Alcohol and CCW

This is a discussion on Alcohol and CCW within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Scot said: "As for no reason to store in a vehicle well, I have a lot of reasons. If I am discovered carrying a gun ...

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Thread: Alcohol and CCW

  1. #31
    Member Array samb's Avatar
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    Scot said:
    "As for no reason to store in a vehicle well, I have a lot of reasons. If I am discovered carrying a gun where I work I am terminated."

    That isn't enough reason for me to not carry. Not today with such small guns available. If it ever HTF while at work, and I was terminated for carrying when I had to defend myself and others, I'd console myself with that I survived the incident - and possibly helped another one or two survive.
    ---
    Scott said:
    "Depending on the client site I'm working at I could end up in federal prison. The former is not something I want, and the latter is something I'd rather not contemplate."

    Imprisonment is a deterrent to carrying. Neither would I under those circumstances. However, I doubt I would take a job in the first place with such a restriction on my carrying.
    --------
    Scott said:
    "You can say get a new job, but it isn't that simple. I thoroughly enjoy what I do and I am very well compensated."

    Well, that's simple. You choose a way of life which denies you the right to defend yourself. Your life. Your choice. I never would have made such a choice.
    -------------
    Scott said:
    "There are sometimes circumstances beyond my control that dictate that I must leave my gun in the vehicle. It is something that happens whether or not I want it to or not. It's nice for you to be in a position where you cannot accept it. Someday I'll be there as well I hope (retirement)."

    Outside of the restriction of entering a no-gun zone as dictated by the state or federal government, I would carry everywhere.

    This entire matter, except for carrying in an illegal no-gun zone, is really a matter of choice. You are gambling that the wheel will not stop on your number someday.

    Yes, retirement is nice. I don't have to spend a fortune on fancy holsters in order to conceal my carry. Also, in my state there is no silly "printing" law, which helps quite a bit.

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  3. #32
    Member Array samb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergeant Mac View Post
    I simply cannot accept blaming anyone but the THIEF for a theft, or anyone but the MURDERER for the murder...
    I totally disagree.

    The day I found myself with two guns, one more than I wanted to carry at that time, I went out and bought gun safe. It's almost 6 feet high and weighs almost a half-ton. That's how serious I took the responsibility of having guns in my home. Now, I have quite a bit more than just two guns. What I don't carry when leaving the house goes into the safe. What I don't bring upstairs to bed with me goes in the safe. The safe is even locked while I'm out mowing the lawn or doing other yard chores.

    It's simple. A great responsibility comes along with having guns in the home. Too many people kid themselves with excuses because they really don't want to go to the extra trouble or expense of doing things properly.

    I believe firmly in the adage that the only way anyone gets one of my guns is from my dead, cold hand.

    (I know - I'm an ornery s.o.b. Age does that to one. It also gets one to the point of not accepting half-ass excuses for evading responsibility.)

  4. #33
    Member Array njeske's Avatar
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    If I'm out to dinner I may have one beer or a single glass of wine. Never more. I have gone out to bars with friends, but I don't drink. I'll be D.D. There's been times where I've gone to a house party and will lock my gun in the truck because I know I'm going to drink. In that situation I either stay the night, or my wife is D.D.

  5. #34
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    Personally, even though I legally can... I would NEVER drink while CCW, no not even one!

    There are many reasons why on several other threads.

    Friends or gun then... situational choice I guess!
    ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!

    "A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
    judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
    superior skills."

  6. #35
    Senior Member Array rachilders's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArtificialGrape View Post
    Exactly, while leaving a gun out of view and locked in a car isn't ideal, I wouldn't exactly call it negligent either.
    There are a some people who would strongly disagree with you, but I'm not one in this case. While I try to do everything in my power to secure my weapons when they aren't on me, things do happen. I had several guns stolen from my home about 15 years ago while I was away on business. Neighborhood teens broke in, stole the safe several pistols were in (cut it loose from the closet floor and carried that 500 Lb sucker away). I eventually got three of my four stolen pistols back, but it took several years before they were found and returned and at least one, a Ruger P-85, was used by drug dealers in several drive-by shootings according to the police. I admit felt bad when I heard how the one pistol was used and regret the pistol was probably used to take a life. I even considered selling it or having it destroyed, by decided against it. My wife now calls that gun the "murder weapon", but I STILL have that gun and my wife actually prefers it to our others and even used it the last time she had to qualify at the range for her CC permit!

    I have an SUV that has an alarm and a tracking system if it should be stolen. Sometimes, I do lock my gun in the car such as when I have to talk with one of my kids teachers at school. While I would feel bad (as well as very mad) if my vehicle were stolen and the gun used in a shooting, I'd feel no more guilty than if the stolen car were used in a robbery or hit and run. I took what I felt were adequate precautions and if they weren't enough, then the thief/robber/shooter, hit & run driver is the one who must carry the quilt and the blame.
    Last edited by rachilders; June 1st, 2007 at 02:17 AM.
    "... Americans... we want a safe home, to keep the money we make and shoot bad guys." -- Denny Crane

  7. #36
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    I'm almost a teetotaler, based on lack of a "taste" for it rather than any overt problem with it. Let's just say that the eight month period in college with my three roommates was an education. The couple of dance tapes I made for the dorm parties were, shall we say, interesting. Looking on the bright side, I can't think of a more-effective way to learn about "bed spins" and the value of fine porcelain. Though, truth be told, had someone devised an alternative training method, nobody would have been happier than I. Gawd. Thankfully, that was a long time ago. Older & wiser, I think they call it.

    As for forcing my choices on others, though, I'm for the following guideline: don't carry while intoxicated or affected. If you do, you're as at-risk as with any other dangerous machine or tool. If you end up inflicting damage or threatening others while intoxicated/influenced and are carrying, you're on tap to explain yourself to the judge or jury. In that sense, I'm for responsible carrying and against irresponsible carrying. I'm flatly against prohibition by state edict, in regards to access/presence, when armed. That said, the degree to which certain states criminalize even getting onto the premises of an establishment that sells alcoholic products goes, IMO, way too far.

    The way I handle it: If I'm awake, I'm armed. If I'm armed, I don't drink alcohol. Diet cola, tea or water goes down just as well. That covers every situation I know of.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  8. #37
    Ex Member Array Pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by samb
    People who get their guns stolen from their auto should lose their ccw permit permanently.
    Interesting concept, I'm sure you wouldn't mind if that was applied across the board then?

    If your car gets car stolen you lose your driving license.

    Why punish someone who has locked their firearm in the car to adhere to a law? They did all they can under those circumstances, what do you do when you go into a Post Office or other government building? Do you avoid those buildings, would you refuse to do jury duty because you refuse to go anywhere unarmed or would have to hand in your permit if you left your gun in the car and it was stolen?

    Your attitude seems to say that you are the only one good enough to carry, your attack on Scott sealed that opinion for me.

  9. #38
    Distinguished Member Array Dakotaranger's Avatar
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    My state has the same law. I don't drink but if I go to such an establishment I suggest a picnic and the pickup window at those establishments that serve booze.
    "[T]he people are not to be disarmed of their weapons.
    They are left in full possession of them."

    Zacharia Johnson (speech in the Virginia Ratifying Convention,25 June 1778)"The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed." ~Alexander Hamilton

  10. #39
    VIP Member Array obxned's Avatar
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    Even if it is legal to carry in bars where you live, is it really a smart move??
    "If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan

  11. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by SelfDefense View Post
    Thanks for understanding the intent of my question. I obviously worded it poorly (and chose a bad title) for it to be misconstrued so badly. Further, I did not intend to mean abandon friends permanently and get new ones but to politely decline in a particular instance (perhaps frequently) rather than going unarmed.

    It has raised an interesting issue regarding the storage of the CCW in the car. But another issue is if it is concealed and your friends are unaware you carry then how do you secure the weapon without revealing you carry.
    I can relate to this as I don't know anyone else who carries.

    As an example, I became buddies with this guy about two months ago and we would hang out at clubs/bars and such, but I'd always insist we take separate vehicles so that he never had to see me store my weapon. Well, one day I decided I'll just let him know and see how he takes it since I figured he'd understand. We went out in my car one night, and he saw me putting my pistol away and asked "what am i doing with that?" (the whole anti-gun speech), and he basically told me that he doesn't see why anyone needs a pistol to protect themself. Needless to say, he no longer wants to hang out with me.

    Stupid? Perhaps. Should I have handled it differently...that I'm not well versed on. Thoughts? How do you handle hanging out with your friends who don't carry, and don't know that you carry? Do you just never tell them, avoid inviting them to your home etc? I feel that if I was hanging out in the same vehicle with someone and they were armed, I would want to know in case something went down. *shrugs*

  12. #41
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    Not revealing is a tough one if you are all together. gunlock had it down by always taking another car. Otherwise the only other way I could see it working is dropping everyone off and going to park the car. That means you have to drive everywhere. I suppose you could use a fanny pack or similar allowing you to remove it without anyone being suspicious, of course you may take a lot of flack for wearing a fanny pack. If you know you are going to a prohibited place you could always secure your gun in your car ahead of time. Again you drive everywhere.

    Having anti-rights friends happens. When I was younger I had anti-rights friends, we grew apart over time (differing values and interests). Now all the people I choose to hang with are all CHP holders, LEOs (active and retired) who don't need a CHP or people who know I have a CHP and that I carry and don't have a problem with it. It takes time though and along the way you will offend a few people you called friends, I did.

    I have learned over time that people who have made up their minds about guns, will rarely if ever change their opinion. It can happen, but it takes a long time. One of those "core values" things. People who are on the fence and exposed to positive role models will usually come down on the pro-rights side of the fence.
    Procrastinators are the leaders of tomorrow.

  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by 0.02 View Post
    Interesting concept, I'm sure you wouldn't mind if that was applied across the board then?

    If your car gets car stolen you lose your driving license.

    Why punish someone who has locked their firearm in the car to adhere to a law? They did all they can under those circumstances, what do you do when you go into a Post Office or other government building? Do you avoid those buildings, would you refuse to do jury duty because you refuse to go anywhere unarmed or would have to hand in your permit if you left your gun in the car and it was stolen?

    Your attitude seems to say that you are the only one good enough to carry, your attack on Scott sealed that opinion for me.
    I didn't take it as an attack. He stated his opinion. I don't agree with him, but that is how it goes. When I'm retired I'll likely not ever go anywhere that is a prohibited place. Until then the realities of life dictate that I do go to prohibited places. So instead I am an activist. I write and call the folks who make the laws and lobby them to support good legislation and to oppose bad legislation. I am not currently at a level of influence where I can help write legislation, but someday I will be, because that is a goal of mine.

    As I stated before, I don't like leaving my gun in the vehicle, however sometimes I must. I don't believe that anyone who leaves their gun in their vehicle, and subsequently has it stolen, should face a lifetime revocation of a right. Obviously there are people who think that I am wrong in my opinion.
    Procrastinators are the leaders of tomorrow.

  14. #43
    Member Array dls56's Avatar
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    I don't drink so there's no issue for me there.
    I don't feel it's my responsibility to go to extreme measures in regards to locking a gun in a car or truck. If they're willing to break into your vehicle they will in all likelihood go the extra mile and break into the gun safe. I'll go as far as keeping it out of sight to prevent detection. There is no law that says you need to do more.
    With that said if I were in a neighborhood or other place that a break-in could be expected I'd do something different. Preferably not be there.

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