Took my NRA certified course tonight...

Took my NRA certified course tonight...

This is a discussion on Took my NRA certified course tonight... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; A rant here...so if you don't want to hear it move on :) And I must say -- if this is all that's required for ...

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Thread: Took my NRA certified course tonight...

  1. #1
    Member Array FearSheeple's Avatar
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    Took my NRA certified course tonight...

    A rant here...so if you don't want to hear it move on :)

    And I must say -- if this is all that's required for someone to get a CHL in the state of VA...I can't say I support it!

    Now first, the instructor was fantastic (Chip Lohman, owner/operator for SafePistol.com) and I highly recommend him to anyone in the northern VA area who needs or wants instruction.

    But now that we have that out of the way, the class goes over basic concepts of a pistol, how it works, different types of ammunition (talking wad cutters, FMJ, and JHP). Some of the people in the class had obviously been experienced with firearms.

    Others in the class it was obvious that they really had no previous experience. Yet, the requirements for a CHL state they must take a class like this, to obtain a permit.

    I have been around firearms, handguns included since I was 6 years old. I shot competitive .22 rifle when I was in high school. I took this basic class because I would have had to wait several months to take the next available CCW tailored class, I'm enrolled for it too, but now that I've taken the class i can submit my application. I know that I am perfectly capable of carrying a loaded pistol on my person.

    Now I realize that not everyone in this class will be applying for a concealed weapons permit, but I'd guess a good percentage of people that do - are doing so for that reason. I know gun owners and most especially CHL holders are supposed to be responsible, but I guess I am just surprised that this is all that it takes...Heck, a hunters safety course will get you a CHL in VA.

    /RANT

    What are others peoples thoughts on this? i am all about education and plan on taking as many training classes as I can afford, because I want to do everything in my power to protect myself, and if that day comes where I should need to draw It will become second nature vs confusion.


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array cdwolf's Avatar
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    There is no class req. in MS. A background check, fingerprints, and 120 days!! We don't need a govt. telling people"now your trained" That's what I don't like about the classes! If your going to carry you need to get the range time and training for yourself!
    Read my signature!
    GUN CONTROL= I WANT TO BE THE ONE IN CONTROL OF THE GUN

    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

  3. #3
    VIP Member Array matiki's Avatar
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    It could be "worse" (your opinion, not mine), in many states (mine included) there are no requirements other than a background check.

    Personally, it doesn't bother me.

  4. #4
    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
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    Pennsylvania Here!

    No class - No shooting test - No Fingerprints.
    -------
    -SIG , it's What's for Dinner-

    know your rights!
    http://www.handgunlaw.us

    "If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
    {Bernhard Goetz}

  5. #5
    Member Array FearSheeple's Avatar
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    I'm torn on the issue because I agree with your sig cdwolf. But on the same token, not everyone who carry's is like us here on this forum, spending time at the range shooting, practicing, learning how to responsibly carry etc.

    Oh well I'm glad we have these rights, and I fully support them!

  6. #6
    Member Array gg12's Avatar
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    Smile

    I respectfully disagree that a citizen needs to take weeks and months (and hundreds of dollars worth) of "training" to carry a gun. The gun is not high tech, complicated, nor difficult to operate. Driving a car is considerably more complicated and likely to result in injury or death to someone yet I don't hear people mandating a potential driver to take two or three NASCAR-approved training courses before getting behind the wheel.

    The decision to carry a gun is expensive enough as it is, don't make it any worse.

    And please don't assume that those who haven't taken classes or advanced training are inept beginners or incapable of self defense or lacking common sense. Some of us just carry and keep ourselves safe while minding our own business and without comparing guns/targets/hours of training/style of holster/etc.....just like some of us drive plain Ford cars and could care less what you drive so long as you keep it on your side of the road.

  7. #7
    VIP Member Array cdwolf's Avatar
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    Now let's say you had a two day class, upon completion most would never fire there weapon again, feeling they completed their training!
    Assuming these people are new to firearms, could you teach them all they need to know from safety,responsibility, hitting on target,knowing you are held accountable for every round that leaves your gun!!
    Most of us grew up shooting, there is nothing that will substitute time behind the trigger of whatever you are carrying.
    I think without a class a newbie is less likely to strap it on and forget about it,there more likely to do whatever it takes to make them confident in shooting and safety practices!! IMO,and that's all it is MO
    GUN CONTROL= I WANT TO BE THE ONE IN CONTROL OF THE GUN

    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array JimmyC4's Avatar
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    FearSheeple, government involvement doesn't necessarily improve any process. And, what right does your state, or any state, have to impose a training requirement on citizens before they can arm themselves for personal defense. The way I read it, the Second Amendment doesn't state any training or proficiency requirements.
    "It's a big gun when I carry it, it is also a big gun when I take it out” – Clint Smith

  9. #9
    Distinguished Member Array snowdoctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyC4 View Post
    FearSheeple, government involvement doesn't necessarily improve any process. And, what right does your state, or any state, have to impose a training requirement on citizens before they can arm themselves for personal defense. The way I read it, the Second Amendment doesn't state any training or proficiency requirements.
    +1 Jimmy I agree 100 percent...although I am a certified instructor and enjoy teaching, it is a shame my state requires me to do so, in order for someone to legally exercise a right in which our country was founded on. There is no magic number of hours that makes someone be able to exercise there first amendment right...but wait...maybe there should be...lol...you get the idea.
    ----DOC-----

    --people ask why I carry, and I show them this picture. I think it says it all.--

    NRA Certified Instructor--many disciplines

  10. #10
    VIP Member Array Kerbouchard's Avatar
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    I have mixed feelings on this one. I am deeply opposed to any restrictions on the RKBA, period. Now, I enter this discussion knowing that I will never get my way and have all restrictions lifted, so now I am forced into a compromise. I believe somebody who wrongfully takes a life with a firearm should be punished to the maximum extent of the law, regardless of the amount of training he has had or is required. I don't care if it's Ed McGivern, Massad Ayoob, or Joe Schmoe. People should take responsibility for their own actions, their own choices, their own lifestyles, and yes, their own training. If any of those choices lead to bad consequences, they should have to face those consequences.

    On the other hand, there are some states that will never issue reciprocity to a state that does not require training. In the interest of a 50 state, or 48(CA and IL, are lost causes) state reciprocity I would be favorable to a standard minimum requirements that would guarantee reciprocity for the entire United States.

    Until we standardize some sort of minimum requirements, we will never be able to carry nation wide...unless you wanted to get 5 or 6 different licenses.
    There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil.

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  11. #11
    Member Array braindonor's Avatar
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    I like the way California does it, 8 hours of class, 8 hours of shooting, up to 400-600 rounds. I saw newbies, who really couldn't keep their eyes open in the beginning, and who couldn't load a mag, get competent in drawing, safety operation, front sight acquisition, clearing jams, double tap, failure drill, checking for other threats, reloading, and reholstering. Using a handgun isn't hard, unless you have never done it before and are scared of the idea and the consequences because of lack of knowledge. Until one gets past a certain point, I think a handgun is a liability. And THIS:

    I think without a class a newbie is less likely to strap it on and forget about it,there more likely to do whatever it takes to make them confident in shooting and safety practices!! IMO,and that's all it is MO
    really doesn't make any sense to me. Without some education, a newbie isn't even going to know where the range is.

    Think of the last fast food or big box employee you encountered who didn't know which way was up. They should be able to carry.........AFTER they know what they are doing.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array cdwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by braindonor View Post
    I like the way California does it, 8 hours of class, 8 hours of shooting, up to 400-600 rounds. I saw newbies, who really couldn't keep their eyes open in the beginning, and who couldn't load a mag, get competent in drawing, safety operation, front sight acquisition, clearing jams, double tap, failure drill, checking for other threats, reloading, and reholstering. Using a handgun isn't hard, unless you have never done it before and are scared of the idea and the consequences because of lack of knowledge. Until one gets past a certain point, I think a handgun is a liability. And THIS:



    really doesn't make any sense to me. Without some education, a newbie isn't even going to know where the range is.

    Think of the last fast food or big box employee you encountered who didn't know which way was up. They should be able to carry.........AFTER they know what they are doing.
    So CA is your bar for exercising your 2A Right...good choice
    I'm a manager at a big box for over 12 years... good call But I know my field!!!
    So the cost of the permit + 16 hours training and $180.00 in ammo,then you can defend yourself!!
    GUN CONTROL= I WANT TO BE THE ONE IN CONTROL OF THE GUN

    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array BigEFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdwolf View Post
    So CA is your bar for exercising your 2A Right...good choice
    I'm a manager at a big box for over 12 years... good call But I know my field!!!
    So the cost of the permit + 16 hours training and $180.00 in ammo,then you can defend yourself!!

    Every CA County is different. I was only required to take a 4 hour class that included 36 rounds of fire. And no, California is no model for much of anything especially 2A rights.
    Lex et Libertas — Semper Vigilo, Fortis, Paratus, et Fidelis!

    "Not only do the people who put their lives on the line to protect the rest of us deserve better, we all deserve better than to have our own security undermined by those who undermine law enforcement." -Thomas Sowell

  14. #14
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    I think if your going to be responsible enough to carry, then you should be able to take it upon yourself to get educated. The problem is, that many people think that going to the range and blasting a box or two of ammo at 4 yds is training.

    Most training that is needed has nothing to do with the range or the gun. How many times do we see here that member XX has been carrying for 10 years, and yet still has to ask the most basic of legal questions on an internet forum. To me that is scary.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  15. #15
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    Well, first of all, I don't think any American's right should be restricted by the government as long as they aren't breaking laws and causing harm to people. There were people in my class who couldn't shoot great, or operate a weapon flawlessly, heck, I even know Marines with months of training who have trouble with tap rap bang and 5 point safety checks.

    Not everyone grew up with firearms, and they are entitled to the right to defend themselves.

    Most civilians who CCW will not go beyond the base training level and will shoot maybe a couple of hundred rounds a year, no matter what that base is. If the process is too much of a hassle then people may just start to carry illegally, or they just won't go through the process.

    SIXTO brings up a valid point that weapons handling and accuracy aren't the only things that they need trained on either, awareness to surrounding, a combat mindset (in a sense of the phrase), and legal issues all need addressed. But piling all this on at once to someone who has never touched a firearm is extremely overwhelming. Hopefully everyone does as much effective training in as many areas as they can, but that is unrealistic.
    Fortes Fortuna Juvat

    Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
    NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor

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