A Rude Pro 2nd Amendment Supporter Harassed My Daughter

A Rude Pro 2nd Amendment Supporter Harassed My Daughter

This is a discussion on A Rude Pro 2nd Amendment Supporter Harassed My Daughter within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- My 26 year old daughter had an unpleasant experience with a rude pro gun guy and his wife yesterday in the store where she ...

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Thread: A Rude Pro 2nd Amendment Supporter Harassed My Daughter

  1. #1
    Member Array waynesan's Avatar
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    A Rude Pro 2nd Amendment Supporter Harassed My Daughter

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    My 26 year old daughter had an unpleasant experience with a rude pro gun guy and his wife yesterday in the store where she works and I thought I would relate to this board what went down and get your opinions on what transpired and your thoughts on what happened.

    My daughter works in a regionally successful eyewear company with stores throughout the midwest including Tennessee. She is a sales person who helps customers pick out frames and get their glasses and contacts made. She works for commission and her time is valuable.
    Yesterday Mr. and Mrs. X came into the store. Upon entering, they passed by an obvious sign that states "No Guns or Weapons Allowed on These Premises." ( Not a legally enforcable sign per Tenn. statute but that's not germane to what happens later.)

    Upon entering, my daughter asks Mr.& Mrs. X if she could help them. They said yes and proceeded with the normal routine of purchasing two pairs of glasses. My daughter spent over an hour helping them with their purchase.

    Upon completing all the details of the purchase they all proceeded to the register where the transaction would be finalized and the bill was totaled to about $800.00. At this point Mr. X asks my daughter why her store does not support 2nd Amendment rights. (Let me say at this point that my daughter is about as unpolitical as one can be. She has absolutely no interest in politics and no interest in guns or 2nd Amendment issues and has no opinion, one way or another, on what the laws or store rules should be). When asked the question by Mr. X, she asked him what he meant. He said "that sign on the door says no guns are allowed in this store." My daughter, being taken a little off guard by the question, jokingly said "well there are a lot of thugs that come in here and we don't want them bringing their guns in." (I know, bad answer if it was one of us, but coming from her in this situation I understand her saying it).

    At this point Mrs. X speaks up and says "I don't think your Dad would buy anything from this store if he knew their anti 2nd Amendment policy."

    (I am only vaguely familiar with these people. Mr.X and I were involved in a minor fender bender about 30 years ago where no one was charged and no hard feelings. Our paths have crossed occasionally over the years and we have never spoke more than to say "hi, how's it going" or some such greeting. I guess if you are into firearms like I am, word gets out around the community.)

    My daughter then explained to the X's that the manager is who they should talk to but he was off yesterday. They thought for a minute and then said they would go home and think about it and decide if they could purchase from that store, since they don't support 2Amdndment rights, and they would let her know. Then turned and walked out.

    Needless to say, when my girl swung by my house to tell me about this she was really upset. She came in to where I was at and half jokingly asked me, "What's the matter with you gun people?" (She likes to jab at me when she can and she took this opportunity to dig it in.) These people had taken over an hour of her time - after seeing the sign that upset them so much - and kept her from helping other customers for which she could have been earning a commission. She is a struggling Mom and every penny is important to her. She doesn't make the store rules. Now she, along with all the others who work at that store have a very negative opinion of those pro 2nd Amendment folks. And I think, by implication, the rest of us as well.

    I think it is important to pick our battles wisely. But to pick a battle with a lowly store clerk over the policies of a multi-state eyewear conglomerate does not sound like prudent battle picking to me.

    What do you all think of the actions of Mr. & Mrs X?
    Did they do a good job of defending 2nd Amendment rights?
    Would you do the same as they did?
    Raising children is like being pecked to death by a chicken every day.


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array HKinNY's Avatar
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    I think Mr and Mrs x are tirekickers. (A Tirekicker is somebody who walks around a car dealership( or eyeglass store) and tries out diffrent vehicles(or frames) without intentions of buying something or they buy something less than they were looking at. (Going in for a Mercedes and leaving with a Pinto)

    I do not think that a defending 2A rights just busting chops
    Next time your daughter may want to whister something about the sign size or Corporate policy states that the store must have the sign but a expert markman like yourself should worry about dealing with a little sign like that.

  3. #3
    Member Array RevDerb's Avatar
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    I agree that Mr. & Mrs. X should have made their decision whether or not they were going to do business with the establishment at the onset of their shopping rather than wasting your daughter's time. On the other hand, I worked as a commission salesman for over 30 yrs and prospective customers wasting a salesperson's time comes with the territory. Now... if they return and make the $800 purchase, how will she feel about the time spent? Not every minute spent with a shopper is going to make $ but every conversation allows us an opportunity to make someone appreciate us. I hope that she winds up getting the sale in the end. I also hope that if they return when she is off, she will get credit for it.
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    VIP Member Array David in FL's Avatar
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    I think that if this story were not about the daughter of a forum member, most of us would have applauded the customer who ultimately decided to walk away from an establishment that does not support his right to carry.

    Other than deciding to take their business elsewhere, it sounds as if the customers were polite and well behaved. I certainly wouldn't characterize them as rude. Hopefully, your daughter will relate the incident to management and they'll realize that their policy lost at least one $800 sale. Additionally, your daughter may have learned that by working for a company that discriminates against a fairly large segment of the population, she may be limiting her own earning potential as well. That could be a valuable lesson too.

    My .02
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in a grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."

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    Distinguished Member Array bandit383's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David in FL View Post
    Additionally, your daughter may have learned that by working for a company that discriminates against a fairly large segment of the population, she may be limiting her own earning potential as well. That could be a valuable lesson too.

    My .02
    I respectfully do not agree that we are a "fairly large segment of the population". Actually, I believe we are the minority...one of the reasons why it is an uphill education battle. Regardless...I think the buyers had an axe to grind and should of taken their views to the managers...at the beginning. She was just following store policy. I agree with the OP...

    Rick

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    Member Array dang.45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bandit383 View Post
    I respectfully do not agree that we are a "fairly large segment of the population". Actually, I believe we are the minority...one of the reasons why it is an uphill education battle. Regardless...I think the buyers had an axe to grind and should of taken their views to the managers...at the beginning. She was just following store policy. I agree with the OP...

    Rick
    It depends on your definition of "large". Permit holders are certainly not a "large segment" if you consider percentage of the total population. However, the stats I've read have shown us to be something more than 1% of the population (but certainly less than 2%). This means, in a country with a total population of just over 300,000,000, there should be somewhere around 4,000,000 total permit holders. I don't care whether the percentage is large, 4 million people with a vested interest in not shopping in posted stores is definitely a large segment in my book...
    "It is only as retaliation that force may be used and only against the man who starts its use. No, I do not share his evil or sink to his concept of morality: I merely grant him his choice, destruction, the only destruction he had a right to choose: his own." - John Galt, from Atlas Shrugged

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    Senior Member Array boscobeans's Avatar
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    ""most of us would have applauded the customer who ultimately decided to walk away from an establishment that does not support his right to carry.""

    If you don't like the chain's policy, DON'T TAKE IT OUT ON THE SERVICE PEOPLE. Just don't shop there.. Give the manager a "NO GUNS=NO MONEY" card and stop being a PIA.


    Sad to say but after about 40 years in a pharmacy I know how she feels. There are people in all walks of life, all colors and creeds that have a chip on their shoulder and a stick up their backside. They are just miserable people and no matter what the issue is, they will usually take it out on the person or persons who have nothing to do with store policy (and are usually the people who are trying to do their jobs to the best of their ability.)

    It is a shame that people like that will also be the ones who write or call and complain about the service they received. On the other hand, few people who have been treated with care and consideration will ever take the time to give praise or credit for the excellent service they were given.

    I praise your daughter for not telling them off. I can't tell you how many times I almost lost it and told a few of these [Edited] off.

    Bosco
    Last edited by Captain Crunch; September 2nd, 2008 at 01:29 PM. Reason: Deleted a language workaround.

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    VIP Member Array David in FL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bandit383 View Post
    I respectfully do not agree that we are a "fairly large segment of the population". Actually, I believe we are the minority...one of the reasons why it is an uphill education battle. Regardless...I think the buyers had an axe to grind and should of taken their views to the managers...at the beginning. She was just following store policy. I agree with the OP...

    Rick
    Note, I didn't say majority, I said large segment.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in a grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."

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    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    I personally would not of went thru the procedure to buy a pair of glasses if I was that offended by the sign,in TX the sign wording etc. has to be specific or no good.I think these people were bullies trying to make a point,and would of come off as being more appropriate by just handing out a no gun/no cash card or speaking with the owner/manager and explaining their views if the owner tells them he knows the sign is unenforceable it's aimed at targeting people carrying illegally then point out those people don't care about laws they won't care about his little sign.I think there are more appropriate ways to promote defensive carrying,nobody likes having something crammed down their throat.
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  10. #10
    Distinguished Member Array bandit383's Avatar
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    1-2% is large??...not in my math world...one reason places like Disney or eye glass stores and such do not feel threatened by the loss of revenue

    Rick

  11. #11
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by waynesan View Post
    Now she, along with all the others who work at that store have a very negative opinion of those pro 2nd Amendment folks. And I think, by implication, the rest of us as well.
    Which tells me that your daughter and the others, IMO, have not thought about this beyond the direct impact on their income.

    "What is it about you gun people?" That, right there, tells me the thinking isn't very deep, at this point.

    When a drop in sales occurs at a store, the owners of the store are generally at a complete and utter loss to explain its cause. When someone directly indicates the reason that $800 isn't being spent and all future business is lost, then it's crystal clear (at least for that customer's reasoning). Agreed, that probably a better method would be a NoGuns=NoCash card or speaking directly/only with the manager.

    It brings home the reality, doesn't it? The power that a customer has is in one place: the wallet. "Rude," hm? Sounds like a perfectly up-front and reasonable exchange, on a subject (implied threat of loss of future business) that wouldn't be taken well.

    Anyway. It is what it is. Someone's putting his money where his mouth is. He states the reasoning. He's lambasted for it. Wouldn't matter if he'd seen gross mistreatment of another customer by an associate, or something else. Rude? I call it wise purchasing.
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    Just because someone is pro 2A doesn't mean

    Quote Originally Posted by waynesan View Post
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    My 26 year old daughter had an unpleasant experience with a rude pro gun guy and his wife yesterday in the store where she works and I thought I would relate to this board what went down and get your opinions on what transpired and your thoughts on what happened.

    (Story deleted for brevity)

    What do you all think of the actions of Mr. & Mrs X?
    Did they do a good job of defending 2nd Amendment rights?
    Would you do the same as they did?
    Just because someone is pro 2A does not mean they are wise, smart, cordial, endearing, decent, or anything else. These folks deliberately stole an hour from your daughter to make a political point. They indeed should have spoken to the manager--before playing this game! Or else, gone somewhere else where there is no sign. Or completed the sale and talked to the manager later. They came in to cause trouble, and there is a name for people like that--"trouble makers."

    The manager, now that he knows his sign is not in the correct form has a choice. He can take the dang thing down and serve all customers or he can put up a legal sign--for all the good that will do as far as protecting him from thugs.

    Meanwhile, that couple was out of line and a poor example of humanity.

    I honor those signs if not the silly owners who put them up.

    On a variety of issues regarding store policies, don't harass the poor working stiff behind the counter. S/he didn't make the rules, can't change them, and can't do anything about them.

    They should have gone to the store manager, owner, or if necessary to corporate headquarters.

    (There may also be an element of stalking going on here if indeed you barely know these people, as they deliberately chose to cause trouble in a place where your daughter works. Some folks carry grudges forever. Even from a fender bender.)

  13. #13
    Member Array Erik's Avatar
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    Yep, trouble makers. There's a fine line between making points and making enemies, and it sounds like these folks haven't learned the difference.
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    Member Array Swamp Fox's Avatar
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    Well I made a comment on hear a while ago about a paint store that had a posting but wasn't a "legal" posting. Someone from this forum suggested that I make a $5,000 order and then renig because of the sign. That was the most ludicrous idea I ever heard and I think is what Mr & Mrs. X had up their sleeve all along. If the sign isn't legal, ignore it! Discuss it with the management or just don't shop there to begin with. The sign was at the entrance, no?

    We need to choose our battles. Sometimes battles can be won at the cost of the war. Think about the daughter's remark: "What's with you gun people?" Secondly, why take the battle to those who are not equipped to negotiate/defend. It is just plain dumb and really ticks me off!
    Last edited by Swamp Fox; September 2nd, 2008 at 10:46 AM. Reason: spelling

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    VIP Member Array Kerbouchard's Avatar
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    In certain circumstances, I have been known to do the same thing before. Waste as much time as possible and make sure the purchase gets totaled up, and then change my mind and tell them why.

    I figure the money that they see they lost because of their stance makes a much bigger impact than the money they never see they lost because I didn't enter the store in the first place.

    And sometimes it works...sometimes the signs come down.
    There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil.

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