This is a discussion on Roadside Euthanasia within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; This is kind of a silly concern but it's happened to me twice, three times technically, and only because I'm such a wiener.
At certain ...
January 2nd, 2006 11:39 AM
This is kind of a silly concern but it's happened to me twice, three times technically, and only because I'm such a wiener.
At certain times of the year especially, we get deer on the highway, and an awful lot of them get splatted.
Most of the time, even if the damage to the car is pretty bad, the deer is killed quite handedly. It's dead before its corpse hits the pavement.
But sometimes it's just a glancing blow, or someone was fast enough to swerve or put the brakes on, and it just knocks the deer out momentarily. I know because I have done this myself.
Of course the problem is the deer inevitably has one or more broken legs. That is a leisurely and cruel death sentence.
I'm not the KFCruelty.com guy, and I regard deer as little more than the rats of the forest and am glad they are hunted down for their meat, antlers, and skin before they can become worse pests, but they do feel pain. They should be put down clean as possible. I too would wish for a swift death vs. a prolonged one and I extend them that same courtesy.
I've euthanised three deer. The first was when I was 17. This was the only time I hit the deer. I tried to swerve to miss it but I glanced it, breaking both its hind legs. I had no gun handy being a minor, so I had to kill it by hand and it was grisly. It tried to get away on its front legs. It was pathetic and I actually felt lousy as it scraped itself along the ground while I dug around in my trunk looking for anything better than a knife for the job. But I did it and got the heck out of there before anyone could see or ask any questions.
The next two, I didn't hit, but saw on the side of the road in the middle of nowhere. The first one was laying on the ground and as I drove by it, I realize it wasn't dead. The second one had a broken leg and I actually saw it trying to leap to safety, and of course it couldn't. In both cases I made sure the coast was clear, shot them in the head with a pistol, and ran.
This presents a dilemma. On the one hand, it is cruel not to do this. But on the other hand, it's very much illegal to do it.
I don't think the deputies are going to come arrest me all these months after the fact or anything silly like that, but I'm afraid I may get caught doing it one day and get in all sorts of trouble with an overzealous game warden.
Ever had this problem?
January 2nd, 2006 11:55 AM
This is one of those "legal vs moral" issues that drives me crazy too, Euc. I would put a suffering animal out of it's misery first, and then worry about it later.
I doubt if a Game Warden would be offended either....he (and I) would have much less respect for someone who had the tool at hand to do something about the animal's condition, and just decided to walk away.
If legal problems ever came up from this situation, however, be sure to ask for a trial by jury
"I surrounded 'em"- Alvin York
"They're ain't many troubles that a man can't fix with seven hundred dollars and a thirty ought six"- Jeff Cooper
January 2nd, 2006 12:58 PM
It is very much ''rock and hard place'' - and I too would not choose to leave an animal suffering.
Depends quite a bit on the location as to how easy or difficult the act might be. If on or near a significant route then all too easy to be seen - then what - ''man with gun'' get's called in? Perhaps.
Also, is the noise element if near any houses - going to cause any problems.
I expect Euc is referring to cases out in middle of nowhere - more likely there than here but even here, plenty of instances where remote would make things a lot easier to deal with.
If at all possible, I will do the right thing - put an end to suffering.
Chris - P95
NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.
"To own a gun and assume that you are armed
is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."
- a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.
January 2nd, 2006 01:28 PM
I've taken care of a couple deer by the road. I call 911 let them know there was a deer hit at my location (state law), if they could send a deputy to come and dispatch the deer. If they let it be known it will be a while, as it is not a priority call, I let them know I have a firearm on me and ask the dispatcher if I can shoot the deer, as not to waste the deputies time. They usually tell me I can and I do it and leave the dispatcher my name, address, and phone number. I wait until the deer had died and then go on about my business.
Common law states you can dispatch a deer or other hit animal if you get permission from the authorities, with no legal trouble from the DNR about not having a license or discharging a firearm in a certain area or a certain distance from the roadway's center.
I personally have more respect for animals than "rats of the forest".
It is better to have a double tap to the head than be eaten alive by a pack of coyotes.
07/02 FFL/SOT since 2006
Probably the only home based FFL that doesn't do transfers.
January 2nd, 2006 01:28 PM
Ive alwyas wondered at this ..
For example i tag a deer on 75 minor damage to the ride but deer is now a hazzard to other drivers if i get out and Shoot it what will happen ?
Would some overzelous cop arrest me i mean yes im talking major highway where this is more likely to happen to us what do ya think?
January 2nd, 2006 01:59 PM
Calling authorities is ideal if you can... the trouble is when you're out in the middle of nowhere and there's no cell, that isn't viable.
When one of your friend's girlfriends is killed when a deer goes through her windshield, you'll change your opinion.
Originally Posted by freakshow10mm
They are numerous, and they are everywhere. They are pests and public hazards. Deer have a place in the natural order of things, but like all natural resources must be carefully managed.
January 2nd, 2006 02:56 PM
I live in a rural area but drive to a larger city for work. Last fall I came on a doe that had been hit with 2 broken legs. This was about a mile from my farm. I put it down with my CCW pistol. I know just about all the deputies and the conservation officer, they would not have objected to the quick death of the injured animal. I am not so sure what I would do in the large city, which has more than its fair share of auto/deer collisions. Probably call the local police and let them take care of it, unless it was a definate safety hazzard.
January 2nd, 2006 03:38 PM
I am in a rural area in Upper Michigan.
Put the animal down, inform the authorities, leave only a gut pile.
Venison, it's whats for dinner.
NRA Life Member
"All That Later"
January 2nd, 2006 03:40 PM
Sorry you had someone you knnow killed by a deer. I also respect them more than considering em vermin. They are apart of nature. Mans displacing them does have concequences.
Originally Posted by Euclidean
In MI it would depend on who the LE was , whether you would be in trouble or not , shooting a injured deer. I hate to see em suffer needlessly.
January 2nd, 2006 03:55 PM
Good point. End the suffering and salvage some meat out of it.
Originally Posted by Brian45
January 2nd, 2006 05:12 PM
Yes, vermin indeed. They are "animals that at a particular time and place compete (as for food) with humans or domestic animals."
Of course that can be a difficult concept for a "citified" generation raised on Bambi reruns and all that anthromorphism. Growing up in rural Washington I learned early on that deer are just large fur bearing varmits. To be sure they're beautiful and I've taken my share of pictures and spent many hours stalking, watching and enjoying the sight.
However, that appreciation of creation is tempered by having spent many winter weekends pruning our small family foodplot orchard that the deer would strip in clean in the fall. I dare say goats can't do the damage deer can -- they'll strip an orchard as high as they could stand on their hind legs. Then in summer we would plant, hoe and otherwise tend to rows of green beans only to have the deer ravage and nearly destroy the crop. Not to mention the various other vegatables, melons, pumpkins and squash deer would sample or step in on the way to the bean poles.
Yessir, vermin indeed. That's no disrespect -- just not the sugar coated citified sweet notion of anthropormorphic Bambi.
From Merriam Webster online:
Main Entry: ver·min
Inflected Form(s): plural vermin
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French vermin, vermine, from Old French, from vern worm, from Latin vermis
1 a : small common harmful or objectionable animals (as lice or fleas) that are difficult to control b : birds and mammals that prey on game c : animals that at a particular time and place compete (as for food) with humans or domestic animals
cheers and Happy New Year,
January 2nd, 2006 05:12 PM
I don't have as much of a problem with putting one down, I just do it. I do get mad about how legally I'm not allowed to take the meat if it's salvagable. I know a ton of migrants who could use even 20 or 30 pounds of meat and it would mean the difference between a meal and starving but I'm supposed to let the deer rot or get cleaned up by coyotes.
<Yep that's really me rounding up a herd
January 2nd, 2006 05:46 PM
As an avid deer hunter, I too deeply respect the deer and realize they need to be managed so they don't eat everything out of house and home (as well as crash into cars). That being said, I cringe whenever I see a deer hit by an auto and left alive by the roadside. I was working in a rural area in western NY about 10 years ago (before I carried) and found a deer in bad shape, but very much alive and suffering in a roadside ditch. I did not have a cell phone at the time so I drove to a nearby farm to ask the farmer to go over and shoot the deer. I drove by the next morning and the deer was still alive!
Man, was I mad! I vowed that if this happened again in an area where I couldn't be garanteed to have a LEO come and dispatch it quickly...I would!
January 2nd, 2006 06:11 PM
Mother Nature Rides A Pale Horse.
It's a lucky creature that gets spared a cruel or agonizing death.
"When it comes to having a central nervous system, and the ability to feel pain, hunger, and thirst, a rat is a pig is a dog is a boy."
January 2nd, 2006 07:50 PM
I seriously doubt that. I would not "blame" a deer for being the cause of a loved one's death. I wouldn't really blame anyone (anything) but the cause of death would not be placed on the deer, but the driver.
Originally Posted by Euclidean
Sounds more like you are talking about man....
Originally Posted by Euclidean
Coimhéad fearg fhear na foighde; Beware the anger of a patient man.
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