how often are you practicing drawing from a concealed holster? - Page 3

how often are you practicing drawing from a concealed holster?

This is a discussion on how often are you practicing drawing from a concealed holster? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Every time I go to the bathroom. No really. I aiwb and find it easier to just pull the gun out if the holster than ...

Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 86
Like Tree98Likes

Thread: how often are you practicing drawing from a concealed holster?

  1. #31
    Member Array jlamay's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    76
    Every time I go to the bathroom. No really. I aiwb and find it easier to just pull the gun out if the holster than to remove the whole rig (remora with a ulticlip)
    At work I just shut the bathroom door, if I'm out at a restaurant or movie, I just go in a stall.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  2. #32
    Member Array Militant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    218
    Not enough but I will now. Thanks!
    HK P30 HK P30sk HK VP9 HK VP9sk
    HK45c HKUSP9c
    HKUSP45c Stainless
    HKUSP40c Stainless

  3. #33
    Distinguished Member Array royal barnes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Wendell, N.C.
    Posts
    1,301
    Quote Originally Posted by Holmes375 View Post
    I don't practice drawing from concealment simply to become faster, per se. I'm probably as fast as I'm ever going to be. My goal is to maintain an ingrained auto-response that sees my weapon put into play without fumbling. It promotes confidence and efficacy that I'll need in a highly stressful and dynamic scenario. This is good for me and those around me... except for the bad guy, of course.
    The old saying is still true,"slow is smooth, smooth is fast".
    OD* likes this.

  4. Remove Advertisements
    DefensiveCarry.com
    Advertisements
     

  5. #34
    Sponsor
    Array AzQkr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    In the Superstitions
    Posts
    13,532
    Quote Originally Posted by royal barnes View Post
    The old saying is still true,"slow is smooth, smooth is fast".
    I've always been under an assumption that slow is slow, whether it's done smoothly or not. IMO, someone who was slow came up with that jingle/quip.

    Nothing smooth about this draw stroke, but I'd sure like to see someone be smooth and beat this guys draw [ which entails some rather jerky twitch muscles to get to the level of speed he had ].

    Okeechobee likes this.
    The mind is the limiting factor

    https://www.youtube.com/user/azqkr

    Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor

  6. #35
    Member Array bsms2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    138
    Rarely. I don't live to carry concealed. I accept that I don't have blinding speed. If the other guy is armed and we start trading shots, even putting a bullet in his heart in 0.25 seconds would leave him another 10-15 seconds to shoot me - if he is determined. Longer if I don't hit anything major. Takes a while for an animal to bleed out. Of course, if I think we are in a situation where he is going to kill me anyways, then I'M DETERMINED - and I WILL live long enough to empty MY gun into the bad guy, even if it takes me 3-4 seconds to get off the first shot.

    Besides, what do I practice drawing? My NAA 22? My Pico? My J-frames? My 686? My Beretta 92? With a coat? Suit? Denim vest? Cotton shirt? OWB hip? IWB just behind the hip? Crossdraw? From my front pants pocket? Inside my denim vest pocket?

    I test a new holster and position. I also sometimes try a half-dozen draws after unloading the gun & before putting it away. But then, it has been a few decades since I last fired 10,000 rounds in a year. I don't shoot 1,000 rounds a year now. All of which is heresy...

    FWIW, if I was on a jury, and some guy was accused of shooting unnecessarily: If the prosecution could show from his Internet posting that he spent 20+ minutes a day practicing his fast draw, I would weigh that AGAINST the guy. It strikes me as paranoia and suggests he might well have imagined a threat that wasn't there. I would consider that informative of his state of mind.
    Nmuskier and glockman10mm like this.

  7. #36
    Sponsor
    Array AzQkr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    In the Superstitions
    Posts
    13,532
    Quote Originally Posted by bsms2 View Post
    Rarely. I don't live to carry concealed. I accept that I don't have blinding speed. If the other guy is armed and we start trading shots, even putting a bullet in his heart in 0.25 seconds would leave him another 10-15 seconds to shoot me - if he is determined. Longer if I don't hit anything major. Takes a while for an animal to bleed out. Of course, if I think we are in a situation where he is going to kill me anyways, then I'M DETERMINED - and I WILL live long enough to empty MY gun into the bad guy, even if it takes me 3-4 seconds to get off the first shot.

    Besides, what do I practice drawing? My NAA 22? My Pico? My J-frames? My 686? My Beretta 92? With a coat? Suit? Denim vest? Cotton shirt? OWB hip? IWB just behind the hip? Crossdraw? From my front pants pocket? Inside my denim vest pocket?

    I test a new holster and position. I also sometimes try a half-dozen draws after unloading the gun & before putting it away. But then, it has been a few decades since I last fired 10,000 rounds in a year. I don't shoot 1,000 rounds a year now. All of which is heresy...

    FWIW, if I was on a jury, and some guy was accused of shooting unnecessarily: If the prosecution could show from his Internet posting that he spent 20+ minutes a day practicing his fast draw, I would weigh that AGAINST the guy. It strikes me as paranoia and suggests he might well have imagined a threat that wasn't there. I would consider that informative of his state of mind.
    A defense atty would object to it on the basis of that information not having any relevance in determining whether the use of deadly force was justified by the defendant.

    Looking at from your perspective, EVERY gamer who's shot matches would be accused of their state of mind of practicing their speed of presentation and hits under stress. Your mentality, nor the DA's would fly in a court room .

    That you're a weapons owner and carry one for sd purposes, it's hard to imagine someone like you writing what you'd consider practicing ones skills as a wrong state of mind against another gun carrier, when the crux of the case hinges on whether the actions of the defendant were justified by law or not. That's the ONLY factors a jury should be concerned about. I'm quite disappointed in your response you'd question another gun owner/carrier actions based on a practice regimen instead of the merits of the case alone.

    It's quite disconcerting to read your mindset, which is far more errant and off base than the mindset of practicing to become more instead of less proficient in one of the elements necessary to defend oneself [ that of accessing the firearm ]. Accusations not based on facts, or germane to the case are irrelevant and thus hold NO weight where culpability is being determined.

    Your expressed mentality is very scary indeed to all who train/practice/carry with sd in mind. In about an hour I've got a former USArmy ranger coming over for 1-2hours of h2h/knife. I'm just going to have to beat the hell out of him this morning to take the frustration created by your mindset away so I can enjoy the rest of my day unencumbered by the foul taste of your own mentality that would hold something irrelevant to determining culpability as a negative against the defendant.

    To even suggest what you have is admitting as a juror you would not be considering the supporting evidence objectively and come to the jury with personal jaded preconceptions. If you can't be impartial, excuse yourself from the jury pool. You'd be doing no one [ the defendant, the other jurors, nor the courts ] any favors entering a jury with personal baggage that you've stated would alter your perception of the facts.

    You're entitled to your personal opinions, but those get left at the door to the courtroom, and one has to set aside personal feelings and determine culpability SOLELY on the facts of the case. You've admitted you couldn't keep your own biased opinions out of the determination of guilt or not.

    Very discouraging and what's more, quite disturbing to think a fellow gun carrier would interject their own prejudice that may affect anothers freedom. If I were on the jury and you made the mistake of stating the same to the jurors deliberating, I'd file a complaint with the judge to have you removed for bias, that you agreed you didn't have when asked question in the jury pool. I might go so far as to seek to have you charged yourself for denying your prejudice during jury pool selection that now has been brought to the fore by your own statements. What I'd not do is let you taint the jury with anything other than facts that demonstrate the defendant was within the states guidelines for deadly force use or not.

    Your "opinions" mean diddly, only the facts germane to the case should determine culpability. You're a gun owners worst nightmare IMO.
    Last edited by AzQkr; March 18th, 2017 at 04:27 PM.
    OD*, molleur, PhaedrusIV and 1 others like this.
    The mind is the limiting factor

    https://www.youtube.com/user/azqkr

    Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor

  8. #37
    VIP Member
    Array molleur's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    palm bay, florida
    Posts
    3,584
    Quote Originally Posted by bsms2 View Post
    Rarely. I don't live to carry concealed. I accept that I don't have blinding speed. If the other guy is armed and we start trading shots, even putting a bullet in his heart in 0.25 seconds would leave him another 10-15 seconds to shoot me - if he is determined. Longer if I don't hit anything major. Takes a while for an animal to bleed out. Of course, if I think we are in a situation where he is going to kill me anyways, then I'M DETERMINED - and I WILL live long enough to empty MY gun into the bad guy, even if it takes me 3-4 seconds to get off the first shot.

    Besides, what do I practice drawing? My NAA 22? My Pico? My J-frames? My 686? My Beretta 92? With a coat? Suit? Denim vest? Cotton shirt? OWB hip? IWB just behind the hip? Crossdraw? From my front pants pocket? Inside my denim vest pocket?

    I test a new holster and position. I also sometimes try a half-dozen draws after unloading the gun & before putting it away. But then, it has been a few decades since I last fired 10,000 rounds in a year. I don't shoot 1,000 rounds a year now. All of which is heresy...

    FWIW, if I was on a jury, and some guy was accused of shooting unnecessarily: If the prosecution could show from his Internet posting that he spent 20+ minutes a day practicing his fast draw, I would weigh that AGAINST the guy. It strikes me as paranoia and suggests he might well have imagined a threat that wasn't there. I would consider that informative of his state of mind.
    Wow, just, wow! I could not come close to echoing Brownie's answer without some XXX adjectives added to it!
    AzQkr, PhaedrusIV and OD* like this.
    "Don't shout for help at night, you may wake your neighbors"

  9. #38
    Member Array bsms2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    138
    Quote Originally Posted by AzQkr View Post
    A defense atty would object to it on the basis of that information not having any relevance in determining whether the use of deadly force was justified by the defendant.

    Looking at from your perspective, EVERY gamer who's shot matches would be accused of their state of mind of practicing their speed of presentation and hits under stress. Your mentality, nor the DA's would fly in a court room .

    ...To even suggest what you have is admitting as a juror you would not be considering the supporting evidence objectively and come to the jury with personal jaded preconceptions. If you can't be impartial, excuse yourself from the jury pool...You're a gun owners worst nightmare IMO.
    If part of the question before the jury is if the person responded correctly to a threat, and there is genuine question about if that threat existed, then the defendant's state of mind becomes germane. Think of the Zimmerman trial - why did Zimmerman do what he did, and were his actions provocative and was he truly in danger? Was he truly DEFENDING or did he over-react? Those were questions up for review.

    There is a difference between someone playing a GAME (competitive shooting stuff) and someone who act paranoid. Someone who can't leave the house without carrying multiple guns, a knife, tactical flashlight, 100 rounds of ammo, etc is paranoid. Or they are living in a war zone. And most of America doesn't qualify as a war zone.

    "You've admitted you couldn't keep your own biased opinions out of the determination of guilt or not."

    I've done no such thing. But there isn't always scientific, reproducable data that would show if someone was genuinely threatened or not. In the absence of a surveillance camera or good witnesses, it becomes one person's word against another's - and that second person may be dead. Someone who spends most of his free time training to become Lethal Weapon 23 ought to consider how much confidence a jury will have in his word if he claims he shot an unarmed person in self-defense.

    People on the Internet wet themselves worrying if having handloaded ammo will get them in trouble. Personally...I doubt it. But someone who trains way beyond what can be justified by the threat level may well look like an overanxious wannabe with something to prove.

    You don't have to like it. But you won't be judged by a jury of 12 people with intensive training who have spent uncounted thousands perfecting their combat skills. You'll be judged by people who, if they know any concealed carry folks, will likely know concealed carry folks who go to the range 6 times a year and who carry a compact gun with, at most, one reload. I've been in the jury pool for a shooting case. The defense removed me from the pool because I was a member of GOA - and they found THAT too scary! The woman next to me DID make the cut. She had proudly announced she got all her news from the New York Times online and CNN. THAT is the reality of a jury.

  10. #39
    VIP Member Array PhaedrusIV's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    3,626
    OD* likes this.
    - testing was halted after a brief kinetic episode -

  11. #40
    Member Array Holmes375's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Wyoming - corner of No & Where
    Posts
    218
    Disregard.
    Last edited by Holmes375; March 19th, 2017 at 02:27 AM.

  12. #41
    Sponsor
    Array AzQkr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    In the Superstitions
    Posts
    13,532
    Quote Originally Posted by bsms2 View Post
    If part of the question before the jury is if the person responded correctly to a threat, and there is genuine question about if that threat existed, then the defendant's state of mind becomes germane. Think of the Zimmerman trial - why did Zimmerman do what he did, and were his actions provocative and was he truly in danger? Was he truly DEFENDING or did he over-react? Those were questions up for review.

    A jury of his peers voted he didn't over react. The question's been asked and settled.

    There is a difference between someone playing a GAME (competitive shooting stuff) and someone who act paranoid. Someone who can't leave the house without carrying multiple guns, a knife, tactical flashlight, 100 rounds of ammo, etc is paranoid. Or they are living in a war zone. And most of America doesn't qualify as a war zone.

    Better check multi multiple threads here on the subject. There's numerous people who carry a primary, a bug, a folder, along with a flashlight as their edc gear. It would appear, that in your not so humble opinion, that anyone who carries more gear than you or practices more than you is a paranoid gun nut. Like I mentioned, you're a gun owner/carriers worst nightmare.

    "You've admitted you couldn't keep your own biased opinions out of the determination of guilt or not."

    I've done no such thing. But there isn't always scientific, reproducable data that would show if someone was genuinely threatened or not.

    And as a juror, that's ALL you're concerned about determining. You don't have the right to sit in judgement of anothers choices of the tools they carry or why they carry them. The case hinges on the merits of the case, not how many rounds a week they practice, how many times they practiced their draw stroke, etc.

    In the absence of a surveillance camera or good witnesses, it becomes one person's word against another's - and that second person may be dead.

    My, how little you know. There's ALWAYS forensic evidence that supports or refutes the defendants statements. It's never just a he said/she said with one of them deceased.

    Someone who spends most of his free time training to become Lethal Weapon 23 ought to consider how much confidence a jury will have in his word if he claims he shot an unarmed person in self-defense.

    Now you've expanded the carriers training regiment from 20 minutes of dry fire/draw practice a day to "all their free time" training to be LW23. Changing the goal posts will get you nowhere.

    People on the Internet wet themselves worrying if having handloaded ammo will get them in trouble. Personally...I doubt it. But someone who trains way beyond what can be justified by the threat level may well look like an overanxious wannabe with something to prove.

    You don't have to like it. But you won't be judged by a jury of 12 people with intensive training who have spent uncounted thousands perfecting their combat skills. You'll be judged by people who, if they know any concealed carry folks, will likely know concealed carry folks who go to the range 6 times a year and who carry a compact gun with, at most, one reload.

    I better be judged ONLY on the merits of the case, with jurors who don't bring preconceived notions of what a ccw/'er frequency/number of trips to the range should be, or how many times they should practice a draw stroke, or any other previous bias.

    I've been in the jury pool for a shooting case. The defense removed me from the pool because I was a member of GOA - and they found THAT too scary!

    That defendant got real lucky your biased self didn't get picked

    The woman next to me DID make the cut. She had proudly announced she got all her news from the New York Times online and CNN. THAT is the reality of a jury.

    Last I checked, one's reading and viewing choices aren't disqualifiers. And having worked in the court system for near 3 decades testifying to evidence gathered during the investigation, I can tell you without hesitation, the jury can be made up of all manner of people. How those people will make decisions will be based on how well facts are presented in the case, not by what they watch or listen to.


    Like I said, you're a gun owners worst nightmare. Your preconceived notion of what makes an acceptable ccw'er presentable to the court/jury of their peers would be laughable if it weren't so serious a subject. And just for the record, there's NO difference between someone who practices their draw stroke at the range under the color of competition and one who practices the same skills at home.

    I don't live to carry concealed. I accept that I don't have blinding speed. If the other guy is armed and we start trading shots, even putting a bullet in his heart in 0.25 seconds would leave him another 10-15 seconds to shoot me - if he is determined. Longer if I don't hit anything major. Takes a while for an animal to bleed out. Of course, if I think we are in a situation where he is going to kill me anyways, then I'M DETERMINED - and I WILL live long enough to empty MY gun into the bad guy, even if it takes me 3-4 seconds to get off the first shot.

    Besides, what do I practice drawing? My NAA 22? My Pico? My J-frames? My 686? My Beretta 92? With a coat? Suit? Denim vest? Cotton shirt? OWB hip? IWB just behind the hip? Crossdraw? From my front pants pocket? Inside my denim vest pocket?

    I test a new holster and position. I also sometimes try a half-dozen draws after unloading the gun & before putting it away.


    You are a downright scary dude. I fear people like you shooting on the range more than the criminals on the streets. You've called hundreds of members mentality into question here, simply because they choose to carry more gear than you, practice more than you. I'd expect it from a lib, but not a gun owner/carrier. But then again, I should expect just that, as I know there's lots of libs who own guns who believe all manner of bias as facts.

    One last question for now,
    If 20 minutes of dry fire practice qualifies as a "nut" waiting to shoot someone, what's your cut off number where they fall from gun nut to prudent carrier.

    This guy is 79 yrs old and makes hundreds of draw strokes at a time practicing. Is it your contention a jury would find he was practicing his self defense draws in hopes he would find someone to shoot?

    Shooting practice
    PhaedrusIV and OD* like this.
    The mind is the limiting factor

    https://www.youtube.com/user/azqkr

    Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor

  13. #42
    Distinguished Member Array royal barnes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Wendell, N.C.
    Posts
    1,301
    Quote Originally Posted by AzQkr View Post
    I've always been under an assumption that slow is slow, whether it's done smoothly or not. IMO, someone who was slow came up with that jingle/quip.

    Nothing smooth about this draw stroke, but I'd sure like to see someone be smooth and beat this guys draw [ which entails some rather jerky twitch muscles to get to the level of speed he had ].

    Your opinion on the phrase and on Munden. No more valid than mine.

  14. #43
    Sponsor
    Array AzQkr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    In the Superstitions
    Posts
    13,532
    Quote Originally Posted by royal barnes View Post
    Your opinion on the phrase and on Munden. No more valid than mine.
    Perhaps, but there's no denying Munden's draw stroke isn't smooth, just the opposite, rather violent. And it's also a fact that he had one of the fastest draw strokes to have ever been recorded.

    Based on what we can observe, real speed isn't smooth, it's violent. The old saying apparently isn't true, not when watching those who are the fastest.
    PhaedrusIV and BuckJM53 like this.
    The mind is the limiting factor

    https://www.youtube.com/user/azqkr

    Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor

  15. #44
    VIP Member Array PhaedrusIV's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Posts
    3,626
    Opinion based on logic and known facts - how silly is that ?
    AzQkr likes this.
    - testing was halted after a brief kinetic episode -

  16. #45
    Senior Member Array BuckJM53's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    SW Ohio
    Posts
    713
    Quote Originally Posted by nick060200 View Post
    maybe not as much as you should? Ive made it a new years resolution to do it everyday for 5 mins. I pick an object and draw on it and dry fire on the object. It helps with muscle memory.
    Generally twice per week at home using my iTargetPro laser trainer (at least 15 minutes per session) and twice per week live fire at the range as a part of my usual routine.
    AzQkr likes this.
    I was taught to respect my elders! The problem is, I'm having a much harder time finding them these days .

Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 LastLast

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •