College carrying question

College carrying question

This is a discussion on College carrying question within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; In light of the recent events at VA tech, I was wondering about carrying on a college campus in general. There's a federal law prohibiting ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array BillR's Avatar
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    College carrying question

    In light of the recent events at VA tech, I was wondering about carrying on a college campus in general.
    There's a federal law prohibiting firearm possesion on school grounds for elementary and secondary schools. Would this "cover" colleges also, or are colleges and universities considered seperate from the "gun-free school zone" laws?
    I guess I was wondering about the possible ramifications of getting caught with a firearm on a college campus. Is it like the mall where they can ask you to leave if you're made, or are you in a crap-load more trouble because it falls under a federal law as opposed to a local ordinance.
    Anyone know for sure?
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    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    There is no federal law against carry on college campuses. Some states (including Arizona) have laws against campus carry. Almost all colleges have rules against carry, with academic penalties, but these generally apply to students, faculty, and staff, not visitors to campus.

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    Senior Member Array Shizzlemah's Avatar
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    Colleges are not part of the gun free zone dealio.

    Some states are ok with it , some states it is legal but may not last (Maine) and some are verbotten. But all state laws, no feds.

    If there is no state law against carry on campus, then you only can only get in trouble academically (like being expelled, etc)

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    Member Array BillR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackeagle View Post
    There is no federal law against carry on college campuses. Some states (including Arizona) have laws against campus carry. Almost all colleges have rules against carry, with academic penalties, but these generally apply to students, faculty, and staff, not visitors to campus.
    Yep, just found it.
    http://www.packing.org/state/arizona/#stateoff_limits
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    Distinguished Member Array SonofASniper's Avatar
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    Where did you get that there is a federal law against carrying on school grounds for elementary and secondary schools? I just read through title 18 of the US code and it only addresses federal property for restrictions.
    I will support gun control when you can guarantee all guns are removed from this planet. That includes military and law enforcement. When you can accomplish that, then I will be the last person to lay down my gun. Then I will carry the weapon that replaces the gun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SonofASniper View Post
    Where did you get that there is a federal law against carrying on school grounds for elementary and secondary schools? I just read through title 18 of the US code and it only addresses federal property for restrictions.
    I don't believe the OP was stating that it was federal law, but asking if colleges were under the federal law. seems he has the answer that no colleges are not covered under federal law, but he needs to go to college in Utah to be able to carry at college.
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    Distinguished Member Array SonofASniper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillR View Post
    There's a federal law prohibiting firearm possesion on school grounds for elementary and secondary schools.
    Scott, this is what I was questioning him about. I read it as bill stating there is a federal law prohibiting carry on shools k-12.

    I wanted to know if there is one, where did bill find it.

    And no, Utah is not the only state that allows carry on college campus. In fact, there is at least one state that has an exemption for ccw carriers to carry on all a school properties. They just don't gain the noteriety because they did not make a big hooplah of creating a specific law like Utah, and its also kind of surprise considering the overall anti-gun liberal politics of that state.
    I will support gun control when you can guarantee all guns are removed from this planet. That includes military and law enforcement. When you can accomplish that, then I will be the last person to lay down my gun. Then I will carry the weapon that replaces the gun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SonofASniper View Post
    Scott, this is what I was questioning him about. I read it as bill stating there is a federal law prohibiting carry on shools k-12.

    I wanted to know if there is one, where did bill find it.

    And no, Utah is not the only state that allows carry on college campus. In fact, there is at least one state that has an exemption for ccw carriers to carry on all a school properties. They just don't gain the noteriety because they did not make a big hooplah of creating a specific law like Utah, and its also kind of surprise considering the overall anti-gun liberal politics of that state.
    I know there are other states that allow carry on college campuses, but just didn't feel like looking for them right now. Utah came to mind because of a discussion I had after the VT shootings.

    I missed the Federal Gun Free School Zones comment as I focused on the college campus. GFSZ was struck wasn't it? Then a bunch of states enacted something similar? Causes mucho confusion.

    VA exempts permit holders that are picking up or dropping off students while carrying, but the carrier cannot exit the vehicle while armed. Otherwise the gun just has to be in a "locked container" while on school grounds. A trunk is considered a locked container for purposes of the law. The VCDL guys got that cleaned up a few years back.
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    Member Array BillR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SonofASniper View Post
    Scott, this is what I was questioning him about. I read it as bill stating there is a federal law prohibiting carry on shools k-12.

    I wanted to know if there is one, where did bill find it.

    And no, Utah is not the only state that allows carry on college campus. In fact, there is at least one state that has an exemption for ccw carriers to carry on all a school properties. They just don't gain the noteriety because they did not make a big hooplah of creating a specific law like Utah, and its also kind of surprise considering the overall anti-gun liberal politics of that state.
    According to a book I got for my CCW class, called "AZ gun owners guide", the law falls under the "Omnibus Consolidated Appropriation Act for FY1997, Section 657, Gun-Free School Zone".
    The book says "The law makes it a federal crime to knowingly have a firearm at a place that you know, or should resonably believe, is a school zone. A school zone means in or on the grounds of an elementary or secondary public, private or parochial school, and the area within 1000 feet from the grounds of a school."
    There are some exceptions such as in a private residence or in a private vehicle in the proximity of a school.
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  10. #10
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    Public Law 104-208 Omnibus Consolidated Appropriations Act For Fiscal Year 1997
    Sec. 101(b) Department of Defense Appropriations Act, 1997
    Section 657, Gun-Free School Zone.
    THE GIST: Congress was rebuffed in its attempt to exercise police powers at the state level by the U.S. Supreme Court, when the court declared the 1991 Gun-Free School Zone law unconstitutional, in 1995. That law was reenacted, to the surprise of many observers, as an unnoticed add-on to a 2,000-page federal spending bill, in a form essentially identical to the one the Supreme Court overturned.

    The law makes it a federal crime to knowingly have a firearm within 1,000 feet of a school. An exemption is granted to anyone willing to register with the government for a specified license to carry the firearm (most concealed-carry permits would qualify, most hunting licenses would not).

    The prohibition does not apply to: 1-Firearms while on private property that is not part of the school grounds; 2-Any firearm that is unloaded and in a locked container; 3-Any firearm unloaded and locked in a firearms rack on a motor vehicle; 4-Possession of a firearm for use in an approved school program; 5-Possession under a contract with the school; 6-Possession by law enforcement officers in an official capacity; and 7-An unloaded firearm, while crossing school premises to public or private land open to hunting, if crossing the grounds is authorized by the school.

    It is also illegal to fire a gun (or attempt to fire a gun), knowingly or with reckless disregard for safety, in a place you know is a school zone, with the following exceptions: 1-On private property that is not part of the school grounds; 2-As part of a program approved by the school; 3-Under contract with the school; 4-By law enforcement acting in an official capacity. Self defense is not mentioned, and presumably, a self-defense shooting in a school zone, unless on private property, would violate this law. States are not prohibited from passing their own laws.

    America had 121,855 public and private schools as of 1994. In effect, this law criminalizes the actions of nearly anyone who travels in a populated area with a legally possessed firearm. As with its overturned predecessor, its affect on the very real problem of youth violence is unclear, and of course, any firearm used illegally in America, whether it is near a school or not, is already a serious crime with heavy penalties.

    Full text of this statute is available in Gun Laws Of America
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    Senior Member Array Shizzlemah's Avatar
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    What I am curious about is how the Gun Free School Zone interacts with states that allow CCW in k-12.

    I am pretty sure there are about 10-12 states that allow guns in school. One can only assume that no 12th grader is 21 years old and elligible for a permit :-)

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    Senior Member Array raysheen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillR View Post
    There are some exceptions such as in a private residence or in a private vehicle in the proximity of a school.
    and it does not apply
    If the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtain such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license
    further you have to "know or have reasonable knowledge" that you are in a school zone

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    Senior Member Array incredipete's Avatar
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    A lot of states prohibit campus carry, and you should also note any university policies, as they can get you expelled if you don't mind your p's and q's.
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    Senior Member Array zero's Avatar
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    campus carry

    Quote Originally Posted by BillR View Post
    In light of the recent events at VA tech, I was wondering about carrying on a college campus in general.
    There's a federal law prohibiting firearm possesion on school grounds for elementary and secondary schools. Would this "cover" colleges also, or are colleges and universities considered seperate from the "gun-free school zone" laws?
    I guess I was wondering about the possible ramifications of getting caught with a firearm on a college campus. Is it like the mall where they can ask you to leave if you're made, or are you in a crap-load more trouble because it falls under a federal law as opposed to a local ordinance.
    Anyone know for sure?
    Try checking this out:

    http://concealedcampus.org/

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