This is a discussion on I had to go to the Post Office today...(Merged) within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by David in FL No no no no nooooo...... I don't do test cases! +1 Not by design, in any case. The personal ...
I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL.
I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.
Veni, Vidi, Velcro
I was always under the impression carrying in the post office is off-limits. What don't know is are folders? I carry a defensive folder on both sides,and when checking my po box I leave those,and the carry peice in the car. I hate it.
I do feel naked without my firearm, if nothing else more for the fact I'm used to carrying it and don't like not having it. Having just gone down to see my brothers law school graduation, I had to leave my firearm at home for the entire north carilina trip. I have resiprosity, but it would have required another night at the hotel room because I am not allowed to have it on the school campus. Main thing I hated was having to stop at the rest areas and being unarmed
Reminds me of the old racer's adage: A $5 helmet protects a $5 head. In other words, tossin' the baby out with the bath water (saving a few bucks) might not be the best choice, if being prepared is the goal.
Post office carry...Mmmmmm
"That I cannot do."
"Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks."
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
Read the entirety of 18 USC 930 here (most pertinent parts IMNSHO are Bolded by me):
US CODE: Title 18,930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities
Also worth noting, the USC requires that the posting be on every outside public entrance.TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 930.
Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities
(a) Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous weapon in a Federal facility (other than a Federal court facility), or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 1 year, or both.
(b) Whoever, with intent that a firearm or other dangerous weapon be used in the commission of a crime, knowingly possesses or causes to be present such firearm or dangerous weapon in a Federal facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.
(c) A person who kills any person in the course of a violation of subsection (a) or (b), or in the course of an attack on a Federal facility involving the use of a firearm or other dangerous weapon, or attempts or conspires to do such an act, shall be punished as provided in sections 1111, 1112, 1113, and 1117.
(d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to—
(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer, agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of law;
(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such possession is authorized by law; or
(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.
(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm in a Federal court facility, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to conduct which is described in paragraph (1) or (2) of subsection (d).
(f) Nothing in this section limits the power of a court of the United States to punish for contempt or to promulgate rules or orders regulating, restricting, or prohibiting the possession of weapons within any building housing such court or any of its proceedings, or upon any grounds appurtenant to such building.
(g) As used in this section:
(1) The term “Federal facility” means a building or part thereof owned or leased by the Federal Government, where Federal employees are regularly present for the purpose of performing their official duties.
(2) The term “dangerous weapon” means a weapon, device, instrument, material, or substance, animate or inanimate, that is used for, or is readily capable of, causing death or serious bodily injury, except that such term does not include a pocket knife with a blade of less than 21/2 inches in length.
(3) The term “Federal court facility” means the courtroom, judges’ chambers, witness rooms, jury deliberation rooms, attorney conference rooms, prisoner holding cells, offices of the court clerks, the United States attorney, and the United States marshal, probation and parole offices, and adjoining corridors of any court of the United States.
(h) Notice of the provisions of subsections (a) and (b) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal facility, and notice of subsection (e) shall be posted conspicuously at each public entrance to each Federal court facility, and no person shall be convicted of an offense under subsection (a) or (e) with respect to a Federal facility if such notice is not so posted at such facility, unless such person had actual notice of subsection (a) or (e), as the case may be.
I've NEVER seen any such posting on an outside door, only on bulletin boards/walls well inside the Post Office.
The USC specifically states that it is only enforceable if posted at the entrances . . . after all if you don't warn people first, the theory is that you can't prosecute them for violating a law that they aren't advised about. [May not be true in reality, but that seems to be what is stated above in the USC.]
Last edited by JD; May 14th, 2008 at 10:18 AM.
Take it off, leave it in the truck, do my business, put it back on, and go about my business. Not really a big deal.
When you’re wounded and left on Afghanistan’s plains,
And the women come out to cut up what remains,
Just roll to your rifle and blow out your brains,
And go to your God like a soldier.
I'm pretty new to firearms, but I've realized that a lot of people think carrying a gun around is like having a magic talisman that protects them from oblivion, and treat it as such. I hope I never get to that point.
Keep emotionally active. Cater to your favorite neurosis.
I don't carry in the post office i leave my gun in the jeep for the short time i'm gone and reholster after leaving,something about federal buildings make me leery about packing in them,posted or not and my memory isn't good enough to remember where i legally can and cannot carry other than the main ones i guess i can look up post offices in texas to see if they are nono's
"Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
--Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .
What's more, many states (not all) forbid cc in any place forbidden by federal law. The fact that a USPO didn't post the required signage doesn't mean that the prohibition isn't valid. In such a state, you'd also be in violation of state law, no matter your interpretation of the federal posting requirement.
Again with the test case......and I'm still not going there. Lots of battles I'm willing to fight, but this isn't one of them. I'd be thrilled if someone else took that one on though and won it for us all!