SD Shooting out of state??

This is a discussion on SD Shooting out of state?? within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I plan on going to New Mexico for my honeymoon in February. Now that NM has reciprosity with Ohio I'm considering taking my BHP with ...

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Thread: SD Shooting out of state??

  1. #1
    Member Array HiWayMan's Avatar
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    SD Shooting out of state??

    I plan on going to New Mexico for my honeymoon in February. Now that NM has reciprosity with Ohio I'm considering taking my BHP with me on the trip. What would happen if I was involved in a SD shooting while there? Is the legal process sped up because I'm from out of state or do I get to become a semi-permanent resident of a NM jail cell? I've often wondered about this and this seems like as fine a time as any to ask.

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    I don't know, but I would think that the circumstances would be the determinant here. I would think that if it looked clear cut justifiable self defense, you're going to get a chance to tell your story to the judge or state attorney. Many will not risk a sure loss in court these days of rampant crime where jurors will surely put themselves in your place and acquit thus causing a black eye to the DA's office at election time.....but the bottom line to me at least, is, to carry and make sure you do things right. LIKE SEE TROUBLE ON THE HORIZON and avoid it!
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  4. #3
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    Probably would depend on circumstances, location and local LE/ DA office. Better to have to go to court or stay in jail temporarily than visit the morgue.

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    The others have said it pretty much.

    Certainly - carry - but know the extant laws in your temporary state to the letter. Beyond which stay the heck outa any trouble and if trouble should find you - save your butt, then worry about what follows.
    Chris - P95
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    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
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    Member Array FrontSight's Avatar
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    Check out www.packing.org for the laws pertaining to self defence in that state
    Pershing SIR!!

  7. #6
    Senior Member Array AirForceShooter's Avatar
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    sped up?
    you're in the system same as anybody else.
    Take a number and wait your turn.

    AFS
    Gun control is hitting what you aim at

  8. #7
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    Hey AFC - bad day? Seems a rather disingenuous comment!
    Chris - P95
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    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Hey AFC - bad day? Seems a rather disingenuous comment!

    I am sure he was not suggesting he get actual prefential treatment.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  10. #9
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    Hey AFS - bad day? Seems a rather disingenuous comment!

    I am sure he was not suggesting he get actual prefential treatment.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  11. #10
    Member Array Erich's Avatar
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    First of all, congrats on your marriage - you've chosen a great place to honeymoon. But then a man who carries a Hi-Power has already demonstrated his good sense.

    I'm a NM criminal defense attorney, so I feel I can answer your question about the process here.

    First of all, though, I want to caution you to be sure to be aware of and observe NM's carry laws. For instance, permit or not, if you carry anywhere they sell alcohol, it's a felony.

    The legal process would NOT be speeded up for you should - Heaven forbid - you become involved in a self-defense shooting here. This happened to a graduate student from Purdue University about 15 years ago, and it took him years to get out of jail. This is the same situation as everywhere in the country, as far as I know.

    Feel free to email me if you have any specific Qs about NM (the laws, where to stay, where to eat) or to get my phone number to keep in your wallet in case you run into an emergency. (I'm not chasing ambulances here - I work for the state so I can't represent you. I just thought it might be nice to have someone you know in the state for all sorts of emergencies that might arise.)

    Have a good trip!

  12. #11
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    Erich - good timing! Nothing like advice from the guy on the spot.
    This happened to a graduate student from Purdue University about 15 years ago, and it took him years to get out of jail.
    Curiosity question Erich - what kept him jailed so long?
    Chris - P95
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    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  13. #12
    Member Array Erich's Avatar
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    Basically, he got hometowned. Out-of-towner kills local boy, things don't go well for him.

    The jury instructions given in his case were flawed, and he actually got convicted of manslaughter. Eventually got reversed on appeal, but what a waste of a chunk of his life.

    Here are the facts of the case from the opinion:

    "[Defendant], a college student from Purdue University in Indiana, came to Taos, New Mexico in July of 1991 to attend a photography class. On the evening of July 15, [Defendant] and two other students went out to look for a fourth student who had been gone for what seemed an unduly long time. They came upon a gathering of local residents who were drinking around a bonfire near a bar. The group around the bonfire told the students to leave and directed hostilities at them which were possibly racially or ethnically motivated. Though it is unclear who provoked the violence, [Defendant] and one of his fellow students were chased more than 100 feet, tackled, and beaten by at least three and possibly as many as five of the local residents. The residents would not let them leave and shouted racial epithets. The fight ended when [Defendant] pulled out a gun and shot and killed Paul Vigil, one of his assailants.

    [Defendant] made a statement to investigating officers shortly after the incident in which he admitted to the killing, claiming he shot only to make the residents stop beating him and his friend. The next day a criminal information charging second degree murder, voluntary manslaughter, and unlawfully carrying of a deadly weapon was filed in Taos magistrate court. Trial commenced on January 13, 1992. At the close of the evidence, [Defendant] objected to certain jury instructions and offered other instructions which were refused. The jury found [Defendant] guilty of voluntary manslaughter with a firearm and unlawfully carrying a deadly weapon."

    The NM Supreme Court "reverse[d] the Defendant's conviction for voluntary manslaughter and remand[ed] for a new trial on that charge [with a new jury instruction]. Defendant's conviction for unlawfully carrying a deadly weapon [was] affirmed."

  14. #13
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    Thx Erich - a bad result that was - considering being beaten up with those odds could even be lethal in itself. I guess, leaving aside the firearm aspect - the students should have vamoosed immediately even if it meant losing face.

    Certainly if carrying, loss of face is infinitely preferable to getting involved in a beating, and worse.

    Not trying to make you write loads more - I appreciate you getting back on this - but what would (might) your professional opinion have been, based on evidence available?
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  15. #14
    Member Array Erich's Avatar
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    Gee, that case went through my office before I came here, so I really don't know _what_ happened. I just can't say at all whether that defendant did anything that I would not have done - I just don't know what happened.

    I can certainly say that when I teach the law part of CCW classes, I try to impress on the students that if their guns go off, they may well have to sell their houses in order to clear up the legal fallout. Or worse. I tell the story of a couple of a former client (with the permission of my former client, of course) who suffered through the legal system for a couple of years after doing a completely justified citizen's arrest - he was actually convicted of felony Aggravated Assault with a Deadly Weapon as a result, but I got the conviction reversed on appeal (again, the judge wouldn't give the jury instruction that he should have given). Despite the fact that he was cleared and went on to become a police officer, the whole situation really messed his life up for a long time. Asked about it now, he tells me to tell my students that he would recommend that someone in a similar situation just plain not get involved, because it was not worth the horrible toll it took on his life.

    Here're some lessons we can take from the case I discussed in my post above. 1) There's really no reason to be around someone who's been drinking and who's boisterous. 2) If you're carrying a gun, you'd better realize that anytime you use it there are _very likely_ to be profound consequences regarding your liberty and property. 3) Accordingly, you need to try to distance yourself from situations that could go wrong.

    Of course, there is no way to guarantee that you'll always be safe from bad situations that might lead to a righteous shooting that might lead to a prosecution and/or your financial ruin. If you can't face that fact, don't carry a gun.

    And stay in the house. The world is a bad place sometimes.

  16. #15
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    Again Erich - my thanks for your trouble in responding. I for one greatly appreciate professional opinion.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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