This is a discussion on constructive criticism,or nosey jerk? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Nosey jerk or concerned citizen? Now in this context where he was an "associate" of your brothers, maybe he knew in advance and was looking, ...
Nosey jerk or concerned citizen? Now in this context where he was an "associate" of your brothers, maybe he knew in advance and was looking, or maybe he plays the
"find another CHL/CCW" game,, Please dont get me wrong here, I check about 80% of the people who walk into my store for obvious bulges, and a belt clip sticks out,, which leads me to closer for a bulge,,, I will not say anything unless it is obvious, meaning just because I spotted it does not mean its obvious to everyone.
Back to your situation, I would have probably been embarrassed at first, then asked the guy to show me how he was carrying so I could learn from the pro...
Notice I said Show,, when he starts telling me well I dont have my pistol on me right now, I would say thats fine, when you do we can continue the discussion, until then I find it hard to follow without the visual aid, but thank you for your concern..
I had a man who carelessly carried into my store using a sports coat to cover his weapon,, I kept a close eye on the guy because he was out of place and his dress was not "normal" for the store,, he walks up to the counter and notices I am keeping my eyes on him and asks me "is there a problem" his tone was not threatening, There were other customers in the store, and I didnt want to make a scene or "out" the guy, so I just said, "no you look like a guy went to school with, is your name james"
He said no its XXXX and blew it off,, two days later when he came back into the store there were no other customers, and he again saw me watching him, He says again "whats your problem man" this time it was not so polite,
At this point I dont want to escalate anything but I feel I should let him know why I am eyeing him,, so I say "well when people carry guns into my store I tend to keep an eye on them (insert xxxx name here)"
At that point he gets defensive, I know there is not going to be a happy ending, so I settle for the next best option,, While he goes into how its his right to carry etc, I explain to him that his continual flashing everytime he takes a step is not concealed, At that point he throws his CHL on the counter and says
"you still have a problem" I really felt I should have dropped his chl in the safe and had the police return it to him along with a criminal tresspass warning, Instead I choose to get the guy to go somewhere else in the future on his own.. (however if he comes back again, I will have him CTW)
There is a difference in printing and flashing to me,, CONCEALED MEANS CONCEALED, in Texas the law is basically of the same mind I am,, that if a "normal person" does not observe your weapon, you are ok,,
Dont get me wrong I dont want to hassle any CHL out there, this guy can now say "the store guy is a jerk" or he can change his carry method,,,, or he can do neither, one of the reasons the state approved CHL and not open carry was because they dont want public tension,, Personally I would have felt much better if I lived in an open carry state and they guy was openly carrying, as it was the half concealed handgun made me nervous and maybe thats the guys goal,,,,,
Ok now what does that have to do with the price of tea in china?
As you can see I had a reason for eyeing the guy,, I didnt out him but my situation was different than yours,, you say you were in a "gun friendly" store, perhaps to this guy he thought he was doing you a favor,, or maybe he was showing off to his other "gun friendly" friends, Or maybe he was just alerting his friends in an obvious manner that there was an armed person amongst them. Back to the suggestion above, turn the tables and do it quietly, the more you make a scene the worse off for you, after all hes already told everyone you are carrying,, by putting him on the spot by asking him to "SHOW" you a better method, it takes the heat off you and spotlights him, if he truly is confortable enough to think it was friendly advice I dont see why he would not be comfortable enough to help you out further..... even if it means him saying Well not right here but if you want to go to the range I can show you some other options. Even if he is not trying to be friendly and helpfull at this time, everyone else is now going to be searching this pud to find the "hidden gun" Which again takes the heat off you...
On that note,, maybe not, I didnt show my idiot how I carried,, but of course I didnt throw my CHL down and act like it was my god given right either.. figured if he saw it he saw it, (and I dont go to the extreme in concealment, if your looking you will see my bulge, but I try to keep my gun side away from the customers line of sight) when not in the store I choose a much more discreet carry gun,, or better concealment garments, Usually the little p3at I carry for around town stuff can get by in a t-shirt,, if I carry the heavier caliber it gets a printed shirt.. and when I can get away with it a blue jean jacket, (2-3 months a year) which breaks up any bulging.
The world is full of jerks. Thankfully we don't come into personal contact with them very often. The appropiate response when you notice someone is carrying is to keep your mouth shut other than to continue being polite and behaving as if you did not know they were carrying. The fact that someone carries is a personal thing and not the business of anyone else. It's like wearing boxers or briefs. Is it anyones business which you wear? No.
I don't understand what's the big deal! Why be scared of an inanimate object!
Guns don't kill people, people do!
I would have jumped up and said "you got a problem...draw!!!"
GUN CONTROL= I WANT TO BE THE ONE IN CONTROL OF THE GUN
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
Your response should have been, oh really, well how do you carry. Then he could have either explained that he didn't carry or showed you how he did and you could have seen if it was well hidden or not.
Maybe the guy was both a jerk and giving a bit of constructive criticism. I don't know where the conversation went after he told you to conceal better.
My personal take on the matter is that if your trying to conceal your weapon, you should conceal the weapon. To me that doesn't mean you just cover the thing with a t-shirt and leave a large bulge or print of a gun under it.
Today I was carrying OWB with a Browning vest over my gun. It was windy here today, so when I was walking the wind was blowing my vest open and probably exposing my gun to anyone who would have been paying close attention. Most people wouldn't have noticed, but I choose to take my vest and pull it down in front, tuck my thumb into my front pocket and hold it down, telling my son to grab my hand like that as we walked through the parking lot.
No I wouldn't have been breaking the law (at least the way I read it) in Texas for allowing someone that was looking close to get a glimps of my pistol, but that is not something that I want do. I choose to keep my gun concealed at all times even from nosey people, except when home when I make a trip to the mail box or trash can or am on my back porch.
That is the way I feel about the concealed part of concealed carry. Others may feel differently, and that is their choice. But I don't want anyone I don't choose to know I am carrying know that I am carrying.
Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
Texas CHL Instructor
Texas Hunter Education Instructor
if he saw it that fast you might want to do a little better job of concealing if you dont want anyone to know you carry.
just take what you can use from this encounter.
in Texas were not allowed to be sloppy about concealing.
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The Guys a jerk. But we can learn even from a jerk.
There is only one tactical principle which is not subject to change. It is to use the means at hand to inflict the maximum amount of wound, death, and destruction on the enemy in the minimum amount of time."
- General George Patton Jr
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I'd go with a little of both, the guy is a nosey jerk, but if you didn't want everyone to know you were carrying, don't you think it would behoove you to put a little more effort in to making sure they don't?
I try to ignore the nosy jerks. But sometimes, you just have to tell them to take a long walk off a short pier.
I'd say you ran into a jerk the other night at the cigar shop.
If he mentioned it that fast, maybe your brother or one of the other guys put him up to it just to see your response. Were they all together before you got there? I can easily imagine a scenario where your brother or one of the others says, "Hey, when he gets here, tell him you can see his piece. It will bug the crap out of him!"
Either way... jerk.
If they aren't, than I would hope that we, as a group, are responsible enough to not let them know in the first place.
If somebody I trusted to know that I carried a firearm pulled a stunt like that, they would no longer be among the trusted...That's just me.
There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil.
Who is John Galt?
I agree, and while you were replying, I was editing my reply to say, "Either way... jerk." instead of "If not... jerk."
Guy a jerk? Probably. Should he know at a glance that you are carrying a firearm? Never. It's not called "concealed carry" for nothing. True the guy was not going about it the right way but I've gotta say the situation would have been a whole lot different if the gun was not known to exist on your person. I think this is an example of two wrongs not making a right. If I'm going to print with my shirt of choice, I'd go pocket/ankle or change my clothes to appropriatly hide my weapon. Just MHO.
In God we trust, everyone else keep your hands where I can see them.
Rights are like muscles: If you don't excersise them they slowly disappear.