Brandishing - minutiae?

Brandishing - minutiae?

This is a discussion on Brandishing - minutiae? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Just idle thought as usual! (So what's new? ) You are sitting on the porch - so on your property. A stranger wanders up, perhaps ...

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Thread: Brandishing - minutiae?

  1. #1
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    Brandishing - minutiae?

    Just idle thought as usual! (So what's new? )

    You are sitting on the porch - so on your property. A stranger wanders up, perhaps just to ask directions, who knows.

    Example #1 - you are sitting there with handgun in hand - not pointed at anyone but out of the holster. What would be the ''brandishing quotient'', if any?

    Example #2 - you are sitting with shotgun across legs, maybe just one hand resting on it - ''brandishing quotient''?

    Example #3 - let's crank this up a notch further - you have an AK across legs - with full mag in place!! ''brandishing quotient''?

    This is nothing to do with what I may or may not choose to do - or not do. Simply sounding folks out as to how these conditions might be interpreted. Curiosity if you will.

    I expect location will have a lot of influence but any LE input would be welcome too.
    Chris - P95
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    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.


  2. #2
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    Varies lots from state to state and also in the interpetation. I still prefer the "suprise , didin't know I had an AR behind the porch rail did ya?"

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    Agree With Rocky all the way around

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    Senior Member Array BlueLion's Avatar
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    I alluded to this in an earlier post, but police in my area are suggesting that open carry be illegal. I think this is bad move. I think what they should do is make it impossible to buy handgun bullets without proof of permit or CCW. This would cut out alot of the BG getting ammo. In my area we have a gun thief that has already broken into several homes stealing guns only. We all know that these weapons will end up on the Black Market. any thoughts on permit proof required before ammo purchase. #1 you the person is a decent person if they qualified for a permit. #2 it would control the BG getting ammo.
    Listen, Think and React.....Nuff Said.....

  5. #5
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    The idea has some merit Blue but - anything smelling of ''permit'' still goes right across the rights we so cherish. Privelage soon replaces rights - all too easily.

    Then we have reloaders - it will for now at least not be too hard for anyone to get consumables, and cast their own bullets - tho I doubt many BG's would go that route. Some might tho if they had to.

    I am all for making BG's lives harder in all and any directions but so much is hard to implement without the good guys getting screwed too - and we already have way to many restrictions.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    They'll get it... they'll always be able to get it. It's not like the BG's actually have to have much ammo anyway. They aren't exactly plinking on the weekends.

    The way I look at it, a criminal gets to carry concealed and he does not even pay for his gun. Why should I, a lawful citizen who doesn't steal things, have to pay for a special permit and show ID all the time?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by P95Carry
    Just idle thought as usual! (So what's new? )

    You are sitting on the porch - so on your property. A stranger wanders up, perhaps just to ask directions, who knows.

    Example #1 - you are sitting there with handgun in hand - not pointed at anyone but out of the holster. What would be the ''brandishing quotient'', if any?

    Example #2 - you are sitting with shotgun across legs, maybe just one hand resting on it - ''brandishing quotient''?

    Example #3 - let's crank this up a notch further - you have an AK across legs - with full mag in place!! ''brandishing quotient''?

    This is nothing to do with what I may or may not choose to do - or not do. Simply sounding folks out as to how these conditions might be interpreted. Curiosity if you will.

    I expect location will have a lot of influence but any LE input would be welcome too.
    Having recently moved to MO I think you would be in a bit of trouble with any of the above here. However, I am familiar with VA's laws and it is based on the person asking for directions. If they believe that you are holding the firearm with the intent to intimidate or shoot them you are toast. So your best bet is to not be doing it.

    Now if I were the stranger I'd probably ask what you had and start talking guns with you, but that's just me.

    -Scott-

  8. #8
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    Front Porch On You're Own Property

    You should be OK.
    The Police might get called but, you should be able to do what you want on your own property if you are not threatening.

    Chris...Interesting Pittsburgh Note:
    There is a street in East Liberty that has a big old house owned by a Muslim group. There is a guy that sits gaurding the front porch (right in front of the front door) with a shotgun across his lap.
    I used to see him just sitting there all the time.
    The East Lib. Police drive by that house all the time.
    It must be OK for him to sit there...I guess.
    I have no idea what exactly he is guarding against.

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    Senior Member Array rfurtkamp's Avatar
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    I sit on my front porch cleaning evil black rifles or waiting to carpool to the range regularly.

    Any of the things listed are kosher legally here.
    Driver carries less than $45 worth of remorse.

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    Haha QK - oh well then maybe the shottie is Ok
    Chris - P95
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    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array Free American's Avatar
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    Hold up with the VA laws. I can carry what I want wherever Iwant, as long as I'm not walking the streets with a fully loaded AR I'm OK
    They who give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin


    Previously known as "cjm5874"

  12. #12
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    Your on your own property, the gun was already out you didn’t get it out to threaten the person, they “wandered” up without your permission so they are trespassing , I don’t see a problem.
    livin in the woods...feelin mighty good

  13. #13
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    Here...

    "Brandishing" means two things...

    The particular handling of the firearm and the dialogue that goes with it.

    For instance, sitting on your porch with a shotgun,pistol or rifle across your lap is not 'brandishing". As long as you are on private property and you have not pointed it at someone, you are good to go.

    Get involved in some sort of aggresive dialogue and display the weapon in a threatening manner and you could be charged with "brandishing".

    Inadvertant disclosure of a concealed weapon is not considered "brandishing"in this state, although I understand that in the antigun states that the mere sight of a concealed weapon causes the scaredycats to become very upset.

    If an LEO tells you to immediatley drop the weapon and you refuse to do so in a timely manner, you could be charged with brandishing. One thing that people need to understand is that if an LEO shows up for any reason, for his safetys sake he is going to take the sight of a weapon very seriously no matter what the circumstances are. A little understanding here goes a long way.

    Of course ,it's entirely dependent on the local laws and the views of the police there and how they decide to interpret them. A known gangbanger in LA sitting on his porch with an AK is going to be viewed differently than an old geezer wearing coveralls with his 12 gauge sitting in his lap here in the boondocks of Arkansas.

    I once got a call about 3 men with guns in the Western Sizzling Parking lot.
    Understand that thats all the info we got from dispatch and that we dont really have a clue of whats going on. We knew that no shots had been fired and that no aggresive action had been taken. So we rolled up very cautiously and assesed the situation. We could tell right off that it was just some guys showing each other their deer rifles from the back of a pickup truck, a scene that probably is duplicated thousands of times in the small towns of America around deer season.

    Ater some conversation with the guys, and after checking out their rifles, they admitted that handling them in the parking lot was probably not the best place to do it, since we have people from all over the country driving though on 1-40 and stopping in for a break. They put their rifles up and left. No tickets were issued.

    To be thruthfull, at this time of the year you are going to see people looking at each others guns all over town. Here it is not a big issue. In the big city of Little Rock, it might be.

    What might get you popped for brandishing in one city may be completley acceptable in another.

    That makes discussion of it on the internet so confusing due to the places that people post from. The differences between states,citys and even small towns can be enormous. Get 10 cops together from 10 different places and you'll get 10 different versions of the word.

    That is what is so confusing to folks and often its the little details that get them in trouble.

    Just make sure you knowwhat the definition of "brandishing" is where you live and you'll be all right.

  14. #14
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    Thumbs up HotGuns

    GREAT VALUABLE POST AND COMMENTS.
    KUDOS! HotGuns! You nailed it perfectly!

  15. #15
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    HG - excellent and thx - good coverage.
    Quote Originally Posted by V-fib
    Your on your own property, the gun was already out you didn?t get it out to threaten the person, they ?wandered? up without your permission so they are trespassing , I don?t see a problem.
    That is my basic take too - but was just interested to see what folks thought from their own perspectives.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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