No-gos in Florida

This is a discussion on No-gos in Florida within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'm planning a spring break to Florida and need some translation and insight to current practices. Originally Posted by Handgunlaw.us, Florida no-gos section any portion ...

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Thread: No-gos in Florida

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Agave's Avatar
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    No-gos in Florida

    I'm planning a spring break to Florida and need some translation and insight to current practices.

    Quote Originally Posted by Handgunlaw.us, Florida no-gos section
    any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which
    portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;
    What is this saying? Is it saying that the bar portion of a restaurant is off-limits? Or is the entire establishment off-limits?

    I'd appreciate some feedback from Florida residents and travelers that can tell how you practice observation of this.

    Gracias.
    Last edited by Agave; February 26th, 2008 at 12:52 PM.
    The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.

    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor, Tennessee Certified Instructor

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    Member Array spensergig's Avatar
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    It's really not that complicated

    I know I've seen this discussed many times here.

    You can't sit in the bar area.
    You CAN sit in the restaurant area.
    If the establishment is primarily a bar, stay out.

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    VIP Member Array tns0038's Avatar
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    To get around Florida anti smoking law, some restaurants, have a separate bar area that is not connected to the restaurant. That bar would be off limits for CCL, but not the rest of the restaurant.

    We just stayed 10 days in the Keys over Christmas and New Years. And the best I can tell, the only place you can not CCL would be the very few bars that donít serve food. You can tell those because they allow smoking indoors.

    Even Sloppy Joes and Hogs Breath are licensed as restaurants, not bars, so CCL is legal, and I carried my P3AT 380 everywhere.

    Hope it helpsÖ

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    VIP Member Array miklcolt45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spensergig View Post
    I know I've seen this discussed many times here.

    You can't sit in the bar area.
    You CAN sit in the restaurant area.
    If the establishment is primarily a bar, stay out.
    You can't WALK thru the bar area.
    If the access to the restrooms is thru the bar, go before you leave home. Or find a bush outside.
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliott

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    Member Array Mongoose's Avatar
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    It means any place that makes more then 50% of their money (sales) from Beer and alcoholic beverages is a big NO-NO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mongoose View Post
    It means any place that makes more then 50% of their money (sales) from Beer and alcoholic beverages is a big NO-NO.
    I disagree.

    In Florida, the law states that a licensee under 790.06 may not carry a weapon into "any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;"

    So a bar is a no-go.

    But a restaurant that serves alcohol is fine. Even if it has a bar, so long as you do not enter into the bar area at any time.

    Some states expect their CCW holders to be accountants, checking out the books of the places they visit to make sure they don't derive 50.001% of their income from alcohol.

    Florida, fortunately, just says "stay out of the bar area".

    For examination of this issue (and any other question about weapons in Florida), I highly recommend Florida Firearms - Law, Use & Ownership by Jon Gutmacher.

    Matt
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    Ron
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    I disagree.

    In Florida, the law states that a licensee under 790.06 may not carry a weapon into "any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;"

    So a bar is a no-go.

    But a restaurant that serves alcohol is fine. Even if it has a bar, so long as you do not enter into the bar area at any time.

    Some states expect their CCW holders to be accountants, checking out the books of the places they visit to make sure they don't derive 50.001% of their income from alcohol.

    Florida, fortunately, just says "stay out of the bar area".

    For examination of this issue (and any other question about weapons in Florida), I highly recommend Florida Firearms - Law, Use & Ownership by Jon Gutmacher.

    Matt
    I believe that Matt has stated the correct interrpretation of the Florida law.

    Ron
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    VIP Member Array David in FL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tns0038 View Post
    Even Sloppy Joes and Hogs Breath are licensed as restaurants, not bars, so CCL is legal, and I carried my P3AT 380 everywhere.

    Hope it helps…
    Sorry, IMHO, I'd say you were lucky....... Those fine establishments serve food, but that clearly isn't their primary purpose. Even in "pure" restaurants, you may not carry in the bar area.

    Ch. 790.06.12......" No license issued pursuant to this section shall authorize any person to carry a concealed weapon or firearm into any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose."

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    VIP Member Array David in FL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron View Post
    I believe that Matt has stated the correct interrpretation of the Florida law.

    Ron
    Slight clarification......in an establishment like Hogs Breath or Sloppy Joes, there really isn't any distinct, separate "restaurant" area and I don't think anyone would try to argue that either establishment isn't "primarily devoted" to serving alcohol.

    Restuarants......no problemo. Bars that also serve food....be very, very careful. FWIW, that's the exact answer I got fr Jon Gutmacher when I had the opportunity to talk to him awhile back.

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    To be safe, there should be a clear delineation between the bar area and the rest of the establishment.

    A low wall, or some other clear separation.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

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    VIP Member Array David in FL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    To be safe, there should be a clear delineation between the bar area and the rest of the establishment.

    A low wall, or some other clear separation.

    Matt
    Agree!

    Also agree with Matt's recommendation of Jon's book. If you live in FL......buy it!

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    Ron
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    To be safe, there should be a clear delineation between the bar area and the rest of the establishment.

    A low wall, or some other clear separation.

    Matt
    Yes, there will be establishments where it is not clear. IMO, the best rule to follow is if in doubt, don't carry. It is simply not worth risking losing your license.

    Ron
    "It does not do to leave a dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him."

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    Member Array Vested's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David in FL View Post
    Slight clarification......in an establishment like Hogs Breath or Sloppy Joes, there really isn't any distinct, separate "restaurant" area and I don't think anyone would try to argue that either establishment isn't "primarily devoted" to serving alcohol.

    Restuarants......no problemo. Bars that also serve food....be very, very careful. FWIW, that's the exact answer I got fr Jon Gutmacher when I had the opportunity to talk to him awhile back.
    Concerning the above mentioned establishments it does not look like anyone's response states that they know for certain one way or the other.

    Contact the Attorney General's office if really want to remove all doubt.

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    VIP Member Array tns0038's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David in FL View Post
    Sorry, IMHO, I'd say you were lucky....... Those fine establishments serve food, but that clearly isn't their primary purpose. Even in "pure" restaurants, you may not carry in the bar area.

    Ch. 790.06.12......" No license issued pursuant to this section shall authorize any person to carry a concealed weapon or firearm into any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose."

    Dave Iíll say I have to disagree

    There is not a single place in ether Sloppy Joeís or Hogs Breath that when you sit down they donít hand you a menu. And they are licensed as restaurants that also have an alcohol license. Not a barÖ Note the no smoking indoors part, and for me, that makes it easy. I donít go to anyplace that allows indoor smoking.

    Regardless, if I was going there to consume alcoholic beverages, I would leave my sidearm back in the room, but, if Iím stopping in for a cheese burger in paradise, then I fail to see a problem.

    But, then again, I donít carry a full size sidearm that may cause attention, in shorts and T-shirt; I normally just carry a P3AT 380.

    And the only way anyone is ever going to know Iím armed is if I have to use it. Then where I got the gun is going to be the investigating officersí last question.


    Are there any current Florida LEOís on this forum that care to share an opinion regarding what constitutes a bar vs restaurant.

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array David in FL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tns0038 View Post
    Dave I’ll say I have to disagree

    There is not a single place in ether Sloppy Joe’s or Hogs Breath that when you sit down they don’t hand you a menu. And they are licensed as restaurants that also have an alcohol license. Not a bar… Note the no smoking indoors part, and for me, that makes it easy. I don’t go to anyplace that allows indoor smoking.
    [/B]
    No problem......I live in a house with 2 women, so I'm used to being disagreed with on a daily basis!

    Just passing along the opinion that I was given by Jon Gutmacher himself.

    Something to note with respect to the "no smoking" policy as a guide though. In order to allow smoking, an establishment must derive less than 10% of it's revenue from food sales.

    The CCW statute indicates that you may not carry in that part of an establishment that is primarily devoted to the dispensing and consumption of alcohol. That means that a bar could derive 90% of it's revenue from alcohol, not allow smoking, but still be, by just about anyone's definition, primarily devoted to dispensing alcohol.

    Everyone has a different tolerance for certain risks. My own tolerance for the risk of losing my CC permit is pretty low......if ya know what I mean!

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