No-gos in Florida

[Agave]

I'm planning a spring break to Florida and need some translation and insight to current practices.

any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which
portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;

What is this saying? Is it saying that the bar portion of a restaurant is off-limits? Or is the entire establishment off-limits?

I'd appreciate some feedback from Florida residents and travelers that can tell how you practice observation of this.

Gracias.

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[spensergig]

I know I've seen this discussed many times here.

You can't sit in the bar area.
You CAN sit in the restaurant area.
If the establishment is primarily a bar, stay out.

[tns0038]

To get around Florida anti smoking law, some restaurants, have a separate bar area that is not connected to the restaurant. That bar would be off limits for CCL, but not the rest of the restaurant.

We just stayed 10 days in the Keys over Christmas and New Years. And the best I can tell, the only place you can not CCL would be the very few bars that don’t serve food. You can tell those because they allow smoking indoors.

Even Sloppy Joes and Hogs Breath are licensed as restaurants, not bars, so CCL is legal, and I carried my P3AT 380 everywhere.

Hope it helps…

[miklcolt45]

I know I've seen this discussed many times here.

You can't sit in the bar area.
You CAN sit in the restaurant area.
If the establishment is primarily a bar, stay out.

You can't WALK thru the bar area.
If the access to the restrooms is thru the bar, go before you leave home. Or find a bush outside.

[Mongoose]

It means any place that makes more then 50% of their money (sales) from Beer and alcoholic beverages is a big NO-NO.

[MattInFla]

It means any place that makes more then 50% of their money (sales) from Beer and alcoholic beverages is a big NO-NO.

I disagree.

In Florida, the law states that a licensee under 790.06 may not carry a weapon into "any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;"

So a bar is a no-go.

But a restaurant that serves alcohol is fine. Even if it has a bar, so long as you do not enter into the bar area at any time.

Some states expect their CCW holders to be accountants, checking out the books of the places they visit to make sure they don't derive 50.001% of their income from alcohol.

Florida, fortunately, just says "stay out of the bar area".

For examination of this issue (and any other question about weapons in Florida), I highly recommend Florida Firearms - Law, Use & Ownership by Jon Gutmacher.

Matt

[Ron]

I disagree.

In Florida, the law states that a licensee under 790.06 may not carry a weapon into "any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;"

So a bar is a no-go.

But a restaurant that serves alcohol is fine. Even if it has a bar, so long as you do not enter into the bar area at any time.

Some states expect their CCW holders to be accountants, checking out the books of the places they visit to make sure they don't derive 50.001% of their income from alcohol.

Florida, fortunately, just says "stay out of the bar area".

For examination of this issue (and any other question about weapons in Florida), I highly recommend Florida Firearms - Law, Use & Ownership by Jon Gutmacher.

Matt

I believe that Matt has stated the correct interrpretation of the Florida law.

Ron

[David in FL]

Even Sloppy Joes and Hogs Breath are licensed as restaurants, not bars, so CCL is legal, and I carried my P3AT 380 everywhere.

Hope it helps…

Sorry, IMHO, I'd say you were lucky....... Those fine establishments serve food, but that clearly isn't their primary purpose. Even in "pure" restaurants, you may not carry in the bar area.

Ch. 790.06.12......" No license issued pursuant to this section shall authorize any person to carry a concealed weapon or firearm into any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose."

[David in FL]

I believe that Matt has stated the correct interrpretation of the Florida law.

Ron

Slight clarification......in an establishment like Hogs Breath or Sloppy Joes, there really isn't any distinct, separate "restaurant" area and I don't think anyone would try to argue that either establishment isn't "primarily devoted" to serving alcohol.

Restuarants......no problemo. Bars that also serve food....be very, very careful. FWIW, that's the exact answer I got fr Jon Gutmacher when I had the opportunity to talk to him awhile back.

[MattInFla]

To be safe, there should be a clear delineation between the bar area and the rest of the establishment.

A low wall, or some other clear separation.

Matt

[David in FL]

To be safe, there should be a clear delineation between the bar area and the rest of the establishment.

A low wall, or some other clear separation.

Matt

Agree!

Also agree with Matt's recommendation of Jon's book. If you live in FL......buy it!

[Ron]

To be safe, there should be a clear delineation between the bar area and the rest of the establishment.

A low wall, or some other clear separation.

Matt

Yes, there will be establishments where it is not clear. IMO, the best rule to follow is if in doubt, don't carry. It is simply not worth risking losing your license.

Ron

[Vested]

Slight clarification......in an establishment like Hogs Breath or Sloppy Joes, there really isn't any distinct, separate "restaurant" area and I don't think anyone would try to argue that either establishment isn't "primarily devoted" to serving alcohol.

Restuarants......no problemo. Bars that also serve food....be very, very careful. FWIW, that's the exact answer I got fr Jon Gutmacher when I had the opportunity to talk to him awhile back.

Concerning the above mentioned establishments it does not look like anyone's response states that they know for certain one way or the other.

Contact the Attorney General's office if really want to remove all doubt.

[tns0038]

Sorry, IMHO, I'd say you were lucky....... Those fine establishments serve food, but that clearly isn't their primary purpose. Even in "pure" restaurants, you may not carry in the bar area.

Ch. 790.06.12......" No license issued pursuant to this section shall authorize any person to carry a concealed weapon or firearm into any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose."

Dave I’ll say I have to disagree

There is not a single place in ether Sloppy Joe’s or Hogs Breath that when you sit down they don’t hand you a menu. And they are licensed as restaurants that also have an alcohol license. Not a bar… Note the no smoking indoors part, and for me, that makes it easy. I don’t go to anyplace that allows indoor smoking.

Regardless, if I was going there to consume alcoholic beverages, I would leave my sidearm back in the room, but, if I’m stopping in for a cheese burger in paradise, then I fail to see a problem.

But, then again, I don’t carry a full size sidearm that may cause attention, in shorts and T-shirt; I normally just carry a P3AT 380.

And the only way anyone is ever going to know I’m armed is if I have to use it. Then where I got the gun is going to be the investigating officers’ last question.


Are there any current Florida LEO’s on this forum that care to share an opinion regarding what constitutes a bar vs restaurant.

[David in FL]

Dave I’ll say I have to disagree

There is not a single place in ether Sloppy Joe’s or Hogs Breath that when you sit down they don’t hand you a menu. And they are licensed as restaurants that also have an alcohol license. Not a bar… Note the no smoking indoors part, and for me, that makes it easy. I don’t go to anyplace that allows indoor smoking.
[/B]

No problem......I live in a house with 2 women, so I'm used to being disagreed with on a daily basis!

Just passing along the opinion that I was given by Jon Gutmacher himself.

Something to note with respect to the "no smoking" policy as a guide though. In order to allow smoking, an establishment must derive less than 10% of it's revenue from food sales.

The CCW statute indicates that you may not carry in that part of an establishment that is primarily devoted to the dispensing and consumption of alcohol. That means that a bar could derive 90% of it's revenue from alcohol, not allow smoking, but still be, by just about anyone's definition, primarily devoted to dispensing alcohol.

Everyone has a different tolerance for certain risks. My own tolerance for the risk of losing my CC permit is pretty low......if ya know what I mean!