

  15. #59
    Member Array mmwb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Western Wyoming
    Posts
    86
    "While the quote is not a sentiment I share, it does not bother me because its author acknowledges that it is unpopular and his viewpoint alone. It is unlikely that his view is going to cause me any grief. The real problem is when those with that view start imposing it upon the rest of us through laws."

    That is truly the problem. Too many sheep are uncomfortable with the sheep dogs and want us to be sheep too! The ballot box is our best friend or our worst enemy: Depending on whether we use it.


    In terms of the traditional Christian view... I've never considered Christ a pacifist. He took the time to braid a whip in the temple (premeditated act) and drove the money changers out. He gave up his life (it wasn't taken) to fulfill his mission and the role he plays in our lives. One has to remember, His death wasn't like yours and mine, He had the ability to take up again of His own accord. Christ taught that peace is the preferable solution we should seek, not that it was the only solution. I believe that is congruent with what most of us hold true. We avoid trouble. If we find ourselves in it, we do all we can to get out without harm to self or others. If we see no other options, we utilize violence to protect the innocent from the perpetrator.

  16. #60
    Senior Member Array INTJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Middle Tennessee
    Posts
    596
    Fact is we live in a fallen world and it aint my home, I'm only visiting. I make my visit what it is. The reason Jesus taught/teaches in parables was/is because so many could/would not understand. Same thing is true today.

    Following Jesus gives me a greater, more abundant and eternal life along with peace; a peace that surpasses understanding. I can defend life by taking another. Perhaps not a popular view, but it's mine. Torture has nothing to do with it.
    "Beware of the man who only owns one gun. He probably knows how to use it."

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. UNKNOWN: But a good event to discuss
    By rigel42 in forum In the News: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: February 14th, 2011, 09:57 PM
  2. NON-Hollowpoint Ammo... Discuss...
    By VTLO910 in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: July 12th, 2010, 07:35 PM
  3. VA Comm Colleges discuss gun ban
    By paramedic70002 in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: October 14th, 2007, 05:04 PM
  4. Discuss the many things the good guy did wrong
    By Maverick7340 in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: October 28th, 2006, 11:27 AM
  5. Betty, could you discuss your BOB?
    By The Tourist in forum Related Gear & Equipment
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: January 21st, 2005, 04:45 PM

Search tags for this page

statement of the century

Click on a term to search for related topics.