CHL Badges

This is a discussion on CHL Badges within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I didnt mean to imply anything about trigger happy, but its true when I say anything goes during an active shoot. Adrenaline, fear etc. does ...

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  1. #136
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    I didnt mean to imply anything about trigger happy, but its true when I say anything goes during an active shoot. Adrenaline, fear etc. does funny things to otherwise level headed, rational, well trained people.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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  3. #137
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    Just remember, If you are holding your attacker at gunpoint when they arrive... You know you are the good guy, and you know who the bad guy is...

    But the LEO's are not going to assume anything and probably not going to take anyones word on who's who when they first arrive and one party is still holding a gun.

    Sometimes it's obvious, but often times, it clearly isn't.
    I cover this in our CHL classes. If it isnt being taught everywhere, it ought to be.
    The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it...- George Orwell

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  4. #138
    Distinguished Member Array JerryM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    I didnt mean to imply anything about trigger happy, but its true when I say anything goes during an active shoot. Adrenaline, fear etc. does funny things to otherwise level headed, rational, well trained people.
    I certainly agree with that, and it behooves each of us to be aware of it.

    When a cop tells me to do something I will do it. He is the boss at that time, and if he is wrong we can settle it later with the chief, but he is in charge at a traffic stop and especially at a shooting. I don't remember the last time I had an encounter with a cop, but he is the boss.

    I agree with the thinking that at the side of the road in a tense situation is not the time to argue the Constitution. :)

    Regards,
    Jerry

  5. #139
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    LEOs don't have time to investigate who's who when they pull up, the first job is to neutralize the situation then collect info. If you have not re-holstered you are still part if the problem as far as they are concerned. Ask any LEO and they will say the most important part of the job is to go home alive every night. I dead cop helps nobody.
    For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the son of man be. Mathew 24:27

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  6. #140
    Senior Member Array mulle46's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JerryM View Post
    I do not believe that if one were holding a gun on the BG, and not waving it around, and dropped the gun when ordered to do so, there would be no shooting. I do personally know a lot of LEOs and not one is trigger happy. Just follow their orders. they are no-nonsense in such situations but would not shoot immediately if a person was holding a gun and not pointing at them if that person followed their orders.

    But it is not an issue with me as I would not have a gun in my hand when they drove up.

    Regards,
    Jerry
    As a LEO myself, I know a lot of LEO'S. I can't say that I wouldn't shoot someone who is not pointing a weapon at me, but is pointing a weapon at someone else. As a LEO, we have more of a responsibility to act than a CCW holder. To me, just because the BG isn't pointing the weapon at me, doesn't mean I would not discharge my weapon if the BG is threatening someone else. OMO
    You gain strength, courage, and confidence by every experience in which you really stop to look fear in the face. You are able to say to yourself, "I have lived through this horror. I can take the next thing that comes along." . . . You must do the thing you think you cannot do. Eleanor Roosevelt

  7. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by mulle46 View Post
    As a LEO myself, I know a lot of LEO'S. I can't say that I wouldn't shoot someone who is not pointing a weapon at me, but is pointing a weapon at someone else. As a LEO, we have more of a responsibility to act than a CCW holder. To me, just because the BG isn't pointing the weapon at me, doesn't mean I would not discharge my weapon if the BG is threatening someone else. OMO
    Sure, but you would surely assess the situation. I agree that one should not be holding a gun when the LEO arrives, but if one were holding a BG who had just slit his GF throat and you shot I think you would be unjustified since there was no threat to anyone except the BG. Sure you would not know who was who, but if there were no shooting, it would be a mistake to just drive up see a man holding a gun and shoot him without any command to drop the gun.

    It is up to you what you would do, but having been on a Chiefs Advisory Committee I know how I think about such things, and how some chiefs think. You are paid to take more risk, and you have a greater responsibility to use good judgment. If you drove up, saw someone holding a gun not pointed at you, and just shot him you would be negligent in my view.
    In all cases it is a judgment call, and one has the right to expect an LEO to use good judgment, even if not perfect.

    I will leave it at that as we probably will not come to a complete agreement. I think we can agree that any method, such as a badge, that would try to tell a cop that the CHL holder is a good guy and it is OK for him to hold his gun is a really bad idea, and would cause more trouble than he was prepared for.

    Regards,
    Jerry

  8. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by JerryM View Post
    If you drove up, saw someone holding a gun not pointed at you, and just shot him you would be negligent in my view.
    It may very well be negligent; but that someone is still dead.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  9. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    It may very well be negligent; but that someone is still dead.

    Yeah... kind of a hollow victory!

    You're dead, but by golly the guy who shot you was out of line!

    Don't think my wife would be feeling the righteousness in that case.

    Although... she may be getting a settlement later on down the road, so she may be ok with it. At least I'd be out of her hair... Ok, I have a twisted sense of humor.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  10. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    They seem to "must have" the ccw badge, or some "special ID holder" or some other gimmick!

    Which leads one to question, What is the real motive for wanting a ccw badge?
    I wouldn't mind having a CCW Badge just for a novelty... something just to keep around the house for show, but I'm not spending $40+ for something that will not have an actual use. And no, I wouldn't take it outside, concealed means concealed.
    It is to be observed that Right of Self-Defence, arises directly and immediately from the Care of our own Preservation, which Nature recommends to every one. . . , and that this right is so primary, that it cannot be denied on the basis that it is not "expressly set forth.

    --- Hugo Grotius

  11. #145
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    right i'll keep what i got now as is in my pocket works for me ok "if it's not broke dont fix it '

  12. #146
    Senior Member Array Old Sarge's Avatar
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    Obviously, the original poster on this blog, just doesn't get it. CCW is exactly that!! If everyone carried OC, then there would be no need for a badge. The whole purpose of CCW, is the element of surprise. Pure and simple.

  13. #147
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    How about a self inflating mylar balloon that you can deploy while you're waiting for police to show up. It would pop out of your hat and have " DON'T SHOOT I'M A GOOD GUY " printed on it in reflective ink ?

  14. #148
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    Thanks but no thanks
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  15. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by boscobeans View Post
    How about a self inflating mylar balloon that you can deploy while you're waiting for police to show up. It would pop out of your hat and have " DON'T SHOOT I'M A GOOD GUY " printed on it in reflective ink ?
    ...but then the criminals will start using that, too.

  16. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by cwblanco View Post
    I can see it now -- bad guys advertising phony "ARMED decals for only $100.00. Enhances armed robbery success by 100% by making the public think you are one of the good guys."

    If you want to give up concealed carry and go to open carry, why don't you just come out and say it. On the other hand, if you have yearnings to be a cop or a soldier, go apply.

    In the meanwhile, if there is any problem, I have my permit in my wallet.
    Geez. The license or permit in the OP would be concealed until it was needed. So for most states, the "BG" would have to duplicate something that looks like a driver's license - then walk around with it in the open - which AGAIN - was not what the OP stated.

    Second part of your comment is totally uncalled for. If you would have read the OP - it is a flip down license/permit holder - that remains concealed. I don't see this in any way desiring to be a cop or anything else. IT IS NOT A BADGE that resembles in ANY FASHION THAT OF A LEO. At best it does it's job and identifies you quickly to any responding LEOs - at worst it looks like an employment badge and had no effect one way or the other. I do like the idea of being able to "quickly" hand over identification - this is really no different than some keeping their driver's license/reg on the visor.

    Some off you just jump on the "bashing bandwagon" because it is rolling. And get way off topic from what the OP had intended.

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