I just learned something

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Thread: I just learned something

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    I just learned something

    I was reading on Wikipedia that Switzerland does allow concealed carry among its citizens.

    Gun politics in Switzerland - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    To carry firearms in public or outdoors (and for an individual who is a member of the militia carrying a firearm other than his Army-issue personal weapons off-duty), a person must have a Waffentragschein (weapon carrying permit), which in most cases is issued only to private citizens working in occupations such as security though some cantons issue the permits very liberally.[citation needed]

    [edit] Conditions for getting a Carrying Permit
    There are three conditions:

    fulfilling the conditions for a buying permit (see section below)
    stating plausibly the need to carry firearms to protect oneself, other people, or real property from a specified danger
    passing an examination proving both weapon handling skills and knowledge regarding lawful use of the weapon
    The carrying permit remains valid for a term of five years (unless otherwise surrendered or revoked), and applies only to the type of firearm for which the permit was issued. Additional constraints may be invoked to modify any specific permit. Neither hunters nor game wardens require a carrying permit
    Any thoughts on this?

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    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    It would be interesting to know how many they actually give out. But it is does not reflect well on the USA when Switzerland gives them out and people in Calif cannot get them.
    Anyone know how many apply vs how many they issue, assuming the applications are valid to begin with? That would be real interesting to see if they discourage it or just issue them.
    I noticed that it says specified danger, probably meaning something has occurred where you need or think you need a gun. I.e. has anyone threatened you etc. Hard to tell if they give them out or try not to.
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    IIRC Switzerland also has mandatory military duty for citizens, and when they are in thier version of the reserves, their service weapon goes home with them.
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    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    I'm sure it could be something worth looking in to. I'm not sure how they are on issuing. I'm assuming its a "may issue" status, but that could vary from a New Jersey style may issue or an Iowa style may issue I might do a little research on the subject to found out how easy it is, or isn't.

  6. #5
    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    Pretty interesting. I don't know why but I guess because we always think of Switzerland as being the epitome of a peaceful place and it would be the very last place on Earth that I would even remotely associate with firearms.

    Would you let us know what you find out, if you do decide to research it?
    Last edited by JD; May 14th, 2008 at 09:26 AM.
    Surrounded and outnumbered, Marine Col Lewis Puller: "Good! We finally got 'em where we want 'em!" (Korea, 1950)
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    Senior Member Array PaulJ's Avatar
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    Switzerland has a very different "gun culture". The permits mentioned above are rarely issued. In order to obtain it, you have to mention a plausible danger. Just "crime in general" doesn't count. But then again, Switzerland is a bit like the US in that different regions (they call them Kantons) have very different rules.

    Now about military duty: There is a mandatory draft in Switzerland. Every male has to serve in the army (about a year I think). After completing the service, you are part of the reserve and you take your military rifle home with you, along with a can of ammunition. I am not sure if they still do it, but the ammunition comes in a sealed tin can. The idea is that Switzerland due to its size has essentially no mobilization time. Using these weapons his highly illegal outside of regular training events (I think its a month each year or something like that).

    Given that the ammunition comes in sealed tins, it is easy to detect tampering.

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    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    Thank you. That is kind of what I thought when I mentioned the "specified danger" in their provision. But it is still kind of amazing that they even have it at all. In the popular imagination, Switzerland would never be connected with the word "firearm", by me at least. Thanks for the information.
    Surrounded and outnumbered, Marine Col Lewis Puller: "Good! We finally got 'em where we want 'em!" (Korea, 1950)
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    Right is Wrong and Wrong is Right.
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    Socrates : "Knowledge is knowing that we know nothing".

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    Senior Member Array PaulJ's Avatar
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    just found a bit more details: You have to actually buy the gun. For the rifle its 100 Franks (not sure about the exchange rate, but its probably about 1:1). For the handgun its 30 Franks. About 7-8 % of reservists are authorized for the handgun. Almost all of them (95-97%) buy them. Only 30% buy the rifle.

    Couple other rules I found:
    - hollow points are only legal if used to hunt.
    - you need two permits. One to buy a gun, and one to carry it.

  10. #9
    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    Still, though, we would not be surprised if Switzerland banned all guns except for the militia. The way we think of it, again, as the most peaceful country on earth.
    Surrounded and outnumbered, Marine Col Lewis Puller: "Good! We finally got 'em where we want 'em!" (Korea, 1950)
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcb188 View Post
    Still, though, we would not be surprised if Switzerland banned all guns except for the militia. The way we think of it, again, as the most peaceful country on earth.
    It might be thought of as the most peaceful country on earth because it always declares neutrality in wars. However for a lot of the last millennium, the Swiss mercenaries were some of the most feared in all of Europe. There is a reason the Vatican still uses them.
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  12. #11
    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    Good Point and Semper Fi------------
    Surrounded and outnumbered, Marine Col Lewis Puller: "Good! We finally got 'em where we want 'em!" (Korea, 1950)
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    Right is Wrong and Wrong is Right.
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    Socrates : "Knowledge is knowing that we know nothing".

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    Well, I can't say I know much about the swiss, but I do like the idea of mandatory military service. I think Israel has it down pretty good, 2 year mandatory service. I think it would make folks a bit more patriotic and teach them just how good we have it here.

    Tom

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    Senior Member Array dcb188's Avatar
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    I am all for it, too. Western Civilization has done it for centuries. Greeks etc
    Surrounded and outnumbered, Marine Col Lewis Puller: "Good! We finally got 'em where we want 'em!" (Korea, 1950)
    __________________________________
    Right is Wrong and Wrong is Right.
    __________________________________
    Socrates : "Knowledge is knowing that we know nothing".

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