City of Louisville Ordinance and signage

City of Louisville Ordinance and signage

This is a discussion on City of Louisville Ordinance and signage within the Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I am new to the area and went into the louisville science museum downtown. I went back outside to search for a restaurant and then ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array Durhamgoat's Avatar
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    City of Louisville Ordinance and signage

    I am new to the area and went into the louisville science museum downtown. I went back outside to search for a restaurant and then on the way back in noticed a small sign left of the entrance doors that said: Concealed deadly weapons prohibited by Louisville city ordinance and there was a picture of a handgun with a red circle and slash through it. Several questions come to mind.
    This is not the only entrance to the exhibit and the others are not marked. I thought that there was some requirement for marking properly.
    Is this some sort of prohibition against bad guys who read or does it apply to valid ccw holders?
    Thoughts are appreciated, if I go back I would like to know.
    Assault is a type of behavior, not a type of hardware.

    How can you praise freedom, and condemn that which gains and preserves it?


  2. #2
    Distinguished Member Array Diddle's Avatar
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    Someone else mentioned signs going up in Louisville that were not previously. I have noticed Louisville more accommodating to the gun owner than Lexington, however.

    There are several on here in Jefferson / Bullet counties. I look forward to their posts on this.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Durhamgoat View Post
    I am new to the area and went into the louisville science museum downtown. I went back outside to search for a restaurant and then on the way back in noticed a small sign left of the entrance doors that said: Concealed deadly weapons prohibited by Louisville city ordinance and there was a picture of a handgun with a red circle and slash through it. Several questions come to mind.
    This is not the only entrance to the exhibit and the others are not marked. I thought that there was some requirement for marking properly.
    Is this some sort of prohibition against bad guys who read or does it apply to valid ccw holders?
    Thoughts are appreciated, if I go back I would like to know.
    You would have to read the city ordinance as well as state law. Does KY state gun laws preempt city ordinances? Also does the ordinance have an exception for licensed CHP holders?
    As to the posting, again it is going to be determined by state law, I would assume, but I could be wrong, that all entrances would need to be posted, otherwise how can they insure people are aware of the ordinance.
    I would hope that you researched state laws before you started carrying a weapon there. Do you have a KY permit, or one issued by a state KY has reciprocity with? In either case it is your responsibility to know the laws of the state your carrying in.
    Last edited by archer51; March 15th, 2009 at 01:26 PM. Reason: added thought

  4. #4
    Member Array fireman836's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Durhamgoat View Post
    I am new to the area and went into the Louisville science museum downtown. I went back outside to search for a restaurant and then on the way back in noticed a small sign left of the entrance doors that said: Concealed deadly weapons prohibited by Louisville city ordinance and there was a picture of a handgun with a red circle and slash through it. Several questions come to mind.
    This is not the only entrance to the exhibit and the others are not marked. I thought that there was some requirement for marking properly.
    Is this some sort of prohibition against bad guys who read or does it apply to valid ccw holders?
    Thoughts are appreciated, if I go back I would like to know.
    See handgunlaw.us
    State Preemption
    65.870 Local Firearms Control Ordinances Prohibited.
    No City, County, Urban-County Government may occupy any part of the field of regulations of the transfer,
    ownership, possession, carrying, or transportation of firearms, ammunition or components of firearms or
    combinations thereof.
    Effective: July 13, 1984
    History: Created 1984 Ky. Acts ch. 42, sec 1, effective July 13, 1984
    Under preemption local city ordinance would be invalid.

    Is the Louisville Science Museum public or private property. If private property Owner can make it a criminal safe zone.

  5. #5
    Member Array Durhamgoat's Avatar
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    I don't know if it is public or private property. I hold a valid California permit and currently legally reside in California so KY has reciprocity.
    Assault is a type of behavior, not a type of hardware.

    How can you praise freedom, and condemn that which gains and preserves it?

  6. #6
    Member Array JimH58's Avatar
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    I located the KRS regarding this.

    "Except as provided in KRS 527.020, the legislative body of a state, city, county, or urban-county government may, by statute, administrative regulation, or ordinance, prohibit or limit the carrying of concealed deadly weapons by licensees in that portion of a building owned, leased, or controlled by that unit of government."
    According to the KRS the city does have the right to limit or prohibit CCW. You would need to know specifically what the city ordinance says but the state has given them the power to do so.
    JimH
    Kentucky
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  7. #7
    Member Array sigpack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Durhamgoat View Post
    I don't know if it is public or private property. I hold a valid California permit and currently legally reside in California so KY has reciprocity.
    Welcome to Kentucky. Reciprocity? I thought that meant, well, reciprocity? So we recognize your permits but they don't recognize ours. How is that reciprocity?

    The Science Center is owned by the city so they have the right to ban firearms. Government entities can only supersede state law on property owned by that entity.

  8. #8
    Distinguished Member Array Pro2A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Durhamgoat View Post
    I am new to the area and went into the louisville science museum downtown. I went back outside to search for a restaurant and then on the way back in noticed a small sign left of the entrance doors that said: Concealed deadly weapons prohibited by Louisville city ordinance and there was a picture of a handgun with a red circle and slash through it. Several questions come to mind.
    This is not the only entrance to the exhibit and the others are not marked. I thought that there was some requirement for marking properly.
    Is this some sort of prohibition against bad guys who read or does it apply to valid ccw holders?
    Thoughts are appreciated, if I go back I would like to know.

    I would imagine since KY has a very strong pre-emption law the sign is not legal. I would disregard it, but thats just me.

    Unless the place you described is off limits by KY law, I doubt a DA would try to enforce it. Much like Philly has tried to do here in PA.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Array Gary Slider's Avatar
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    I don't see in KY statutes anywhere that gives cities or counties the right to ban firearms. Here is 527.020 and I can't find anywhere in the law that says they can. If someone could please point to something I have missed Handgunlaw.us would be most appreciative.

    Page 1 of 3
    527.020 Carrying concealed deadly weapon.
    (1) A person is guilty of carrying a concealed weapon when he or she carries concealed a firearm or other deadly weapon on or about his or her person.
    (2) Peace officers and certified court security officers, when necessary for their protection in the discharge of their official duties; United States mail carriers when actually engaged in their duties; and agents and messengers of express companies, when necessary for their protection in the discharge of their official duties, may carry concealed weapons on or about their person.
    (3) Policemen directly employed by state, county, city, or urban-county governments may carry concealed deadly weapons on or about their person at all times within the Commonwealth of Kentucky, when expressly authorized to do so by the government employing the officer.
    (4) Persons, except those specified in subsection (5) of this section, licensed to carry a concealed deadly weapon pursuant to KRS 237.110 may carry a firearm or other concealed deadly weapon on or about their persons at all times within the Commonwealth of Kentucky, if the firearm or concealed deadly weapon is carried in conformity with the requirements of that section. Unless otherwise specifically provided by the Kentucky Revised Statutes or applicable federal law, no criminal penalty shall attach to carrying a concealed firearm or other deadly weapon with a permit at any location at which an unconcealed firearm or other deadly weapon may be constitutionally carried. No person or organization, public or private, shall prohibit a person licensed to carry a concealed deadly weapon from possessing a firearm, ammunition, or both, or other deadly weapon in his or her vehicle in compliance with the provisions of KRS 237.110 and 237.115. Any attempt by a person or organization, public or private, to violate the provisions of this subsection may be the subject of an action for appropriate relief or for damages in a Circuit Court or District Court of competent jurisdiction.
    (5) (a) The following persons, if they hold a license to carry a concealed deadly weapon pursuant to KRS 237.110, may carry a firearm or other concealed deadly weapon on or about their persons at all times and at all locations within the Commonwealth of Kentucky, without any limitation other than as provided in this subsection:
    1. A Commonwealth's attorney or assistant Commonwealth's attorney;
    2. A county attorney or assistant county attorney;
    3. A justice or judge of the Court of Justice; and
    4. A retired or senior status justice or judge of the Court of Justice.
    (b) The provisions of this subsection shall not authorize a person specified in this subsection to carry a concealed deadly weapon in a detention facility as defined in KRS 520.010 or on the premises of a detention facility without the permission of the warden, jailer, or other person in charge of the facility, or the permission of a person authorized by the warden, jailer, or other person in charge of the detention facility to give such permission. As used in this section, "detention facility" does not include courtrooms, facilities, or other
    Page 2 of 3
    premises used by the Court of Justice or administered by the Administrative Office of the Courts.
    (c) A person specified in this section who is issued a concealed deadly weapon license shall be issued a license which bears on its face the statement that it is valid at all locations within the Commonwealth of Kentucky and may have such other identifying characteristics as determined by the Department of Kentucky State Police.
    (6) (a) Except provided in this subsection, the following persons may carry concealed deadly weapons on or about their person at all times and at all locations within the Commonwealth of Kentucky:
    1. An elected sheriff and full-time and part-time deputy sheriffs certified pursuant to KRS 15.380 to 15.404 when expressly authorized to do so by the unit of government employing the officer;
    2. An elected jailer and a deputy jailer who has successfully completed Department of Corrections basic training and maintains his or her current in-service training when expressly authorized to do so by the jailer; and
    3. The department head or any employee of a corrections department in any jurisdiction where the office of elected jailer has been merged with the office of sheriff who has successfully completed Department of Corrections basic training and maintains his or her current in-service training when expressly authorized to do so by the unit of government by which he or she is employed.
    (b) The provisions of this subsection shall not authorize a person specified in this subsection to carry a concealed deadly weapon in a detention facility as defined in KRS 520.010 or on the premises of a detention facility without the permission of the warden, jailer, or other person in charge of the facility, or the permission of a person authorized by the warden, jailer, or other person in charge of the detention facility to give such permission. As used in this section, "detention facility" does not include courtrooms, facilities, or other premises used by the Court of Justice or administered by the Administrative Office of the Courts.
    (7) (a) A full-time paid peace officer of a government agency from another state or territory of the United States or an elected sheriff from another territory of the United States may carry a concealed deadly weapon in Kentucky, on or off duty, if the other state or territory accords a Kentucky full-time paid peace officer and a Kentucky elected sheriff the same rights by law. If the other state or territory limits a Kentucky full-time paid peace officer or elected sheriff to carrying a concealed deadly weapon while on duty, then that same restriction shall apply to a full-time paid peace officer or elected sheriff from that state or territory.
    (b) The provisions of this subsection shall not authorize a person specified in this subsection to carry a concealed deadly weapon in a detention facility as defined in KRS 520.010 or on the premises of a detention facility without the
    Page 3 of 3
    permission of the warden, jailer, or other person in charge of the facility, or the permission of a person authorized by the warden, jailer, or other person in charge of the detention facility to give such permission. As used in this section, "detention facility" does not include courtrooms, facilities, or other premises used by the Court of Justice or administered by the Administrative Office of the Courts.
    (8) A firearm or other deadly weapon shall not be deemed concealed on or about the person if it is located in a glove compartment, regularly installed in a motor vehicle by its manufacturer, regardless of whether said compartment is locked, unlocked, or does not have a locking mechanism. No person or organization, public or private, shall prohibit a person from keeping a firearm or ammunition, or both, or other deadly weapon in a glove compartment of a vehicle in accordance with the provisions of this subsection. Any attempt by a person or organization, public or private, to violate the provisions of this subsection may be the subject of an action for appropriate relief or for damages in a Circuit Court or District Court of competent jurisdiction.
    (9) Carrying a concealed weapon is a Class A misdemeanor, unless the defendant has been previously convicted of a felony in which a deadly weapon was possessed, used, or displayed, in which case it is a Class D felony.
    Effective: June 26, 2007
    History: Amended 2007 Ky. Acts ch. 54, sec. 14, effective June 26, 2007; and ch. 85, sec. 329, effective June 26, 2007. -- Amended 2005 Ky. Acts ch. 182, sec. 17, effective March 31, 2005. -- Amended 2002 Ky. Acts ch. 368, sec. 1, effective July 15, 2002. -- Amended 1996 Ky. Acts ch. 119, sec. 3, effective October 1, 1996. -- Amended 1978 Ky. Acts ch. 342, sec. 2, effective June 17, 1978. -- Created 1974 Ky. Acts ch. 406, sec. 235, effective January 1, 1975.
    Legislative Research Commission Note (6/26/2007). This section was amended by 2007 Ky. Acts chs. 54
    Stay Safe,
    Gary Slider

    Co-Owner Handgunlaw.us

    Member Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network

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