August 30th, 2008 03:58 PM
Shooting legal Fees
Since this seems to always be a hot topic, does anyone have specific knowledge of someone being involved in a justified shooting going through the entire event with no legal fees, regardless of what the State says your civil liability is?
It seems a lot of folks say that if your State states your are not liable for injuries to someone committing a crime, then you have zero worries in a shooting. Since the State of Ohio just changed that law, I am of the belief that regardless what Ohio says, I will incur legal fees to prove that I fall under the State law. Not being a lawyer, I ultimately have no idea, just wondered if anyone had more than a personal opinion.
August 30th, 2008 05:28 PM
good question, im curious as well
when I leave this Earth, It's gonna be on both feet; NEVER KNEES IN THE DIRT
August 30th, 2008 05:32 PM
Maybe no criminal charges, BUT there is always the possible civil suit brought against you by the person you shot or their family. As I understand it the Supreme court said the state does not have the authority to deprive someone their day in court.
August 30th, 2008 06:04 PM
A person who lawfully uses deadly force is immune from criminal prosecution and civil action, unless the person against whom deadly force was used is a law enforcement officer acting in the performance of his official duties and he identifies himself in accordance with applicable law or the person using deadly force knows or reasonably should have known the person is a law enforcement officer.
August 30th, 2008 06:25 PM
Again, Ohio says the same thing, want to know of anyone who applied it at zero cost to themselves.
Originally Posted by gdog
Example: I have always been taught:
1: Shoot someone in a defensive situation
2: Tell the Police you understand their need for a statement from you, but you need to see a lawyer first.
3: I am not aware of free lawyers.
August 30th, 2008 06:38 PM
there are no free lawyers.
if you have any assests (such as a house or even a car) you will not be able to get a public defender.
If you want the zero dollar approach, you better have one IRONCLAD case, like an escaped pedophile and killer just hijacked a busload of nuns and orphans - because you'll be representing yourself in criminal proceedings. Hiring a lawyer is really the sane approach.
Civil proceedings - well some states cap amounts for wrongful death. If you are civilly liable, Maine has a $100k cap on it. So, worst case, no lawyer and you just write the $100k check.... Note that typically there are no caps on "impaired function", so someone with a limp or in a wheelchair forever could be millions....
August 30th, 2008 06:59 PM
True. If I were involved in a shooting, I would want the best legal counsel I could find. There is going to be a considerable expense. I don't have a California CCW, but if I were to shoot someone in self-defense in my home, I was told that a defense attorney could be in the tens of thousands. This is not a Castle Doctrine or Stand Your Ground state so anything can happen in court. Here, the criminals have more rights than the victims do. On top of that, they can sue you.
Originally Posted by Shizzlemah
My move is imminent, but years away. I can't wait to get out of here.
"[A]rms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. . . Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them."
- Thomas Paine, Thoughts On Defensive War, 1775
August 30th, 2008 07:25 PM
Let me turn it around: let's see some examples of law-abiding citizens who legitimately used a firearm for self-defense who then lost huge amounts of money on related civil cases.
How often does it happen?
August 30th, 2008 08:16 PM
I'm game for either angle. Just need someone with true experience, not just all us Internet lawyers.
Originally Posted by bae
Last edited by Scott; August 31st, 2008 at 12:42 PM.
Reason: removed profanity work around.
August 30th, 2008 09:24 PM
This is yet another thing that will (or should) go through your mind before you even present your weapon... "Do I have the money for a lawyer?"
Keep emotionally active. Cater to your favorite neurosis.
August 30th, 2008 09:26 PM
While I suspect that lawyer fees would be high, and a lawyer probably necessary, I would also like to have some actual cases.
We often get spooked by the "what ifs" and "smart lawyers."
Personally I am not concerned about it, because if I do use my gun it will be because I have good reason to believe I am in danger of death or great bodily harm. I will worry about the lawyers and cost after I live through the encounter.
But I have seen figures that it might cost you $50,000 by the time it is over.
August 30th, 2008 09:39 PM
The shooting has to be justified or lawfull based upon whatever the legal standard may be in the particular state in order for the "Castle Doctrine" to immunize you from criminal and civil liability,and that is where the problem can arise.
Originally Posted by philman
If the local prosecutor decides, for whatever reason(remember the Duke University lacrosse fiasco),that the shooting was not justified and decides to indict, then you are goingtowant competent legal representation which is going to be very costly.
It is a serious mistake to assume that because the shooting was seemingly lawful that you are off the hook. Prosecutors may act against you for reasons that have little or nothing to do with the merits of the shooting(again see the Duke case).
Last edited by Scott; August 31st, 2008 at 12:43 PM.
Reason: removed quoted profanity workaround
"It does not do to leave a dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him."
J. R. R. Tolkien
August 30th, 2008 11:04 PM
Perhaps so but the state can limit the amount of the reward in a legitimate shooting.
Originally Posted by sass20485
August 30th, 2008 11:26 PM
1 assailant dead.
1 wounded (5 to 15 in the state pen).
5 months of legal worries.
Civil case throw out. Castle Doctrine.
$12,000 in legal fees to local lawyer and hunting pal.
California & New York lawyers probably a hell of a lot more expensive.
"Let us speak courteously, deal fairly, and keep ourselves armed and ready." --Teddy Roosevelt
August 31st, 2008 10:25 AM
Here is one where it appears that the CCW holder had no costs other then some time to explain what happened to authorities:
Victims Released; No Charges Filed Against Reno Man In Winnemucca Shootings / Northern Nevada, Reno, Lake Tahoe, News Now, Live Streaming Darren Mack Trial
Victims Released; No Charges Filed Against Reno Man In Winnemucca Shootings Save Email Print
Posted: 5:54 PM May 25, 2008
Last Updated: 6:42 AM May 27, 2008
A | A | A Two people injured during a shootout at a Winnemucca bar that left three others dead have been released from the hospital.
Police say a 22-year-old woman and a 34-year-old man were released from the hospital Monday.
Authorities continue to investigate the shootings that they believe may have been sparked by a simmering feud between several local families.
Winnemucca Police Chief Bob Davidson says the violence erupted around 2:30 A.M. Sunday when a man entered the crowded Players Bar and Grill. He fatally shot two brothers, 20-year-old Jose Torres and his 19-year-old brother, Margarito. The shooter was later identified as 30 year old Ernesto Villagomez. All three were from Winnemucca.
According to witnesses, Villagomez at some point stopped to reload his high-capacity handgun and began shooting again when he was shot and killed by another patron - a 48-year-old Reno man who had a valid concealed weapons permit.
The Reno man was initially taken into custody as a person of interest, but later released after Humboldt County District Attorney Russell Smith determined the shooting was justifiable homicide.
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