Undercover LEO vs. Permit Holder Shooting

This is a discussion on Undercover LEO vs. Permit Holder Shooting within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Heres some of the things that make it seem like Shellum isn't forthright. He makes a statement: The officer has been working undercover for the ...

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Thread: Undercover LEO vs. Permit Holder Shooting

  1. #31
    New Member Array Inebrius's Avatar
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    Heres some of the things that make it seem like Shellum isn't forthright. He makes a statement:

    The officer has been working undercover for the past year and will stay in that role for at least the next 18 months, Shellum said.

    He would not go into specifics about what his officer was doing in Coon Rapids.

    The officer hadn't alerted Coon Rapids police that he would be in their city, which would be a common procedure if any arrests were planned.

    "He could've been following up on a lead or meeting an informant," Shellum said. "Obviously, if an arrest would have been executed there, we would've let [Coon Rapids] know. ... He was working."
    But then you find out through minimal investigative reporting on behalf of the Star Tribune:

    The officer was recovering at home Friday morning and doing fine, said a woman at his Coon Rapids townhome, less than a mile from the shooting site. She said she was his fiancée.
    Working in Coon Rapids? Or was he coming or going from his house not working? Shellum is making it look like he's trying to cover up something.

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  3. #32
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    I am not one to bash LEO, I work with LEO on a regular basis and have a close friend who is LEO. From my experiences and my friends words it is my opinion that many of the younger LEO are on a power trip. Many believe that they are the ultimate authority, I believe this Cop was on a power trip.
    Mark

    "The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose."

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  4. #33
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    So far it looks like a cover up to me too.
    I do believe they were all in the wrong though. Anyone carrying shouldn't be flipping anyone off. In my eyes they are both guilty because they both participated in escalating the problem to the point that it got out of control.
    “You come at me with a sword and with a spear. But I come at you in the name of the LORD of hosts, the God of the armies of Israel, whom you have defied. This day the LORD will deliver you into my hand, and I will strike you and take your head from you". 1 Samuel 17, 45-46
    Brian

  5. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alien Nation View Post
    So far it looks like a cover up to me too.
    I do believe they were all in the wrong though. Anyone carrying shouldn't be flipping anyone off. In my eyes they are both guilty because they both participated in escalating the problem to the point that it got out of control.
    I do believe this is the best answer to the thread yet.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  6. #35
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aelbric View Post
    I'm kinda new to this but doesn't the following quote seem to justify his actions?:

    "We're about three feet away from each other and he's pointing the gun at my wife, so it was a tough situation, where I couldn't drive away at that particular moment, I had to defend my family," Treptow said.

    The question I would ask is why an undercover police officer is pulling his weapon after a traffic stop.
    Nope.

    The cop exiting his vehicle was the end to a story that was built up.
    From the start the CCW should have not been engaged in bantering back and forth verbally nor gesturing with various fingers displeasure with the other driver...who just so happened to be a police.
    Further the cop should very much know better as well.

    Don't engage people like this. Do not yell out your window. Do not show them sign language.
    Just select 'Drive' on your tranny and drive away and let that fool go off to ruin someone elses day if not life.

    Especially if you have your wife and children in the car with you (!).
    One has a personal responsibility to ones self and their family and thus again cooler heads absolutely must prevail whilst being a civilian carrying weapons.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  7. #36
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    Sounds Justified

    As a former LEO, the FIRST thing that you display is your badge, NOT your weapon. Plus, he should have used extreme caution when becoming involved in an off-duty "road rage" type of thing. Always better to use your cell phone and call for a marked back up, rather than trying a Rambo-style manuever alone in your personal vehicle.

    27 years old probably explains it. Bet he'll never make THAT mistake again.

    I once stopped a very young LAPD officer for speeding while towing his ski boat with his girl friend in the car. When I approached and asked for his license, he buzzed me (flashed his badge). I said, "That's nice, but I asked for your license and registration."

    He responded, "That's all you need to see."

    I said, "Well, maybe in L.A., but you're not IN L.A. Now, you've got exactly 5 seconds to show me what I asked for, or you're going to jail pal."

    He did. The young ones always have to learn the hard way

  8. #37
    Distinguished Member Array fed_wif_a_sig's Avatar
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    "Treptow says as the driver got out of his, he pulled out a weapon."

    and

    "The officer fell out of his car and onto the side of the road, while his car rolled backward across 99th, coming to rest when it hit a pizzeria."

    Those two statements are why, I (like the prosecuting attorney) am going to wait till the investigation is completed before making a decision. The fact that the officer "fell out of his car" makes me go hmmmmmmm. If he was shot while still in his vehicle exiting, then mr citizen has some issues. If mr officer was standing by the window pointing a gun at mr citizens wife, them mr officer has some issues. Either way, the investigation, which will include bullet trajectories will point it out. Another issue to think about is how did a man in a SUV aim at a person standing next to his vehicle and hit him in the legs. To presumption I'd make (without looking at crime scene photos) is that he leaned up over his wife and shot down towards someone getting out of a vehicle.

    Those are the kind of details that make up an investigation that means we should wait till it is over before we start throwing dirt on either one.

    Bad situation all around, and goes to show why road rage is bad all around.
    Steve
    "Respect all ... Fear none!!!

  9. #38
    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    It sounds like the LEO was haveing a bad day and took it out on the wrong person. Everyone is human. I'm just glad that no one was killed.If you find out any more about this case I would like to hear about it. You can never tell what happened until all the facts are in.

  10. #39
    Senior Member Array Slim_45's Avatar
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    We citizen CCW types must brush off road raging jerks, who just might maybe be a cop.
    Well iam sorry but just because your an LEO doesnt mean u can do whatever u want, if someone in plain clothes like that came up to my car with my wife & son & drew a gun on me i feel bad for him I agree with that man & obviously the law sees that side also or they would not let him go. Iam sure he would not fire his gun in such close proximity to his family without just cause....

  11. #40
    Senior Member Array Slim_45's Avatar
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    I
    once stopped a very young LAPD officer for speeding while towing his ski boat with his girl friend in the car. When I approached and asked for his license, he buzzed me (flashed his badge). I said, "That's nice, but I asked for your license and registration."

    He responded, "That's all you need to see."

    I said, "Well, maybe in L.A., but you're not IN L.A. Now, you've got exactly 5 seconds to show me what I asked for, or you're going to jail pal."

    He did. The young ones always have to learn the hard way
    Thats a funny story (but true alot) I love it !!!

  12. #41
    Senior Member Array Sig229's Avatar
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    Glad to see the LEO and the CHL holder are alright.

    And to think a few days ago I posted about a situation much like this.
    Primary Carry Gun: Sig Sauer 229~R (.40cal w/ Golden Saber JHP's)

  13. #42
    Member Array xercise2nd's Avatar
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alien Nation
    So far it looks like a cover up to me too.
    I do believe they were all in the wrong though. Anyone carrying shouldn't be flipping anyone off. In my eyes they are both guilty because they both participated in escalating the problem to the point that it got out of control.
    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    I do believe this is the best answer to the thread yet.
    I'll second that. Personal case in point. Yesterday I was on a drive home. Got off the interstate on to a two laner driving my SUV. I come up behind (safe distance) a biker, legs spread and parallel to the road, cruising along about 5 mph below the speed limit (55) and hugging the right, white line. I ride a motocycle, too, and the first thing I think of is that this guy is asking for trouble from someone who would try to pass him on the lane. (I've always been taught and practice riding left of the center of my lane as much as possible.) Not me; I'll wait for a passing area. So as I wait for a safe pass, this guy does a head-screw, upper half-body turn over his left and starts flipping me out with his left hand! Then when I don't respond, he slows down in front of me and continues gesticulating. I slow in kind, now going from yellow to ...well...almost orange, but he gets back to eyes forward while I continue behind him at a safe, manueverable distance.

    The road breaks out to a four-laner in several more hundred feet, and I am wondering what he's going to do. I'm determined not to pass him which would put me at a disadvantage and possibly incite him. (Who would actually know?) As it turned out, he took the first exit and again expressed himself with a repeat hand signal. I gave him a Peace-sign and then wondered if he would have seen the index finger vee-d out from the tall-man and get my intended message of good will. Back to condition yellow and that was the last I saw of the guy. (I want to say "jerk" but I haven't a clue what he perceived was a cause for his behavior.)

    Point is that I agree with Alien Nation and SIXTO. With greater power comes added responsibility. Losing one's cool is not an option when carrying concealed especially.
    "Our Constitution was made only for a religious and moral people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." --- John Adams
    (1735-1826) Founding Father, 2nd US President
    Source: Oct. 11, 1798; Address to the military

  14. #43
    Member Array Catalina's Avatar
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    many of the younger LEO are on a power trip. Many believe that they are the ultimate authority
    Old timers call them "FNG's" - *&#$! new guys. After a few lawsuits and about 2 or 3 years on the job they calm down, if they make it that long.
    Go Glock - until you can afford H&K

  15. #44
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    I would expect to see some restraint on both parts...but would certainly have expected the LE to identify himself...something does not smell right here...the fact that the civilian was not arrested says something...

    More to follow, I'm sure...

    ret
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  16. #45
    VIP Member Array Sig 210's Avatar
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    It takes two at least two folks to make a "road rage" incident. If one of them refuses to play, there is no road rage incident. When confronted by a "road rager" or aggressive driver i refuse to play their silly game.

    Make sure that your piece is available instantly, if needed; do not look at the scumbag, slow down and do not pull up beside the idiot at a light. Get the license number of the idiots car, let him go and call the police. Here many of these "raging" drivers are on meth and are totally unpredictable. Be aware that your refusal to play "road rage" may result in an assault anyway. Be prepared!!!!

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