I Thought it was actually going down today and...DO NOT WAIT TO DRAW... - Page 3

I Thought it was actually going down today and...DO NOT WAIT TO DRAW...

This is a discussion on I Thought it was actually going down today and...DO NOT WAIT TO DRAW... within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Glad everything worked out for you. Me, I would not have done anything other then call it in. Now me, I was out at a ...

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 57
  1. #31
    Member Array ChuglyXJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    79
    Glad everything worked out for you. Me, I would not have done anything other then call it in.

    Now me, I was out at a movie one night, to get home I have to go through the rough part of the city. The movie got out around 01:00 and the lot only had about 30 cars in it when we came out. Pulling out I had a few cars behind me, after a few turns I noticed a car holding close. A few more random turns and the car was still there. I unholstered and my wife freaked, one check in the mirror and she drew hers as well. As we made a few more turns and they followed we discussed what to do. The area we were in does have PD but it isn't a real quick response and I have no idea what most road names are just where I'm going. I decided that she should start to dial to call it in as I turn a 180* at the next intersection. As soon as we turned and eyed up the "kids" in the other car they bolted. It seamed as if it was just teens screwing around after a movie on a Friday night. Woke me up for the drive home. My wife now scans the mirrors when she rides not just when she drives.


  2. #32
    VIP Member
    Array Thumper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    7,289
    Your experience sure gets the brain cells moving!

    It gives us all a chance to do a "self systems check" and hopefully realize that although prepared, many times the best thing to do is to just be a good witness!
    ALWAYS carry! - NEVER tell!

    "A superior Operator is best defined as someone who uses his superior
    judgement to keep himself out of situations that would require a display of his
    superior skills."

  3. #33
    Member Array packin45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    In limbo
    Posts
    388
    Quote Originally Posted by Tye_Defender View Post
    All the more reason to shut up if you are involved in a shooting. Get a lawyer and let the lawyer do the talking for you.
    +1

    If the BG had a weapon and tried to do anything, Cupcake was an unwilling participant. I understand a prosecutor may try to twist it to something else, but that doesn't make it right.
    "Right" and "legal" aren't always the same thing. If I were to walk out to my car on my way to work, and stumble upon a woman getting the crap beat out of her and raped by some dirtbag in the parking lot, MN law requires me to retreat to a safe distance and be a good witness; I could not legally intervene with my gun.

    I'm sorry, but playing cop while carrying is going to get you into a world of trouble, and that's all there is to it.
    G17, G26

    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil...

  4. #34
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    3,164
    Quote Originally Posted by packin45 View Post
    +1
    If I were to walk out to my car on my way to work, and stumble upon a woman getting the crap beat out of her and raped by some dirtbag in the parking lot, MN law requires me to retreat to a safe distance and be a good witness; I could not legally intervene with my gun.
    Really? MN law has no provision for the defense of others? Even in MI, when we had the duty to retreat (we don't anymore), we could defend another persons' life if they had no ability to retreat.

    While my first actions may have been not the brightest move, I don't believe that it makes me a "willing combatant" by any means. Here in MI, we have the right to stand our ground and meet force with force. If someone was stealing hubcaps and and the owner went out to yell at the thief, the owner is not a willing combatant if the thief produces a weapon.
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this mini documentary!
    Then check out my blog! www.BodyByMcDonalds.com

    Cupcake - 100 pound loser, adventurer, Ironman Triathlete.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Array Slim_45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Denver, NC
    Posts
    1,046
    But i can't get the image of a trailer being pulled by a focus being driven by a guy named cupcake outta my head
    Me either

    Ok on a more serious note i personally would not have evolved myself in that situation (not to say i would not help out in a situation that clearly need helping) but there were too many variables with that one.
    But the 2nd part when you saw him in mirror coming back & looking as if to be grabbing at something, Good eye i would have got ready to go also.........
    Kimber Eclipse Target 2
    Glock 19 (3rd Gen)
    DiamondBack DB9
    Kahr PM9 (wife's edc)
    NRA Life Member

  6. #36
    Member Array packin45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    In limbo
    Posts
    388
    Quote Originally Posted by Cupcake View Post
    Really? MN law has no provision for the defense of others? Even in MI, when we had the duty to retreat (we don't anymore), we could defend another persons' life if they had no ability to retreat.

    While my first actions may have been not the brightest move, I don't believe that it makes me a "willing combatant" by any means. Here in MI, we have the right to stand our ground and meet force with force. If someone was stealing hubcaps and and the owner went out to yell at the thief, the owner is not a willing combatant if the thief produces a weapon.

    Yeah, we still have the duty to retreat when we're not in our homes, and we can't intervene on someone else's behalf with our legally carried weapon.

    Your laws are apparently MUCH better than some of what we have on the books at the moment. We have been trying to get things changed for quite some time now, but our Castle Doctrine just hasn't quite made it through yet (the anti-gun crowd have nicknamed it the "shoot first bill"....how typical).
    G17, G26

    Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil...

  7. #37
    Senior Member Array Rotorflyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Among the living
    Posts
    773
    Quote Originally Posted by packin45 View Post
    We have been trying to get things changed for quite some time now, but our Castle Doctrine just hasn't quite made it through yet (the anti-gun crowd have nicknamed it the "shoot first bill"....how typical).
    The anti's call it that every time it comes up for vote, no matter what state it's in and while MN may not be the best state for ccw, it's far from one of the worst (and I'm not even counting the couple that don't allow it at all)


    As for cupcake's original post, Personally I'd like to think I wouldn't have gotten involved in this case, as I have seen "clean-cut" guys chasing "skeevy" looking types and the "clean-cuts" weren't the innocent parties in the situation and would've rather been a good witness to the situation if necessary. However it's easy for us to sit behind our monitors and "arm chair quarterback" the situation, but the truth is none of us really know what we'd do until the situation actually happens to us and we do it.

    CC-glad everything turned out ok for you and next time be sure and get a picture of the tow rig!
    When Guns Are Outlawed, Only Outlaws will have guns

    Just remember, When seconds count help is mere minutes away

    Also remember, When you go to trial by jury you are putting yourself into the hands of 12 people who weren't smart enough to get out of jury duty.

  8. #38
    Member Array firestarplus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    western south dakota
    Posts
    167
    Thanks cupcake for your willingness to take some heat by giving your honest story and assessment. Your story really got me thinking (no easy task I might add). Overall I think you did pretty well. Getting involved was probably not the best move, but I cant honestly say that I wouldnt have done the same thing, as reactions and hunches are a part of life. I know that if I came upon a dirtbag beating and raping a women, regardless of where it was going on, I WOULD get involved. Morals override stupid laws everytime or more directly for me, God's law trumps mans law without exception! Here it comes...

  9. #39
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    3,164
    Bummer on MN law.

    No problem on takin some heat. I'm not too wrapped up in what other people think. (except maybe the ladies...)

    I didn't view myself (still don't) as acting like a cop wanna be. I could've stopped him for sure by opening my door and standing up. It never occurred to me to get out and wrassle him, or even worse: draw down and try to help arrest him. It was more of a "stick your foot out and trip him" technique, with in theory minimal involvement. Still, involvment none-the-less.
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this mini documentary!
    Then check out my blog! www.BodyByMcDonalds.com

    Cupcake - 100 pound loser, adventurer, Ironman Triathlete.

  10. #40
    Senior Member Array Vaquero 45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    882
    If nothing else Cupcake, I bet that this incident brings into sharp focus the difference between a P3AT and a real fighting pistol for you! Thank God you had the XD indeed!
    Slow is smooth.....smooth is fast.

  11. #41
    Member Array kpaul's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    MN
    Posts
    33
    Quote Originally Posted by Cupcake View Post
    Really? MN law has no provision for the defense of others? Even in MI, when we had the duty to retreat (we don't anymore), we could defend another persons' life if they had no ability to retreat.

    While my first actions may have been not the brightest move, I don't believe that it makes me a "willing combatant" by any means. Here in MI, we have the right to stand our ground and meet force with force. If someone was stealing hubcaps and and the owner went out to yell at the thief, the owner is not a willing combatant if the thief produces a weapon.

    FYI on MN law
    609.065 Justifiable taking of life.

    The intentional taking of the life of another is not authorized by section 609.06, except when necessary in resisting or preventing an offense which the actor reasonably believes exposes the actor or another to great bodily harm or death, or preventing the commission of a felony in the actor's place of abode.
    K.Paul
    Semper Fi

  12. #42
    Distinguished Member Array T Bone's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Metropolitan Detroit
    Posts
    1,995
    Cupcake, thanks for sharing the story and your actions with us whether we agree or disagree. Can be a learning experience for all, and I think that's of benefit to everyone.

    While I agree with many about staying neutral (you saw no crime or incident, just a 2 on 1 foot chase, with no viable indicator of who was in the right or wrong), I do think you were correct to prepare for aggressive action against yourself as the parties (all of them) approached from either direction.

    My only criticism there is that not only did you focus on the Chasee as the bad guy, you did not concentrate on the others and their possible aggression towards you as they passed. At least you didn't write it that way.

    Now a question or two if you don't mind.
    so I pull my shirt up to uncover my gun (Right IWB) and ghetto-tuck it behind the holster
    *** is ghetto tucked? And why behind the holster? Do you get a better/quicker draw that way? (I guess I could see maybe slipping the weapon under my leg or even in my lap at this point- I suppose the idea is to make it more accessible).

    What city were you in? (as you can see, we're in the same State, though it really doesn't matter).

    Not very likely the BG would have chosen the jack a Focus pulling a trailer. Possible, but not likely.

    Just so you know, I'm an over weight, aging, bearded guy with a ponytail (usually dressed in jeans and t-shirts). If you happen to see a couple of guys in suits chasing me, it is likely they are some type of bad guy. But it's unlikely to go down that way. I can't run that fast/far anymore, and I generally do go armed
    Regards, T Bone.


    "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety". Benjamin Franklin

  13. #43
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    3,164
    Quote Originally Posted by T Bone View Post
    ssed. At least you didn't write it that way.

    Now a question or two if you don't mind.
    *** is ghetto tucked? And why behind the holster? Do you get a better/quicker draw that way? (I guess I could see maybe slipping the weapon under my leg or even in my lap at this point- I suppose the idea is to make it more accessible).
    The "Ghetto Tuck" is when my cover garment/coat is pulled out of the way to expose the gun in it's holster. It makes the draw WAY quicker compared to having to lift the shirt, which may be stuck under or behind me. For me, it just works to tuck the shirt between the holster and my body. A good technique for when you have a raised alert level in a seated position, but do not yet feel justified in drawing. When the alert level went higher, I did as you said and put the pistol in my lap. I probably wouldn't ever put it under my leg. I don't see tat as faster than drawing from an exposed holster, and something unpredictable could happen and cause the gun to not be where you need it. The holster is very secure (and I'm free to move).

    Oh yeah, I was in Pontiac.
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this mini documentary!
    Then check out my blog! www.BodyByMcDonalds.com

    Cupcake - 100 pound loser, adventurer, Ironman Triathlete.

  14. #44
    Member Array realitycramp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    St. Louis, MO
    Posts
    157
    Just read this. Joined after the thread had fallen off the list. Glad I did, learned quite a bit. Been considering attaching a small holster to the sides of the seats in my vehicles for this reason. Primarily pocket carry but I have ordered a few diff holsters to try other methods.
    Facts are negotiable, perceptions are not.

  15. #45
    Senior Member Array rmarkob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    535
    Quote Originally Posted by kpw View Post
    Pulling a trailer with a Ford Focus. Thanks for that mental image!
    I'm still trying to picture the chasee choosing THAT rig to carjack!
    Clinging to guns and God in PA...

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. I had to draw on someone today
    By TN_Mike in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 225
    Last Post: June 5th, 2012, 01:41 PM
  2. Never thought of this before. You go to draw and bystanders chastise you!
    By paramedic70002 in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: October 21st, 2010, 04:56 PM
  3. Thought I was going to have to draw today...
    By straightshooter in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 57
    Last Post: April 3rd, 2009, 08:41 AM
  4. Active duty military to wait til 60 to draw retirement?
    By phaed in forum Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: February 7th, 2008, 12:48 PM
  5. Thought I'd have to draw tonight
    By jeep45238 in forum Carry & Defensive Scenarios
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: October 1st, 2007, 02:23 AM

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!

» DefensiveCarry Sponsors