Reponsibilities of a CHP holder.... - Page 3

Reponsibilities of a CHP holder....

This is a discussion on Reponsibilities of a CHP holder.... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; We live in a society where anything can happen, a person can be ciminally prosecuted for standing by and doing nothing. Always use good judgement, ...

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Thread: Reponsibilities of a CHP holder....

  1. #31
    Member Array Detroittwister's Avatar
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    Jun 2007
    Taylor, MI
    We live in a society where anything can happen, a person can be ciminally prosecuted for standing by and doing nothing. Always use good judgement, be prepared, stay calm and the law will be on your side.
    ** NRA Life Member***

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  2. #32
    Member Array sethmark's Avatar
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    Apr 2007
    Richmond VA
    Excellent points. Thanks to all for the conversation. VA lacks both a Castle Doctrine and a Duty to Retreat law.... so any action isn't protected a priori. But I've started a process of thinking about my response in a crisis when I'm not directly involved, which was the point of this excercise.

    I'm a firm believer in mental excercise. I have competed professionally in motorsports and have often found that speed and success comes from 'mental runthroughs'... the process of thinking about a desired reaction, so that when the time comes, the brain has already been trained to act.

    I agree wholeheartedly that discourse is no substitute for hands on training, which I've been persuing for a while. However it is important to me to be educated as well.


  3. #33
    Member Array dls56's Avatar
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    Apr 2007
    You pose questions that many of us entertain due to the fact that we've opted to arm ourselves. I try not to analyze scenario's to death but rely on common sense to guide my way.
    With this said I've been meaning to contact a lawyer acquaintance and talk to him about the possible need for his services and his availability for same.
    Having been in law enforcement it's advisable to limit conversations without a lawyer present. Words can be taken out of context and emotions, adrenaline don't promote sensible and measured speak.

  4. #34
    Senior Member Array PaulG's Avatar
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    Jun 2006
    Fairfax, VA
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post

    we need decent folk to step up and act positively.

    Whatever happens, do the right thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by P95Carry View Post
    "Play it as you see it".
    Quote Originally Posted by Protect View Post
    and I read a story like Lima's and wonder if I could live with myself for NOT doing anything.
    Quote Originally Posted by LBrombach View Post
    Hopefully I'll call it right, but I can only promise to do my best.
    Great thread! I've said before that these situations boil down to good people in bad situations doing the best they can.

    I have never been nor will ever be in the "me and mine" camp but we all have to face reality. I will not pull a Rambo but will assess the situation before acting.

    I know there is a very short time window but you cannot act until you have formed a reasonable (not necessarily correct) opinion of the situation and that may mean that innocent people die before you act.

    I hope none of us ever find ourselves in such a situation but my plan is to train for the worst and hope for the best.

    Good luck and stay safe out there.
    fortiter in re, suaviter in modo (resolutely in action, gently in manner).

  5. #35
    Member Array Detroittwister's Avatar
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    Jun 2007
    Taylor, MI
    Very well put PaulG.
    ** NRA Life Member***

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    Kel-Tec .380

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  6. #36
    Member Array Flippinstk's Avatar
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    Jan 2007
    Virginia Beach, Va


    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    First, things aren't always as they appear. Cases of mistaken identity shootings abound.

    That said, it is sometimes best to standby and become a good witness in what happened. (sometimes!)

    Also, bear in mind, you are not a LEO with a "Duty to Act!" Second, if you are a LEO, but off duty, you are still basically an armed citizen at that point in the fact that you do not have all your on duty LEO resources at hand. No two way radio, possibly no handcuffs, OC spray, expandable baton, etc. (maybe you do have all that) The point is, often times a lone armed citizen is not adequately prepared to deal with an armed stand off situation and all the dynamics that is part of that. (I also said, "often times") That doesn't mean you can't solve the problem, just be aware of all the pitfalls before you decide to be proactive.

    Rob72 also has a point, you do have to live with yourself regardless of what you do.

    Now, you have to bear in mind, if you insert yourself into the mix and things go bad... you may end up sharing a seat at the defendants table in court. That is a distinct possibility! It does happen.

    Regarding an armed robbery situation. I have seen hundreds of surveillance video in which armed robbers held a gun to the victims head and never fired a shot after getting their money! I have also seen, to a much, much lesser degree when the armed robber went ahead and executed the victim AFTER getting the money.

    If an armed robber is holding someone at gunpoint and you go up and shoot the armed robber in an attempt to keep them from shooting an innocent person, your actions may in fact cause the robber to shoot the victim. Unless you destroy the brainstem with your shot, even if you kill the robber, his reflex could make him pull the trigger.

    For the most part, I have played out a lot of scenario's in my head in advance and in a situation like an armed robbery, I will not start shooting unless the bad guy shoots someone or I know it is going bad fast. More than likely I will standby and become a good witness to the crime and report as much as possible to LEO when they arrive.

    Armed robberies happen a thousand times a day across the U. S. without people getting killed.

    Still, the best advice is... You have to act on an individual case by case basis as things play out before you!

    Having as much training as possible allows you much more options in any of these cases.

    Will I say that I won't act and end up shooting first? Absolutely NOT! The case may come where I do intervene and take a shot before any others are fired. But I am more prepared to standby and respond to what the BG actions dictate.

    There are no good answers to the question you asked as it is often a Moral Decision to be made as opposed to a Legal Decision to be made.

    Remember, your main goal is for "you" to survive and go home to your family!

    You family will suffer greatly if not totally unable to recover if you are 6 feet in the ground or spending a big portion of your life in the penitentary for manslaughter or murder.

    Search around the forum... there have been many posts regarding your question and post. TONS of Great information and opinions have been shed on these pages on this very topic!

    Good luck, stay safe, stay armed!

    There are all great inputs but Bark'n could not have said it better!
    Bark'n, my hat is off to you and I respect your outlook.
    Alex G.
    S&W M&P .45
    Virginia Beach, Va.
    Senior Chief Petty Officer, RETIRED, USN
    Certified NRA Pistol Instructor
    NRA Range Officer

  7. #37
    Member Array ttpete's Avatar
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    May 2006
    I feel that the question has a lot to do with one's own values and the regard he has for his fellow man. I think that those who prey upon others are purely evil, and have given up all of the rights they were born with. I'd have a hard time standing by, watching someone being injured or killed, especially if I had the means to stop it.

    As was said before, one has to look in the mirror the day after, and try to justify what they did or didn't do in a situation.
    NRA Benefactor member
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    Opinions expressed here are based upon Michigan state law ONLY. Other state laws may differ. Know and observe your local laws.

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