A false sense of security

This is a discussion on A false sense of security within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Before I begin my story, let me say this... This post is not a story about anything done illegal, or do I intend on the ...

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Thread: A false sense of security

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    A false sense of security

    Before I begin my story, let me say this... This post is not a story about anything done illegal, or do I intend on the thread to turn into a "how to" do anything illegal. If it does, I hope the mods shut it down and delete it in a hurry.

    I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but its just a personal experience about "secure areas"

    I have a job that requires that I carry everywhere. I carry places that most cannot, including airports and aircraft, schools, courthouses... you name it.
    Sometimes, in the course of my duties, me and my partners go into these secure areas to work. Our "mission" requires that nobody knows who we are or that we are there. This includes the security personnel of the location, and sometimes even the local LEO's.
    In those cases, we cannot be snuck in the back door; we have to use the front door with the general public.

    This summer, we had something going on at a very popular public place. This place is so large that it has its own police dept., in addition to security. Although most of their guys and gals are new to police work, they do pretty decent job. They have metal detectors and the whole nine yards for their guests’ safety.

    Well, here we come. We needed in the front gates with our tools and pass as regular guests. So we buy our tickets and head to the security line. I was getting worried about the tactics taught to me on how to do this sort of thing, as I watched people empty pockets of keys, lighters, phones and all those small items that set off the metal detectors. Those who set off the detectors got checked again with the wand. Oh boy, I'm next in line and the first in our group.

    Sparing the details of how to, I walked right in. No problems. I did not fool the machine though...

    So my thoughts are what I already knew... these secure areas mean nothing. If my thick skulled self can pull it off, so can a BG. And this particular place does do a good job of checking people for weapons, unlike most places.
    I very badly want to go to them and show them that I can waltz right through their multi million dollar security with whatever I want, but I cant. I also know that it would backfire on me too.

    Anyway, I thought my story might spark some interesting conversation here. So go ahead... converse.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    Hmmmm.

    BTDT. Not going to help anyone else.

    Not sure what sort of conversation we'll have other than a bunch of people chiming in that they have done the same, intentionally or not.
    Procrastinators are the leaders of tomorrow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott View Post
    Hmmmm.

    BTDT. Not going to help anyone else.

    Not sure what sort of conversation we'll have other than a bunch of people chiming in that they have done the same, intentionally or not.
    Well Scott, that depends on how you look at it. I really dont want to hear about the other members illegal activity, thats why I typed out the first paragraph. I was hoping that the intelligent members here would see and get something out of it. It was a learning experiance for me, and honestly it shocked me that it could be done like it was.
    Like I said, I know I'm preaching to the choir but its a real world experiance that I think others can learn from. (and I got a plan for the thread too )
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    So you walked right by the machine (not through it) and nobody said anything?

    If anything you probably would have made the people in line behind you angry enough to say something!

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    Quote Originally Posted by credy View Post
    So you walked right by the machine (not through it) and nobody said anything?

    If anything you probably would have made the people in line behind you angry enough to say something!
    Nope. Walked right through the machine like everyone else....twice. I'm not going to go into details, but nobody would be the wiser watching us do this. The point is not how we did it, but that it was done. If we can, so can a BG.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    Security measures are made to be broken...and there's quite an industry that does just that.

    No matter how secure an areas seems to be, the right person will eventually find a way to get in.

    Thats the way it has always been and thats the way it will always be. This can be seen in the Military and their state of the art weapons and technology. Today the new stuff reigns supreme, tomorrow its just another weapon or technology that somebody with the right countermeasures can defeat.

    Personally, I think that machines for the most part do a great job, but there is nothing that can replace a good set of eyes, an alert mindset and some intuition that something just isnt right.
    tbrenke likes this.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    Profiling though it has been given a lousy name, tends to be correct. If it walks like a duck...
    Correct me if I am wrong, you do not look like someone who would be out of place in this large area/gathering? And the explaination as to why the metal detector went off was not too far out of the realm of possibility?

    The fellow who sold the tickets to the 911 perps said in an interview that he had the awful feeling that they were terrorists just by their demeanor and attitude.

    At one of the national political conventions there were badges to get in, well one of the reporters used a different card and still got a green light. Some secuity is bluff, some is the real deal, hopefully the BG can't tell the difference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GBS View Post
    Profiling though it has been given a lousy name, tends to be correct. If it walks like a duck...
    Correct me if I am wrong, you do not look like someone who would be out of place in this large area/gathering? And the explaination as to why the metal detector went off was not too far out of the realm of possibility?

    The fellow who sold the tickets to the 911 perps said in an interview that he had the awful feeling that they were terrorists just by their demeanor and attitude.

    At one of the national political conventions there were badges to get in, well one of the reporters used a different card and still got a green light. Some secuity is bluff, some is the real deal, hopefully the BG can't tell the difference.

    Since I no longer drive around in a police car, its my job to fit in. So yes, we looked like we belonged. I have longish hair now, and a generally unkept look about me. I hate it, but I'm getting used to it.I was wearing shorts and a tshirt, just like everyone else.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    Quote Originally Posted by GBS View Post
    Profiling though it has been given a lousy name, tends to be correct. If it walks like a duck...
    Agree. I'm sure most everyone has heard the story about the security guy for El Al, the Israeli airline that said the reason they were more successful in avoiding terrorist activity on their airplanes was because they look for "terrorists", as opposed to the U.S. method of looking for weapons.

    Profiling does work. It just doesn't fit in with our Constitution's concept of a free society.
    "Society never advances. It recedes as fast on one side as it gains on the other. It undergoes continual change; but this change is not [an improvement]. For everything that is given, something is taken."
    Ralph Waldo Emerson

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    You might try to "fit in"...
    but I'll bet you dont SMELL like some of those longhairs...
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    I learned that looking like everyone else and acting like you belong will get you in most places.

    I am a big fan of classical music, opera and the fine arts. In grad school I could not afford to attend most of these high society functions. (Hypothetical only would not cordon breaking laws) I found that I could clean myself up and just walk into a concert or opera observe unused seats and enjoy myself.

    I have boarded airplanes with tools that should have been seized in my laptop case. But one look at me and you know that the laptop, tools and me belong together, the trick is looking like you belong.
    “You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic.”

    ― Robert A. Heinlein,

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    Profiling does work. It just doesn't fit in with our Constitution's concept of a free society.
    Sure it does. Due to the proliferation of bliss ninnys in government you just cant call it that anymore...
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    You might try to "fit in"...
    but I'll bet you dont SMELL like some of those longhairs...
    True. I gave up haircuts for the time being, but I refuse to give up showers and clean clothes.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    My first thought was of the "security" at Jaguars games. Everyone is hand searched -- no metal detectors. They did bring them in for the Super Bowl.

    The security folks do not touch below the waist. They barely brush around the waist and check inside your hat. I have never heard of or seen anyone searched more thoroughly. For the most part, they seem to think their job is to get the crowd into the stadium as fast as possible.

    A couple of years ago someone sued the Tampa Bay Bucs. I don't remember the details but he claimed some right was being violated when he was searched. I haven't heard what became of it.

    For those not familiar with FL law, your CWP does not allow carrying at a professional athletic event (there is an exception if the event is firearms related). This "security" does allow folks to "carry" adult beverages into the stadium.

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    Interesting intellectual exercise, but what do we really take away from this anecdote? Some have already made these and other observations and stated them better, but here are a few of my thoughts:

    1. Security is never absolute.

    2. The BGs "tools" are not the threat; he is.

    3. You are responsible for your own safety.

    4. Situational awareness is your most powerful tool. Be a student of human behavior. No one is a sphinx--everyone exhibits cues to their real thoughts; some just make it more difficult for you to discern them.

    5. When you recognize a threat, take appropriate action: distance yourself from it, report it to those whose job it is to respond and if necessary defend yourself (and others) from it.
    Last edited by Texian; November 2nd, 2007 at 11:49 AM. Reason: spelling
    "The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him." G.K. Chesterton

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