Firefighters Carrying Concealed!

This is a discussion on Firefighters Carrying Concealed! within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Ok lets get started, Im a volunteer Fireman/EMT. Question is that I carry everywhere and when we have a call I take the G27 out ...

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Thread: Firefighters Carrying Concealed!

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    New Member Array jreid's Avatar
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    Firefighters Carrying Concealed!

    Ok lets get started,

    Im a volunteer Fireman/EMT. Question is that I carry everywhere and when we have a call I take the G27 out and lock it in the truck. I know thats crazy and all but really I dont know what the law would be if I were to run a call and one of the patients or family members have a fit and pull out their gun or rifle,shotgun or whatever. I want to be legaly prepared if this occured. What Im askin is would this be a justified self defense in and on another propery owners if a situation like this occured. Why I ask is I done a search here on Firefighters and seen some awful things done to FF. And for dang sure I dont want to be a victim of a situation like that. My fire department doesnt have anything in our SOG or rules about carrying. The Chief just told me not to bring it in the building. I have 15 years in the fire service and like to keep the peace at the firehouse. But the thing is they dont have any sign anywhere that says no guns so really im between a rock and a hard place on carrying in the building. I have already checked handgunlaws and have read the NC Gun laws and see nothing at all pretaining to this situation. Any feedback will be great on these situations. I know that this is my first post but I have read and read and still seem not to be able to find any answers.

    James

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  3. #2
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    Is the firehouse private property? If not then you don't have to leave it outside. Just because the chief doesn't like it doesn't mean you can't carry in there. To me it sounds like you've done your homework and it also sounds like a good idea to carry on-the-job.
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
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    Member Array stlouiseman's Avatar
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    I don't have any advice, I just want to say that I support your decision to carry on the job. Here in St. Louis, a FF was shot and killed while responding to a call. Unfortunately for him he didn't see it coming ( the lunatic was sniping at them). Regardless, you should have the right to carry. Thanks for your service.

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    New Member Array jreid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sigmanluke View Post
    Is the firehouse private property? If not then you don't have to leave it outside. Just because the chief doesn't like it doesn't mean you can't carry in there. To me it sounds like you've done your homework and it also sounds like a good idea to carry on-the-job.
    Its tax payers in the district property. The tax payers pay for it so its not private property.

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    VIP Member Array miklcolt45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jreid View Post
    Ok lets get started,

    Im a volunteer Fireman/EMT. Question is that I carry everywhere and when we have a call I take the G27 out and lock it in the truck. I know thats crazy and all but really I dont know what the law would be if I were to run a call and one of the patients or family members have a fit and pull out their gun or rifle,shotgun or whatever. I want to be legaly prepared if this occured. What Im askin is would this be a justified self defense in and on another propery owners if a situation like this occured. Why I ask is I done a search here on Firefighters and seen some awful things done to FF. And for dang sure I dont want to be a victim of a situation like that. My fire department doesnt have anything in our SOG or rules about carrying. The Chief just told me not to bring it in the building. I have 15 years in the fire service and like to keep the peace at the firehouse. But the thing is they dont have any sign anywhere that says no guns so really im between a rock and a hard place on carrying in the building. I have already checked handgunlaws and have read the NC Gun laws and see nothing at all pretaining to this situation. Any feedback will be great on these situations. I know that this is my first post but I have read and read and still seem not to be able to find any answers.

    James
    As a volunteer FF, the question becomes, how much do you like what you do? Can your Chief 'fire' you if you don't follow his rules?
    Or, make it too uncomfortable to keep returning if you violate what he has told you to do.

    If it is not against the law of your state, no problem there.

    Finally, 'concealed is concealed.' If you can keep it out of people's sight, how likely is it that you would ever be discovered unless the SHTF? Then, would you care if you were fired if it saved your life?
    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliott

    The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it.
    Albert Einstein

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    Then you shouldn't have any problems. Keep it concealed and he shouldn't know, if he does find out, there isn'tanything he can do anyway.

    GO FOR IT!
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
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    Member Array drh2687's Avatar
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    As a former volunteer firefighter in NC, my biggest concern was having my weapon in a situation where it would be just about guaranteed to do more harm than good... Anytime turnout gear is involved the bulge at my side would just be one more thing to hang up on, any kind of structure fire or confined space becomes an issue (falling on weapon, heated chuck of metal on my hip, bullets and fire probably not the best combo), or rescue situations requiring a rappel harness.

    I suppose you could just leave it in the truck (as you do now) based on a screening of the calls when you expect a weapon might be problematic, but I don't imagine there any legal issues to cause you concern.
    --Dave


    "Mr. Bobby, there's no smoking in here."
    "It's alright darlin, I'm a volunteer fireman."

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    New Member Array jreid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by miklcolt45 View Post
    As a volunteer FF, the question becomes, how much do you like what you do? Can your Chief 'fire' you if you don't follow his rules?
    Or, make it too uncomfortable to keep returning if you violate what he has told you to do.

    If it is not against the law of your state, no problem there.

    Finally, 'concealed is concealed.' If you can keep it out of people's sight, how likely is it that you would ever be discovered unless the SHTF? Then, would you care if you were fired if it saved your life?
    I Volunteer and partime paid there. So yes he can fire me but i really dont give a crap if he fires me for that but then again he can dismiss me from paid and volunteer which i have 15 years and hate to have that taken from me since I have 5 more years till I am eligable get the retirement money after 20 years. But the main thing is carrying on the calls and if I have to use it where would that stand in the court of law? Thats the big one?

    Quote Originally Posted by drh2687 View Post
    As a former volunteer firefighter in NC, my biggest concern was having my weapon in a situation where it would be just about guaranteed to do more harm than good... Anytime turnout gear is involved the bulge at my side would just be one more thing to hang up on, any kind of structure fire or confined space becomes an issue (falling on weapon, heated chuck of metal on my hip, bullets and fire probably not the best combo), or rescue situations requiring a rappel harness.

    I suppose you could just leave it in the truck (as you do now) based on a screening of the calls when you expect a weapon might be problematic, but I don't imagine there any legal issues to cause you concern.
    I def would not have it on me going into a structure fire.But just the eveyday medical calls and so forth.

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    If you aren't breaking any laws by carrying, then you should be able to defend yourself if the need arises. If they attack you to the point that you feel the need to defend yourself with you gun then it (IMHO) doesn't matter that you're in their house. It's still self defense.

    Even less likely to have problems only carrying on the non fire calls.
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
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    New Member Array rudy1066's Avatar
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    RE: Firefighters Carring Concealed

    We've actually lost two good firefighters here the St. Louis area. The first, mentioned above, was shot by a mentally ill person who set fire to his house and truck in order to snipe the responders. I'm not sure how helpful carrying concealed in that situation would have been, since both police and fire were on scene when the mad man began to shoot.

    The second firefighter was driving home when he stopped to help what looked like a motorist in distress--it was some punk trying to break into the car. The firefighter was in uniform, complete with badge. From the reports that came out later, it seems the scumbag saw the badge, thought the firefighter was a cop, and shot, though it is impossible to know for sure--the bad guy isn't around anymore to answer questions, courtesy of the St. Louis Police Department. I do not know if having a concealed firearm could have saved this man's life--but it may have given him a chance.

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    The department that I volunteer with at home has a policy that firearms can not go on runs.** Carry around the firehouse is not a big deal, and a large part of the population carries on a regular basis. I haven't been able to be as active as I would like, but I'm told that the general rule of thumb is to not go digging into people's shoes on the fireground (you might not be expecting what you find).

    *The owner of the shop that I deal with on a regular basis was an active member of the same fire department for many years. The no carry on runs rules happened after his pistol apparently fell out of it's holster in front of a patient and family...
    Firefighter / EMT - Always Ready. Ever Willing.

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    Member Array Spike32's Avatar
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    If your Chief doesn't have a problem with carrying, then do it. Just make sure it is concealed. Best of luck and stay safe.
    You'll rock, with a 357 Glock

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    wpk
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    I'm a full-time firefighter and the word has been laid down that we will NOT be armed while on duty. No firearms allowed in the stations either. The station is considered city property and we are city employees and that is the end of that as far as carry is concerned. I'm not risking my career to carry while on duty, my weapn stays locked in the car safe. The memorandum from the city even states we cannot have our weapons in the parking lots, but screw that...it's my own private vehicle at least and none of the brass needs to know.
    "America is a nation of laws; poorly written and randomly enforced." -Frank Zappa

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    New Member Array jreid's Avatar
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    Thanks for everyones input and all but just to chime in. To me I feel when Im running calls voluntary them I feel that as long as its concealed then I can carry it on calls even in the patients residents. I understand that I shouldnt be carrying it while on the clock. I have fig out what I need to do is get in touch with the Fire Dept lawyer and ask him on that. Also I need to call the Sherriffs office adn see what they have to say.

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    GPS
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    I think I found the best answer to the situation. Our department was considered a political subdivision of the State/Parish. I became an arson investigator and was commissioned through the Sheriff's office as a reserve LEO. The Chief and Asst. Chief got commissioned too and both of them had served with the police reserve. End of gun toting problem and we managed to get some scumbag arsonists put away too. After I left the department, a new chief took over that did not like guns and apparently doesn't like his guys doing detective work. So, shortly thereafter all of the commissioned arson investigators had their guns taken away. I see them every now and then, and they are still griping about it.
    Cordially,
    GPS

    Visit U.S. Concealed Carry - The Ultimate Resource for the Armed Citizen http://www.usconcealedcarry.com/inde...ffID=GStrecker

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