Just wondering

This is a discussion on Just wondering within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; i was reading the constitution the other night(i was bored and actualy looked at the SMA recomended reading list) and came across something interesting. "Article. ...

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Thread: Just wondering

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array bobcat35's Avatar
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    Just wondering

    i was reading the constitution the other night(i was bored and actualy looked at the SMA recomended reading list) and came across something interesting.
    "Article. IV. - The States
    Section 1 - Each State to Honor all others

    Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State. And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts, Records and Proceedings shall be proved, and the Effect thereof."

    does this actualy provide recipricocity or am i mis reading this?
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    Senior Member Array Ragin Cajun's Avatar
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    I think you are mis reading it.

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    Senior Member Array AirForceShooter's Avatar
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    no . he's not misreading it.
    It's just ignored when it comes to CCW's.
    After Heller it might be ripe for challenge.

    AFS
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    Member Array aquanomics's Avatar
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    Exactly!

    Quote Originally Posted by AirForceShooter View Post
    no . he's not misreading it.
    It's just ignored when it comes to CCW's.
    After Heller it might be ripe for challenge.

    AFS
    Full faith and credit is one of the reasons (some) people fear states that legalize gay marriage, i.e., the Constitution would require all states to honor those marriages.

    But not/never for CCW, the buggers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AirForceShooter View Post
    no . he's not misreading it.
    It's just ignored when it comes to CCW's.
    After Heller it might be ripe for challenge.

    AFS
    Just like the 2nd amendment is ignored or bastardized by the legislators and the liberal leftist anti sheeple.

    This looks like another good place to mention the "Second Amendment Primer" by Les Adams. A must read and a highly valuable reference for the pro2A fight.

    It can be found HERE

    I don't claim to be an expert in legalese, but it seems to me that this article/section provides for the recognition of marriages (among other things) from state to state. IE... a legal marriage in Maryland is recognized in Ohio regardless to whether the marriage could have been legally performed in Ohio due to, lets say, age or familial proximity.
    Last edited by luvmy40; December 27th, 2007 at 12:53 PM. Reason: typo, added emoticon
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    Senior Member Array rljohns's Avatar
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    You have an interesting point. Seems like driver's licenses are recognized in all 50 states. I know some states don't report violations to other states and all the legalese between states can be weird.

    Maybe some one needs to try the state laws out. Take your CCW permit and go to NJ and get caught then go all the way to SCOUS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rljohns View Post
    Maybe some one needs to try the state laws out. Take your CCW permit and go to NJ and get caught then go all the way to SCOUS.
    I'm game if you want to cover the legal bills!
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    You all are trying to read too much into the clause. Full faith and credit means that states have to recognize things like marriage and drivers licenses. But, in something that is highly regulated or outright illegal it doesn't apply. A CCW would be more in line with a lawyer being forced to be admitted to the bar of each state before he is able to practice. It is tightly regulated and therefore doesn't apply across the several states.
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    A driver license, yes. All other licenses, most likely a big no.
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    Distinguished Member Array kazzaerexys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rljohns View Post
    You have an interesting point. Seems like driver's licenses are recognized in all 50 states. I know some states don't report violations to other states and all the legalese between states can be weird.
    Drivers' licenses are recognized everywhere because that recognition is tied to federal highway funding, and I suppose is also reinforced by the interstate commerce clause. (Hard to do interstate shipping if your driver's license stops at the border.)

    The full faith and credit clause seems not to apply to marriages. There was a big story recently in one of the big papers about a lesbian couple who got married in Mass., but live in...I think, Oregon. They want a divorce. Oregon won't let them divorce because they don't really recognize the marriage. Mass won't divorce them because they don't live there. Amusing Catch-22 ensues...

    As for CCW, the only way you'll see enforced reciprocity is if it becomes an interstate commerce issue or if there is federal funding involved---neither is likely to come up anytime soon. Keep in mind that the founders intended for the federal gov't to be limited and for primacy of law making to rest with the several states, so there is no historical precedent for any sort of forced acknowledgment of national standards (again, outside of any interstate commerce applications).

    The best federal intervention here would be to use the interstate commerce clause to knock down state-specific manufacturing requirements. ("I'm sorry, CA, no micro-stamping for you as it would unduly burden interstate gun sales.") I don't see that happening anytime soon, either...

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    Member Array Puppy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvmy40 View Post
    J

    IE... a legal marriage in Maryland is recognized in Ohio regardless to whether the marriage could have been legally performed in Ohio due to, lets say, age or familial proximity.
    An interesting point. Now suppose Ohio doesn't recognize gay marriage but Maryland does. The happy couple moves to Ohio. Ohio has to acknowledge the marriage. Now! What does that mean? If there are certain State benefits that accrue to such a marriage, is Ohio obligated to provide them, even though they wouldn't do that for the same couple if they originated in that state? Or do they just say, Okay your married. We can't do anything to stop you but we sure don't have to provide you with any benefits either.

    Just curious.

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    Member Array Puppy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rljohns View Post
    You have an interesting point. Seems like driver's licenses are recognized in all 50 states. I know some states don't report violations to other states and all the legalese between states can be weird.

    Maybe some one needs to try the state laws out. Take your CCW permit and go to NJ and get caught then go all the way to SCOUS.
    Okay, I'll do it if you pay the legal fees!


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