I Thought it was actually going down today and...DO NOT WAIT TO DRAW...

This is a discussion on I Thought it was actually going down today and...DO NOT WAIT TO DRAW... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I feel your pain on the focus, got one myself. Good thing it didn't get ugly with the situation, I'd probably made the same assesment ...

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Thread: I Thought it was actually going down today and...DO NOT WAIT TO DRAW...

  1. #16
    kaz
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    I feel your pain on the focus, got one myself.

    Good thing it didn't get ugly with the situation, I'd probably made the same assesment you did about the cleaner looking guys being the more likely to be be in the right. Not sure I've participated though, maybe call the authorities? If they were security they probably were going to if they hadn't already.

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  3. #17
    Member Array monky's Avatar
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    About 5 months ago, I had this creepy feeling that I was being followed. I live in a nice area, not many problems. On the highway, this little 'riced out' honda was so close to me I could NOT see his headlights, only the occassional glimpse in my mirror.

    Anywho, I would change lanes and they would be right behind me.. turn for turn.. there were two males that I could make out in the car. Got stopped at a stop light and they pulled up beside me on the rear of my truck a good 2 car lengths behind the car stopped infront of them. I unholstered just in case.

    I did not go directly home, I made many many turns through random neighborhoods.. I got a little bit of distance on them and turned into a driveway cutting off my lights and used my park brake to stop, no brake lights. They drove past slowly, my truck was kind of hidden behind a hedge, not that easy to see.

    When I was sure they were gone, I went home. On the news that night was a description of a vehicle suspected of following people home and robbing them in their driveways...

    I never had a chance to get the liscense plate and it's probably a good thing for them that they were stupid and could not see where I went..

    I think about the situation, and have gone over what to do with my gf many many times.. I pray I never have to defend myself, or those that I love.

  4. #18
    Member Array packin45's Avatar
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    Well, I hate to be the one to say it, but getting yourself involved in the situation was asking for trouble, and in a few different ways.

    I don't know about your state, but one of the criteria for a justified self-defense shooting in MN is being an unwilling participant in the situation. What you did was a very bad idea, especially for a permit holder. Had I done something like that in MN, and had to drop the BG when he came back for a little retribution, I'd likely be sitting in jail right now.

    I mean, I could almost see jumping in if you saw some sort of crime being committed i.e. an assault, but it doesn't take much of an imagination to picture a prosecutor portraying you as some trigger-happy permit holder who thought he was a cop, and took the law into his own hands.

    I don't mean to be disrespectful here, and please don't take it personally. But had I been in that situation, I'd have slouched down in my seat and let 'em run on by.
    G17, G26

    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil...

  5. #19
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    I'm glad you didn't have to fire and everything worked out Okay for you.

    It could have either been two LEO or security chasing a thief or whatever. Or they could have been filming the next bumfights.

  6. #20
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    No, I would not get involved. For all you know, those were two yuppie jerks picking on a less-fortunate family man who went into the wrong bar.... unlikely, but still. I think while carrying a gun the #1 priority is avoiding a situation where you may have to actually use it. By getting into this situation, you've just done the exact opposite.

    I'm glad I read this forum daily, it gives me good forsight and thought about what NOT to do should I find myself in a myriad of different situations. Thanks for the thought food !

    Last edited by Captain Crunch; April 18th, 2008 at 12:33 AM. Reason: Deleted quoted post.

  7. #21
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    I don't think they were LEO or you would probably of heard multiple sirensfrom responding backup,more probably store security,but unless there is a uniformed officer needing help not a good idea to intervene,too many unknowns,But i can't get the image of a trailer being pulled by a focus being driven by a guy named cupcake outta my head,you are so lucky it didn't escalate into a news story "cupcake"
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  8. #22
    Member Array Balsac's Avatar
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    Could have gotten ugly. Thanks for sharing
    "Life is like a box of chocolate... You never know who you are going to shoot."

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  9. #23
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccman View Post
    Glad your ok. Is the focus Yellow ?.
    Sorry, it's white.


    Quote Originally Posted by monky View Post
    About 5 months ago, I had this creepy feeling that I was being followed. I live in a nice area, not many problems. On the highway, this little 'riced out' honda was so close to me I could NOT see his headlights, only the occassional glimpse in my mirror.

    Anywho, I would change lanes and they would be right behind me.. turn for turn.. there were two males that I could make out in the car. Got stopped at a stop light and they pulled up beside me on the rear of my truck a good 2 car lengths behind the car stopped infront of them. I unholstered just in case.

    I did not go directly home, I made many many turns through random neighborhoods.. I got a little bit of distance on them and turned into a driveway cutting off my lights and used my park brake to stop, no brake lights. They drove past slowly, my truck was kind of hidden behind a hedge, not that easy to see.

    When I was sure they were gone, I went home. On the news that night was a description of a vehicle suspected of following people home and robbing them in their driveways...

    I never had a chance to get the liscense plate and it's probably a good thing for them that they were stupid and could not see where I went..

    I think about the situation, and have gone over what to do with my gf many many times.. I pray I never have to defend myself, or those that I love.
    When being tailgated, I slow way down. I don't brake, just ease off the gas and slow down well below the speed limit (sometimes to 40mph on the freeway). If they are jerk tailgaters, they are in a hurry so they go around. If they stick around, I start to suspect more sinister intentions.
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this mini documentary!
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  10. #24
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    Myself, I would have stayed out of it. Too many things unknowns for me to put myself into it. Just because the 2 chasing were "clean cut" means nothing. Ted Bundy was "clean cut" and look how many women he raped and murdered.

    Although not likely, the 2 clean cut guys could have been members of organized crime, and the not so clean guy could have been undercover LEO. Your actions helped the 2 BG's catch him. You have just put yourself in a BIG world of crap.

    If the 2 guys chasing were store security, if MI is like most states, their authority ends once they leave store property.

    Stay alert, watch what is happening, call 911, but stay out of it.

  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by archer51 View Post
    Myself, I would have stayed out of it. Too many things unknowns for me to put myself into it. Just because the 2 chasing were "clean cut" means nothing. Ted Bundy was "clean cut" and look how many women he raped and murdered.

    Although not likely, the 2 clean cut guys could have been members of organized crime, and the not so clean guy could have been undercover LEO. Your actions helped the 2 BG's catch him. You have just put yourself in a BIG world of crap.

    If the 2 guys chasing were store security, if MI is like most states, their authority ends once they leave store property.

    Stay alert, watch what is happening, call 911, but stay out of it.

    Thats about the best advice so far in this thread
    "Just blame Sixto"

  12. #26
    Member Array NKMG19's Avatar
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    This kind of thread is why I come to this forum. Its hard to know how you would act in a given situation but by reading about other peoples encounters it helps when you find yourself in bad situations.

  13. #27
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    You can never tell from the way someone is dressed.

    Some of the Fedís Iíve worked with had long hair, and drove an old run down car, and dressed like they where in a 60ís biker movie.

    While the BGís I was investigating wore $1000 suits, clean shaven and had fancy diamond rings and Rolex watches.

  14. #28
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    I take no offense to criticism. I posted everything IIRC so we can pick it apart, for good or bad. I see that I did some things right, and some things wrong. I probably should've stayed out of it, but my I acted without the luxury of time to be rational.

    Even had I stayed out of it, that wouldn't change that they got turned around and the guy was approaching from my rear, lifting his shirt and grabbing at his waistband. This could have happened either way. I do think drawing and preparing was the way to go at that point. We'll never know for sure if he was going past anyway, or saw my gun and decided to continue.

    Apparently, I've thought enough about various threats that my action and plan was automatic (mental training). I knew what I was going to do. The decisions had been made long ago.

    Apparently I haven't given enough thought (mental training) to various scenarios that don't directly involve me and how to act. I had to decide at the moment, rather than months ago sitting at my computer.

    It's important to play out scenarios in your head, or in classes, in my opinion. That way you can make decisions when you have the luxury of time and clear thinking. Make decisions NOW, not when faced with crisis.


    For the record, I suppose my thread title is a bit misleading. At the moment, I never thought: "this is really going down." I actually was asking myself: "Is this really going down?" Don't take that to mean that I would've still been thinking about it when it was time. I was in autopilot, with just a small voice.
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  15. #29
    Member Array packin45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cupcake View Post
    Even had I stayed out of it, that wouldn't change that they got turned around and the guy was approaching from my rear, lifting his shirt and grabbing at his waistband. This could have happened either way. I do think drawing and preparing was the way to go at that point. We'll never know for sure if he was going past anyway, or saw my gun and decided to continue.
    I agree with that part of it 100%- my gun would have been out as well, especially if I were with my family. If you had been boxed in by traffic, hadn't honked the horn/tried to cut the guy off, and he had gone after you, I'm guessing it'd have been a lot closer to a good shoot. But with all the other traffic around, odds are slim that he would have singled out your car, if that was his intention.

    Last year I had a car come up from behind me at 1:30 in the morning flashing high beams while heading home (semi-rural long dark stretch of road). After about 7 minutes of this the road ends and I have to stop before making a left turn unto another road. No other vehicles in site.

    I slow to a stop about thirty feet from the intersection and pull my XD 9mm from it's Crossbreed home. The car behind me stops and the driver gets out of the car yelling and walking towards me. His passenger opens the door and steps out. I then moved my car about fifteen feet forward to make some distance between us and rolled the window down half way to hear what he had to say.
    Not to pick on you, but you would probably have gone to jail in MN, had this escalated to a shooting. Stopping/rolling down the window = willing participation.
    G17, G26

    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil...

  16. #30
    Member Array Tye_Defender's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by packin45 View Post
    I don't know about your state, but one of the criteria for a justified self-defense shooting in MN is being an unwilling participant in the situation. What you did was a very bad idea, especially for a permit holder. Had I done something like that in MN, and had to drop the BG when he came back for a little retribution, I'd likely be sitting in jail right now.
    All the more reason to shut up if you are involved in a shooting. Get a lawyer and let the lawyer do the talking for you.

    If the BG had a weapon and tried to do anything, Cupcake was an unwilling participant. I understand a prosecutor may try to twist it to something else, but that doesn't make it right.

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